educate me, free recoil vs hold

[ktoney]

Guys looking for some input in shooting from SEB NEO and Protekor 14.5 BAG
rifle is 6.5x47
broughton 5c 7.9contour
shehane MBR
NightforceBR 12-42
4oz match trigger

only been to range once with rifle, no load work yet
I know br guys prefer free recoil
my assumption is i have correct gear to do this based on postings here by others as to what is suitable for free recoil.
Rifle thus torqs to right under recoil instead of straight back so my sight picture has to be rebuilt after each shot
SEB NEO guys can this be tweaked out via pinch plates on front bags?
how do i identify issue and correct it
Would i be better served with a edgewood gaterbag shooting free recoil?
thinking i,m going to have to drag wife to range to vid me shooting
ideas suggestions most welcome

 

[bighorn06]

I'm not the one to get advice from, but I have and am still at the same place as you. I have a 7mm SAUM and never thought it recoiled bad. I added a brake and that helped. I added more heavy sand to my Minigator since it was loose and that helped a lot. I put an add on here looking to go with less barrel twist to reduce torque and this is the advice I got. He said I needed to get more shooting time and concentrate on getting the gun to slide in the bags better. This is some thing that I have read a lot and been told how important it was but I had let it go thinking I could worry about that later. It will get my full attention now. Happy shooting, Mike

 

[RJinTexas]

Toney, When I purchased my new NEO I also bought one of his big rear bags and all my rifles recoil straight back they did the same when on my Protektor Doctor bag as it I didn't get the SEB bag filled until after the first couple tips to the range, being I was in a big hurry to test the new rest. My 284 Win does knok me off the scope but none of my other rifles do and I always shoot free recoil. I'm just getting started shooting VFS have real knowledge or experience in the do's & don't on setting up a rest to get the most out of it. I simply make sure the rest is level and the rear bag is properly in line and start banging away. All my rifles do slide the bag very well. May I to will learn something her from the more knowledgeable shooters.

RJ

 

[sdeal5]

Hey, RJ. Just got one the SEB bigfoot rears, also. Did you have trouble getting the ears to fill out all the way, front part, and rear part of each ear? Seems to work ok, but looks weird compared to protector or edgewood----Maybe I"m doing something wrong? Also, am wanting to try a SEB NEO but the long wait is a killer. Do you happen to know of anyone wanting to sell one? Scott

 

[RJinTexas]

Scott, I also had a difficult time filling the ears on my Big Foot, In fact I think they may still be a little under inflated but all my rifle stocks seem to ride the bag better the any other bag I've tried. I liked my Doctor bag but the the height of the Big Foot seems to be a better fit. I can't amagine anyone looking to sell a NEO unless they've fell on hard times. I was number 17 on the waiting list and have had mine for a few months, I still smile every time I have the opportunity to use it. I'm sure I'll have mine when they put my old butt in a hole in the ground.

RJ

 

[sdeal5]

Thanks, RJ. I missed a good chance at a neo about a week ago on another classified site. It certainly did not last long at all, and I didn"t see it in time. Thanks for the input on the bigfoot. I tried it with one of my short range br rifles today, and it seemed to do fine. Time permitting, I"ll try it with my long range .284 tomorrow with the flatter bottom buttstock. It will probably be fine, the ears just don"t fill out as much as I"ve always been used to with the other brands. By the way, did it take you the full 6 mos. to get your neo? Scott

 

[queen_stick]

I don't think the brand of the rest will make a difference, as long as it's a quality rest. (insert favorite brand here). Think of it as a component to your 'accuracy system.' My 6BR will not group well with free recoil, but if I simply put my hand on the front of the stock in the same position you would if you were shooting offhand, and the group tightens up... a lot. I wouldn't believe it if I didn't see it for my self. It's worth noting, that the difference wasn't noticeable at 100 or 300 yards. Only when I got out to the 600yd and 1K range, is when my hold made a BIG difference.

The bottom line is, you have to figure out what the gun likes. Find a decent load that groups consistently, then change your hold and see how it effects the group.

 

[artbosco]

Guys looking for some input in shooting from SEB NEO and Protekor 14.5 BAG. ... ideas suggestions most welcome.

Here's a great look at free recoil. Watch carefully. Only the index finger touches the trigger. The rifle's butt is about 1/2" away from the shoulder. Once set up, you keep the head up and your eyes on your wind flags for the condition you want to shoot. Stock tape on the lower edges of the stock, fore and aft, facilitate smooth free recoil.

This gentle from Iceland, set a 10-shot 200 yard world record back in the mid 80's, at Kelbly's range in Ohio,

Enjoy: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9194636798795391569#

 

[LHSmith]

Shooting "heads-up" is not a technique I would suggest for those just getting into the game. For it to be successful demands a rest set-up that one has total confidence in and mastery of bench manners....most neophytes are a long ways from this. I practice it occasionally, and have seen a competitor or two win a match this way.....but they never shoot "heads up" all the time.
Until you get to the point where you are consistent in your form , same butt spacing, the SAME point IN your shoulder......(not your biceps), cheek not touching stock, gun riding bags consistently, returning gun to same battery position, etc, etc., you're nose will probably get tapped by the scope a few times. You must be extremely consistent in your form for it to work....provided your gun likes to be driven that way.

 

[artbosco]

Shooting free recoil in my opinion, is the only way to shoot competitively and when practicing for competition. I saw the benefit very early on when bullets started going through the same hole. Hanging all over a rifle can introduce all kinds of movement on target. It's almost next to impossible to repeat body movements consistently over long periods of time.

About 90% of all short range [100 to 300 yards] Benchrest shooters shoot this style. It's all I ever use with my 6PPC and 30BR. Yes, there's a definite rest set up and a stock design required for this style of shooting in addition to a good set of wind flags and a custom built rifle.

It is NOT for use with a hunting rifle or someone who might lack confidence in his or her equipment, the ability to read flags, their reloads, or a hands-off style of shooting.

 

[4xforfun]

My first year in 1K BR I shot the same gun in both LG and HG. I shot it FR in the LG class with the break, and held it in the HG class without the break installed.

Oh ya...caliber....300 WBY!!!!

As I got more into it over the last couple of years I started shooting faster, so I swithched to holding the gun in both classes.

I now shoot the HG FR, but my HG is 80 pounds.

 

[artbosco]

I now shoot the HG FR, but my HG is 80 pounds.

Any hernias? Must take a wheelbarrow to move that thing around.

 

[alf]

Shooting free recoil in my opinion, is the only way to shoot competitively

You can't paint all competition shooting with the same brush.

 

[Taildrag15X]

F-Class Per the NRA Rulebook says that the Rifle must be fired from the shoulder........NO FREE RECOIL HERE.

 

[Aussie_bob]

Like others have said see what your rifle likes and what suits you and have a combination of the two.
Be very carefull when adjusting the pinch plates on front rest you do not want them tight just creats more drag and also if your rifle can not be lifted directly up out of the front bag without restriction you could face disqualification. I have found with my 30BR i have to hold the front but in my Scoville stocked Panda 6PPC it free recoils just fine.
If you have to hold just try to be consistant in everything each shot.

 

[artbosco]

Shooting free recoil, in my opinion, is the only way to shoot competitively

You can't paint all competition shooting with the same brush.

You're absolutely correct. That's why the caveat or forewarning above: "in my opinion", which means ... it's only my personal thought.

 

[Steve Blair]

You're absolutely correct. That's why the caveat or forewarning above: "in my opinion", which means ... it's only my personal thought.

It would help, if the advice given relates to a specific shooting discipline, to state what that is. Some less experienced readers might not recognize that you are a point-blank BR shooter. That which is fine advice for 200 yard BR or Score might not be good at all for 600 or 1000 yard BR or F-Class competition. Just a thought.

 

[artbosco]

You're absolutely correct. That's why the caveat or forewarning above: "in my opinion", which means ... it's only my personal thought.

It would help, if the advice given relates to a specific shooting discipline, to state what that is. Some less experienced readers might not recognize that you are a point-blank BR shooter. That which is fine advice for 200 yard BR or Score might not be good at all for 600 or 1000 yard BR or F-Class competition. Just a thought.

Your point is well taken. However, I thought I did that in the second paragraph, of my second response from the top. The post at 09:45 PM, on 02/28/11

 

[Forum Boss]

About 90% of all short range [100 to 300 yards] Benchrest shooters shoot this style. It's all I ever use with my 6PPC and 30BR.

It is NOT for use with a hunting rifle or someone who might lack confidence in his or her equipment, the ability to read flags, their reloads, or a hands-off style of shooting.

If one defines true "free recoil" as just touching the trigger (and absolutely nothing else on the gun), or maybe pinching the trigger and trigger guard, I think that 90% figure is exaggerated. Many successful 30BR shooters grip and/or shoulder the gun. And many PPC shooters use a variety of holds from a thumb draped behind the tang to a hard grip while squeezing the bags. A shooter should not be afraid to experiment with different styles. Pure free recoil requires a superb rest set up. Other styles of shooting may yield better results -- certainly with anything less than a full bench-rest rig. Even in rimfire BR, a signficant percentage (if not the majority) of the best shooters put their hand on the stock. It helps with vibration damping.

How the Legend Shoots
Here is video of Tony Boyer shooting at the Shamrock. He is using pretty much a free recoil technique, but he does index his right hand along the side of the stock. Note how well the gun stays in the bags on recoil. There is no twist or hop -- TB has a well-balanced gun.

Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sg4oLE1MmZc

 

[tripcrow]

And it sure looks like the flat of his stock is riding on the stitches of the rear bag. Or does he have a big strip of Velcro over them?