First day on board ... of course, need help.

[GentleBen]

OK, fellas, seems like y'all really have a good forum going here. This is my first day on the forum but I have been gobbling up all I can on the main 6mmBR site.

I am a Marine combat vet of Vietnam and most of my experience is in .223,Bushmaster AR and a CZ527 bolt gun in .223 with a 7-lbs barrel from McGowen that is really sweet.)

I also have a Savage Model 12BVSS in .223 that I am in the process of converting to a 6mmBR Norma. I use a Redding T-7 press and Redding S bushing dies for my .223 and have all the requisite bells and whistles accessory equipment, etc.

But after reading several or your posts, you guys really get technical in terms of seating depths, jamming, etc. I am used to setting bullets back .020 or at the lands and going for it at 100 yards.

So I have to know if I did right. I just ordered another McGowen barrel today: 1:7 twist, Savage bull contour, chambered for Lapua brass,I don't know too much about freebores, yet, but I read one post below of concern today.)

Should I change the barrel order to a 1:8 twist? Does it make that much difference, if the majority of my shooting will be from 100 to 500 yards?

I will of course still go with Lapua brass and I already have a lot of cross-over powders and primers that I can use.

I would like to buy about 600 to 1,000 bullets in various weights. Recommendations to start, please, -- considering my intended distances of anywhere from 100 to 500 yards.

I'd ask more, but this is already too long for starters. Will be here often for a while until I catch up to speed with you guys.

Good shooting, and to whom it applies out there -- Semper Fi.

GentleBen in Baton Rouge

 

[Klong]

My opinion is either twist will work OK. 1 in 8 is probably enough twist though. 105 Berger or 107 Sierra should get you well past 500 yards. Welcome and good luck!

 

[Forum Boss]

If this is for a 6mmBR chambering, you won't need the 1:7' twist. The 1:8' should be a little more accurate and you'll probably get a bit more velocity.

I would change the order to 1:8' if you are planning on shooting the 6mmBR.

You didn't mention the bolt... but to shoot the 6mmBR you'll need to swap the bolt-head to a .308-sized bolt head. Last time I checked, Savage wouldn't sell the bolt-heads to ordinary folks, so you may have to get a gunsmith to order one.

Bullets: Before you buy a large quantity. I would get some Berger 105s, 108s, and a box of Berger 80s. Shoot the 80s at 100-200 yards and shoot the 105s/108s at longer ranges.

Honestly, if you can get those to shoot,as is likely), the only other bullet you might need is some kind of 65-80gr plastic tip for varminting.

 

[GentleBen]

Thanks, Chief

Yes it is for a 6mmBR, and I have ordered the correct size bolthead from Fred at SharpShooterSupply along with a competition recoil lug and a single-shot follower. And tomorrow,Thurs.)I will call and change the twist to 1:8,shouldn't be too late, I just ordered from McGowen today,Wed.)

The chambering from McGowen will include the .271 fit so I won't have to turn the necks with my Lapua brass. That said, I will be buying Redding S Bushing dies -- do you have an idea of what size bushing I should start with. It's kinda like which came first, the fire-form or the egg. Keeping bushing dies in mind, with the 6mmBR cartridge, do I need both a full-length die and a neck die. For my .223 reloading I use both an FL and NK Redding S bushing dies.

Will do on you bullet suggestions to start.

 

[Preacher]

Do your self a favor and order a FL busing die from Harrells in Virginia and be done with it...
They will need a few cases fired a few times to match your chamber...
Your .271 neck,MAY) need turning depending on if it's been sharpened a few times or not..
A .272 would be a better choice for a no turn.......

 

[RJinTexas]

Ben, If I was you I'd take Preacher advise in regard to the neck dia. I just came back up from my reloading room where I measured loaded rounds at the neck on Lapua brass for my three different 6mmbr barrels and all were right at .269 only two were cut with the same reamer. Lapua brass runs right at .013 thick adding that .013 x 2 + .243 = .269, that a little tight in a .271 neck IMHO. I have both a Redding NK and FL bushing die, only when the bolt closes a little stiff do I use the FL die. I use a .268 bushing with both. I'm just a prairie rat shooter and most of what I know I've learned from the informative opinions of other 6br members. In testing I've found them to mostly be dead right.
Welcome
RJ

 

[GentleBen]

Chief and Preacher,

Thanks for input.

Just spoke with McGowen and changed my order to a 1:8 twist, 28-inch barrel. He said their reamer came straight from Pacific Tool and is set up for the standard Lapua chamber ... with a .271 neck. Which bushing would you recommend, or should I let Harrel's decide that.

Any idea who might have Lapua brass in 6mmBR right now? I am going to order 60 rounds of loaded Lapua ammo from Midway, shoot it to fireform and break in the barrel and then have at least 60 pieces of Lapua to reload. Expensive route, but it is a work around for now.

Will call Harrel's when the time comes.

 

[GentleBen]

If I order a custom fitted Full Length die from Harrell's, will I still need a dedicated neck die from some other company?

I am planning to buy a Redding competition seater die to go with the Harrell's die. I have one for my .223s and it works great. Also, can the custom 'Wilson' seater die be used in a threaded press,I have a T-7) or is it for arbor presses only?

 

[tightneck]

If I order a custom fitted Full Length die from Harrell's, will I still need a dedicated neck die from some other company?

I am planning to buy a Redding competition seater die to go with the Harrell's die. I have one for my .223s and it works great. Also, can the custom 'Wilson' seater die be used in a threaded press,I have a T-7) or is it for arbor presses only?

The Harrell's die is the only sizer you will need. As for bushings, a .266, .267 and .268 will allow you to play with different neck tensions, but If you opt for only 1, I would go with the .267'. Most 6BR brass that I have miked with VLD bullets measure's about .2695'. Wilson seaters are not threaded and cannot be used with a threaded press.

 

[GentleBen]

So, how do you get past the 'gotcha', as you put it, of having to neck size periodically, if you go with just the Harrell's FL die. Does the FL die do some of the neck sizing for you?

 

[js223]

GentleBen
I noticed you have a BVSS, and said you ordered a Bull contour. The Bull contour would be the 1' barrel like a LRPV or a 12F- Class. I believe your BVSS came with a Varmint contour,around .8'). Also, there are 2 thread sizes for the Savage, and the BVSS should be the small shank. Large shank would be an LRPV, Target Action, 12F or Some Magnums. Just want to make sure you get the right barrel, you can obviously open up the channel in your stock for the Bull barrel, but if it's a large shank then that's not so simple to fix.

 

[GentleBen]

Thanks all for the input, I'm trying to catalog all this in my mind, but having loaded for accuracy with a .223 for sometime now, I at least have an idea of where you all are going. The concepts are not different, but the measurements definitely are.

I don't think I will fool with the Wilson seater. I am happy with my Redding .223 competition seater. I'll pair it up with new one for 6mmBR.

As for the BVSS stock, I fibbed a bit for argument sake. I first bought a .223 Model 12FVSS,black plastic stock) and quickly replaced it with a heavy laminated thumbhole stock from E. Arthur Brown,EABCO). I then had my gunsmith bed it, at which time he took up a little out of the front of the stock to allow for the barrel,0.820 at the crown but mostly 1 to 1.10 inch through the forward part of the stock).

Before ordering my new barrel,straight bull 1.00 inch at crown), I examined my thumbhole laminate again and I estimate just a little more will have to come off, more or less sanding than cutting, without it affecting flex and such. Right now my .223 varmint barrel has considerable free float play.

I also checked with SSS,a preferred Savage smith-type) before ordering my new bolthead to make sure that the barrel on this model was a 'standard thread' and not a large threat. They assured me it was the standard, or smaller, thread. I also ordered their custom recoil lug and single-shot follower.

SSS previously sold me one of their Savage triggers to replace my Accu-Trigger and it is very nice and should suit me for now.

 

[Forum Boss]

Lynn wrote:

'I have the Wilson inline seater with the micrometer top and it never gets used.I prefer the Redding hands down.'

I disagree. I have a micro-top 6BR seaters from Redding, Forster, and RCBS. I also have a Wilson stainless micro-top seater.

I love the Wilson and by my measurements, it produces straighter and more accurate ammo. With the Wilson, I can control the base to ogive measurement on loaded roads to very close to 0.0015',one and a half thousandths). I could not do that with any of the screw-in dies.

I like the fact that I can use the Wilson pretty much anywhere and I'm not limited to a bolt-in press.

Every person has their preferences, but for me, once I got the Wilson, the other dies went in the drawer. There is ONE downside to the Wilson. The fit on the 6BR brass can be so tight that you get a vacuum fit on the brass. You can use a wood popsicle stick or the edge of a spoon to pop the cases out if you have this issue.

Re the circle from the seater stem. I do NOT get this with my Wilson. I do get that on some bullets with the Redding seater. The fix is to polish the inside of the seater stem a bit. What you can do is put a bullet in an electric drill, coat it with some flitz, and work it up the inside of the seater stem.

 

[GentleBen]

By the way, I debated buying the stock Savage LRPV in 6mmBR but it would have cost me at least $800 plus shipping and FFL dealer costs, which would have brought it to just above $850 if not more.

But I read up on it on this site and realized I could get a better,hopefully) rifle by customizing it. Just needed a little more patience and advice. So far:

-- McGowen 28' 1:8 bull barrel -- $276 with shipping directly to me.
-- SSS bolthead, new recoil lug, single-shot follower -- $99.50 shipped.
-- Go and No-Go Gages from PTG -- $59 shipped
-- Gunsmith setup fee -- Either cheeseburger and malt or I'll give him the PTG gages.

Total: $434.50 and what could be a considerably better rifle. The Savage .223 that I am converting has less than 300 rounds through it, so the action is like new.

The incidental investments such as brass, bullets, dies, etc. would have to have been bought anyway.

 

[GentleBen]

Well, Chief, now you've given me something else to consider in seater gear: 'to Wilson, or not to Wilson.'

Would you need their arbor press as well? Sinclair sells them, right?

OK, you entrepreneurs out there, talk to a gunsmith/toolmaker and devise a hybrid, side-by-side type arbor/threaded press. Then you can use the Harrell's FL sizer die next to the Wilson seater die without having to buy two different presses.

 

[GentleBen]

Gunamonth ... they already have one? Duhh.

Dang, missed it by that much ... actually about 20 years, I imagine.

 

[js223]

GentleBen
Do you mean that you ordered a small shank, Bull contour barrel? If that's the case, it should work with only modification to the stock.

 

[GentleBen]

JS223

Yes.

The original that I bought, a Mod. 12FVSS varmint contour,with fiberglass stock), has a standard/small thread or shank. I confirmed this with SSS. I also saw the picture of the differences in the Savage threads -- a 1/8th inch stepdown identifies the large or coarse threaded barrels. But my barrel looked exactly like the standard and did not have anything looking like the step down.

When I ordered the barrel from McGowen, they asked what type of thread did my rifle have, I old them what SSS had said, a standard shank, which means small threads. McGowen then took my order for a straight 1-inch bull without hesitation.

I am thinking that I am OK and will only need a little stock fitting, if any.