First attempt
- Thread starter Totosdad
- Start date
Why would you load 100 rounds if you don't know if it shoots small groups? If you shot a 5 shot group and it's a big group what do you do with the other 90 rounds? Iwould shoot a ladder test or shot 5 shot groups with powder charges in .3 gr increments.
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
It’s a good feeling to reload a bunch of ammo but I learned over time that testing saves a lot of bullets and powder.
I don’t have my books in front of me to see where your load is. Each rifle will handle a load a little differently, which is why we work up in small increments.
I assume that you’re loading for the 223? I tried various charges of Varmint behind a bunch of different bullets in my 223s and didn’t have much luck. H335, Blc2 and Varget performed better. BLc2 worked great with 35 and 40 grain bullets.
I don’t have my books in front of me to see where your load is. Each rifle will handle a load a little differently, which is why we work up in small increments.
I assume that you’re loading for the 223? I tried various charges of Varmint behind a bunch of different bullets in my 223s and didn’t have much luck. H335, Blc2 and Varget performed better. BLc2 worked great with 35 and 40 grain bullets.
Bad,bad,bad ! That powder shows a max of 27.9 which i round off to 28 . when you load that low it is bad for accuracy 99% of the time. I would dissasemble 90 of them and go up-up-up. Most often accuracy occurs at or near max. Ps. Bad-bad is a humorous expression, not meant in a cruel way. No insulted intended just comeradery.
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I wouldn't say bad bad bad by any means. Were mistakes made? Maybe, maybe not. I jump into things about the same way as you may. There is no dipping your toes in the water, just cannonball straight in.
I bought an 8 pound jug of varmint powder back in the 2012 scare, still have probably half of it. It isn't bad, but it isn't great with anything. It'll be a good learning experience for your for sure.
Congrats on the first steps of reloading. What are you shooting these through? What are you capable of as a shooter? Did you load this to mag dump in an AR? Is this for field work?
So you used up 4 dollars in primers, a third of a pound of powder, and about 20 bucks in bullets, big deal. Making first loads is a tremendous accomplishment, and I guarantee you will smile when they all go bang. It's no different then buying a 100 pack of federal bulk pack at twice the cost, and with even less accuracy.
You'll learn along the way not to do such big batches until you've tested them. I know this is an extreme accuracy forum but I commend you for stepping out of your comfort zone and doing something new and hopefully safely.
You'll learn lots and have a life long passion if you stick with it. You can always PM if you'd like some tips without too harsh of criticism.
Shoot straight.
SHM
I bought an 8 pound jug of varmint powder back in the 2012 scare, still have probably half of it. It isn't bad, but it isn't great with anything. It'll be a good learning experience for your for sure.
Congrats on the first steps of reloading. What are you shooting these through? What are you capable of as a shooter? Did you load this to mag dump in an AR? Is this for field work?
So you used up 4 dollars in primers, a third of a pound of powder, and about 20 bucks in bullets, big deal. Making first loads is a tremendous accomplishment, and I guarantee you will smile when they all go bang. It's no different then buying a 100 pack of federal bulk pack at twice the cost, and with even less accuracy.
You'll learn along the way not to do such big batches until you've tested them. I know this is an extreme accuracy forum but I commend you for stepping out of your comfort zone and doing something new and hopefully safely.
You'll learn lots and have a life long passion if you stick with it. You can always PM if you'd like some tips without too harsh of criticism.
Shoot straight.
SHM
Maybe start in 1/2 grain increments on the powder to see what the rifle likes and shoot 3 shot groups. The fine tune it at 2/10 grain with 5 shot groups. If something shoots nice groups confirm is with several shots, 8-10. Then work on the seating depth in .005" increments. As little as .005" can make a noticeable difference in your groups.
Congratulations! The first batch is a big step.
I drive myself nuts deciding which test loads, how many....on and on.
Which bullets, powder, how much.
You are under max load by website I found. Not sure what the minimum allowed, twist coal etc.
There is so much to experience doing your first loads.
Keep going, shoot em up, see what they do.
Save half for another barrel twist later.
Careful is king of survival.
Welcome to the "done that" side!
I drive myself nuts deciding which test loads, how many....on and on.Which bullets, powder, how much.
You are under max load by website I found. Not sure what the minimum allowed, twist coal etc.
There is so much to experience doing your first loads.
Keep going, shoot em up, see what they do.
Save half for another barrel twist later.
Careful is king of survival.
Welcome to the "done that" side!
bozo699
Gold $$ Contributor
Totosdad,
Welcome to the forum and to the world of shooting!......
Most of the guys on here are great to deal with and ask questions.
I remember when I first started I couldn’t wait and did about like you and it probably was the wrong way to go about it but ya gotta start somewhere.I see nothing wrong with your loads there light but still within limits so they should be safe, at least your not stretching the limits of brass loosening up primer pockets and worse!.....remember no question is a dumb question and not many of us will give you any crap for a valid question! There are those that do but ignore them and if there to mean our forum boss and moderators will put a end to it rather quickly! If you feel to silly to ask a question you can pm most any of us and then your questions are in private but I encourage you to read lots of old threads they cover just about anything you can type in the search bar. I know for sure you can ask me anything anytime and if I don’t know I’ll find out for ya but you will get a answer. Now read read read and stop once in a while to shoot and smile!.....Good luck
Wayne
Ccrider
Gold $$ Contributor
Welcome. You will find that there are some great guys on this site that talk the talk and walk the walk. Don’t get your panties in a wad if sometimes sine come off as seeming a bit harsh or critical. That’s one of the downsides of communicating by social media. Also, it’s all a part of learning. My dad use to say if you are hungry and someone gives you an apple with a rotten spot on it, eat the good and throw the rotten part away. Same hear, and it will not be too hard to figure it where the rotten part is. Just ask if you are not sure.
I bought loading equipment and it sit for years before I tried to use it. I know how hard it can be to get started.
Shoot some of them. If they shoot decent, shoot them all working on your gun handling skills. If they don’t, you can adjust the seating depth in if you have room too and see if that helps or hurts. Good info to have. Take good notes on all you do.
After you shoot twenty or thirty of them, you can use those cases to reload/work up a load and use the loaded ones to foul until you shoot them all.
Or, by a “grip and pull” and pull them if they don’t shoot. This is the quickest most efficient bullet puller I have found. You will not regret the purchase. After you pull the bullets, depending on the type of sizing die you are using, you can screw the depriming stem out of the die, resize the brass and you are ready to load again. You may want to use a brush or q’tip to clean the necks.
Be safe. Have fun. Ask if you don’t know and someone on this site will help you out.
I bought loading equipment and it sit for years before I tried to use it. I know how hard it can be to get started.
Shoot some of them. If they shoot decent, shoot them all working on your gun handling skills. If they don’t, you can adjust the seating depth in if you have room too and see if that helps or hurts. Good info to have. Take good notes on all you do.
After you shoot twenty or thirty of them, you can use those cases to reload/work up a load and use the loaded ones to foul until you shoot them all.
Or, by a “grip and pull” and pull them if they don’t shoot. This is the quickest most efficient bullet puller I have found. You will not regret the purchase. After you pull the bullets, depending on the type of sizing die you are using, you can screw the depriming stem out of the die, resize the brass and you are ready to load again. You may want to use a brush or q’tip to clean the necks.
Be safe. Have fun. Ask if you don’t know and someone on this site will help you out.
divingin
Gold $$ Contributor
Most people advise reloaders approaching a new load to look at max, drop 10% for safety, and work up from there. Which is essentially what the OP did, except for the work up part.
Personally, I would have loaded maybe 10 or 15 at that charge, and work up in increments looking for an accurate combo, but all the OP has done is set himself up for a very thorough test at his starting charge. No big deal IMO.
Personally, I would have loaded maybe 10 or 15 at that charge, and work up in increments looking for an accurate combo, but all the OP has done is set himself up for a very thorough test at his starting charge. No big deal IMO.
I reload more rounds for testing than many reloaders, but never 100 rounds, and I don't care to pull/disassemble 90 when the load doesn't work out. I want to get a better idea of how the load works than my marksmanship, so a dozen rounds in my handguns and maybe 10-12 for my rifles will give me a good idea of how the load preforms. Also OAL and/or "distance to the lands" is way down on my list for accuracy load work ups, often the last item. I normally start with bullet manufacturer's recommended OAL/seating depth, and minimum starting loads (there's a reason starting loads are listed, right?) and work with powder, bullets, primer changes to get a good accurate round (my best load for my Ruger 308 is with LC brass and Hornady 155 gr. bullets loaded to Hornady specs. which gives me 7/8" groups)
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Welcome.
Advice-
When testing, you will generally not need more than ten rounds of each load.
Test in the same weather conditions and distance.
Make sure your cases are the same cases, fired more or less the same number of times, not mix brass, same neck tension and seating depth.
Keep records of what you do, save targets for later reference. I use a very thick spiral notebook, index cards with dates stapled therein noting, weather conditions, powder, brass, bullets, charge weight, depth to ogive, outside diameter before and after loading. Don't mix primers. Don't cut corners, and Never, Never, Never adjust more than one thing at a time, i.e. powder charge AND neck tension in the same test, because you never will know which is giving you tighter groups or wider groups. Be aware that twist rate has a good sized influence on bullet performance and accuracy. All of these are listed as my personal "I should have asked first" list.
Don't afraid to ask questions. We have all been where you are at one time (or right now) or another.
Most importantly, have fun.
Advice-
When testing, you will generally not need more than ten rounds of each load.
Test in the same weather conditions and distance.
Make sure your cases are the same cases, fired more or less the same number of times, not mix brass, same neck tension and seating depth.
Keep records of what you do, save targets for later reference. I use a very thick spiral notebook, index cards with dates stapled therein noting, weather conditions, powder, brass, bullets, charge weight, depth to ogive, outside diameter before and after loading. Don't mix primers. Don't cut corners, and Never, Never, Never adjust more than one thing at a time, i.e. powder charge AND neck tension in the same test, because you never will know which is giving you tighter groups or wider groups. Be aware that twist rate has a good sized influence on bullet performance and accuracy. All of these are listed as my personal "I should have asked first" list.
Don't afraid to ask questions. We have all been where you are at one time (or right now) or another.
Most importantly, have fun.
D-4297
Gold $$ Contributor
Not having a large amount of knowledge of the cartridge , I won't speculate on whether your load is good or bad . But those more in the know say it's on the light side , so bang away . Enjoy shooting your first loads . Seems to me ; that setting the bullet .020 deep can only assist getting better performance from the lighter load . F class shooters load at or above the max , and seat bullets for best accuracy , often beyond .020 deep from "Book" setting . Be careful and stay below max , while not shoving the bullet "TOO" deep . The good people on here will be happy to offer advice and guidance when ask . My suggestion would be to go to a 75% of max load , and adjust it up or down , from there . Setting your COAL at Magazine or Book length .
You don't mention what type of shooting you'll be doing, varmint, target, plinking or steel. Different loads for different purposes.
You can find some really accurate loads towards the bottom end of the recommended charges. Lighter charges produce milder shock wave impulses, and produce less barrel whip. Timing the bullet exit from the muzzle when the barrel is moving the least amount is the goal for accurate and consistent impacts, as is obtaining the best velocity for your intended purpose. The two tend to oppose each other.
You might get lucky and hit a good node on your first try. But if not, as others have recommended, load 3 or 4 in .3 grain increments. Write on the cartridge with a sharpie the load number and keep good records while loading and especially shooting. Mark your targets with load information. I catalog my loads using year, month, day, and load variant. If I load today, the load number would be 200211-X and written on the side of the cartridges. If I made 8 different load variants in say .3 gr increments, my dash numbers would be 1 through 8 with the letter S for sighters. 200211-S, 200211-1, 200211-2, etc. I use a spiral notebook for each rifle based upon receiver number and barrel chambering.
This numbering system allows use of a spreadsheet for record keeping, and you always know when you created that load. I keep my targets in a large plastic box, so I can always go back and look at load workup and re-evaluate if necessary.
Good luck, and welcome to Accurate Shooter land of OZ.
You can find some really accurate loads towards the bottom end of the recommended charges. Lighter charges produce milder shock wave impulses, and produce less barrel whip. Timing the bullet exit from the muzzle when the barrel is moving the least amount is the goal for accurate and consistent impacts, as is obtaining the best velocity for your intended purpose. The two tend to oppose each other.
You might get lucky and hit a good node on your first try. But if not, as others have recommended, load 3 or 4 in .3 grain increments. Write on the cartridge with a sharpie the load number and keep good records while loading and especially shooting. Mark your targets with load information. I catalog my loads using year, month, day, and load variant. If I load today, the load number would be 200211-X and written on the side of the cartridges. If I made 8 different load variants in say .3 gr increments, my dash numbers would be 1 through 8 with the letter S for sighters. 200211-S, 200211-1, 200211-2, etc. I use a spiral notebook for each rifle based upon receiver number and barrel chambering.
This numbering system allows use of a spreadsheet for record keeping, and you always know when you created that load. I keep my targets in a large plastic box, so I can always go back and look at load workup and re-evaluate if necessary.
Good luck, and welcome to Accurate Shooter land of OZ.
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