ear protection
- Thread starter skeetlee
- Start date
I use offset scope rings on all my rifles. I barrowed a set, such as the set I ordered a couple weeks ago at a benchrest match in st Louis. I left mine at home. No problem what so ever with stock interference. After uses my buddies set, I realized how lousy mine really are. Thus another reason I started looking for a better set. Ill be just fine. That I am sure!!! Lee
O.K. So you don't like ear plugs. I don't either, but I want to preserve what little hearing I have left.
The different ratings you see on hearing protection are probably simply dB as in 30 dB sound reduction. and the other term is NRR as in 30 dB NRR.
You won't see a fixed dB reduction much as the actual reduction is a function of how well the muffs fit your head and how careful you put them on.
The NRR is pretty much a standard now. NRR is an OSHA standard and what it is, is a combination of best reduction minus the statistical degradation in reduction based on poor fit or installation. For example, yellow foamies can reduce noise about 38-40 dB ( the upper limit is built in to your skull and that is the sound transmission of the mastoid bone). But, they can be inserted in so many wrong ways you would be amazed! So, If you were the manufacturer, you may measure 39 dB reduction best case, but you also found that of all the wrong ways folks could put them in, you got a statistical reduction of 11 dB. Therefore, you rate the plugs at 28 dB NRR.
The best you can do is find a pair of muffs that are a very good fit to the skull. This will probably be the ones with the highest NRR and will most likely be the biggest, most intrusive and most costly. The manufacturer will probably tell you what is the best case reduction and how to get that. As to the cost of hearing protection (my blast protectors cost $350-$450), what did you just pay for that N-F COMP???? And your ears aren't as valuable as that scope?
Unfortunately, there is no easy solution if you can't stand insert ear plugs, but they will give you the best protection. And, I would recommend either yellow foamies that you learn to insert correctly or more expensive hearing aid dispenser fitted solid plugs that extend past the second bend in the ear canal. This is important for two reasons, as past the second bend gets the plug into the boney region of the canal and not just the cartilaginous region which 1. gives best protection and 2. cuts down occlusion effect which makes your own voice sound like you are talking into a 55 gallon drum.
The different ratings you see on hearing protection are probably simply dB as in 30 dB sound reduction. and the other term is NRR as in 30 dB NRR.
You won't see a fixed dB reduction much as the actual reduction is a function of how well the muffs fit your head and how careful you put them on.
The NRR is pretty much a standard now. NRR is an OSHA standard and what it is, is a combination of best reduction minus the statistical degradation in reduction based on poor fit or installation. For example, yellow foamies can reduce noise about 38-40 dB ( the upper limit is built in to your skull and that is the sound transmission of the mastoid bone). But, they can be inserted in so many wrong ways you would be amazed! So, If you were the manufacturer, you may measure 39 dB reduction best case, but you also found that of all the wrong ways folks could put them in, you got a statistical reduction of 11 dB. Therefore, you rate the plugs at 28 dB NRR.
The best you can do is find a pair of muffs that are a very good fit to the skull. This will probably be the ones with the highest NRR and will most likely be the biggest, most intrusive and most costly. The manufacturer will probably tell you what is the best case reduction and how to get that. As to the cost of hearing protection (my blast protectors cost $350-$450), what did you just pay for that N-F COMP???? And your ears aren't as valuable as that scope?
Unfortunately, there is no easy solution if you can't stand insert ear plugs, but they will give you the best protection. And, I would recommend either yellow foamies that you learn to insert correctly or more expensive hearing aid dispenser fitted solid plugs that extend past the second bend in the ear canal. This is important for two reasons, as past the second bend gets the plug into the boney region of the canal and not just the cartilaginous region which 1. gives best protection and 2. cuts down occlusion effect which makes your own voice sound like you are talking into a 55 gallon drum.
Take care of that hearing LEE!
I wear hearing aids in both ears. I have no hearing in my left ear, and a 80% loss in the right. I wear a cross aid in my deaf ear. It helps when someone is talking to me from that side. When I shoot, I wear the MAX ear plugs. These are the same plugs we wear in the turbine buildings at nuke plants. Once you lose your hearing, it's never coming back. Preserve it LEE.
Rich
I wear hearing aids in both ears. I have no hearing in my left ear, and a 80% loss in the right. I wear a cross aid in my deaf ear. It helps when someone is talking to me from that side. When I shoot, I wear the MAX ear plugs. These are the same plugs we wear in the turbine buildings at nuke plants. Once you lose your hearing, it's never coming back. Preserve it LEE.
Rich
Forum Boss
Administrator
When you guys are shopping for ear plugs to wear under muffs, don't assume they are all the same. The "straight-cut" foamies are hard to insert and can be uncomfortable.
The bell-shaped Howard Leight MAX ear plugs are the best I have used, and I have probably tried 25 different varieties. They go in easily, are washable, hold their shape after many uses, and have a 33 NRR. I am not aware of any plugs that have a better NRR (Noise Reduction Rating).
MORE: http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2013/06/recommended-gear-howard-leight-max-1-nrr-33-ear-plugs/
The bell-shaped Howard Leight MAX ear plugs are the best I have used, and I have probably tried 25 different varieties. They go in easily, are washable, hold their shape after many uses, and have a 33 NRR. I am not aware of any plugs that have a better NRR (Noise Reduction Rating).
MORE: http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2013/06/recommended-gear-howard-leight-max-1-nrr-33-ear-plugs/
Jay Christopherson
Not An Admin
FWIW, I use these under my shotgun style Pro Ears:
The work *great* and are very comfortable since they don't insert into the ear canal. They also double as an excellent anti-snoring device when you are sharing a room with another shooter on match trips...
The work *great* and are very comfortable since they don't insert into the ear canal. They also double as an excellent anti-snoring device when you are sharing a room with another shooter on match trips...
AGAIN!!
NRR does NOT indicate the true maximum protection! It only indicates the best average protection when incorrectly installed!
Find out the best attenuation and learn to insert them correctly. Those soft plugs with a 33 dB NRR do NOT have the best maximum protection.
Correctly inserted plugs ( not the silly putty kind!) work without the muffs to get max protection.
Muff plus plugs are no better then correctly inserted plugs.
HELP STAMP OUT ANECDOTAL EVIDENCE!!
NRR does NOT indicate the true maximum protection! It only indicates the best average protection when incorrectly installed!
Find out the best attenuation and learn to insert them correctly. Those soft plugs with a 33 dB NRR do NOT have the best maximum protection.
Correctly inserted plugs ( not the silly putty kind!) work without the muffs to get max protection.
Muff plus plugs are no better then correctly inserted plugs.
HELP STAMP OUT ANECDOTAL EVIDENCE!!
Not sure what impression I have made for anyone to think I don't care about my hearing. I do care a great deal. Thus the reason for the post. I bought the best non electrical ear muffs I could find. What more can I really do??? I cant wear plugs, I just cant. I suffer from migraine headacks, that I wouldn't wish upon anyone. Ear plugs sometimes, or have in the past, set them in motion.
Even My fitted molded ear plugs don't block as much noise as my shot gunner type muffs. My shot gunner muffs aren't as good as the set my buddy let me use. Another reason I bought a better set. thanks for the help fellas I appreciate it. Lee
Even My fitted molded ear plugs don't block as much noise as my shot gunner type muffs. My shot gunner muffs aren't as good as the set my buddy let me use. Another reason I bought a better set. thanks for the help fellas I appreciate it. Lee
Lee,
If your "fitted" plugs came from a gun show and were done on the spot, that was not the fitted I was talking about. Properly fitted plugs are made by carefully taking an ear impression after inserting an Oto Block to limit how far down the canal the impression material goes. A good dispenser can put that block past the second bend for a very good seal and occlusion effect reduction. You will know it is beyond the second bend as the "tickle" will make you cough! Then, the impression is sent to a mold manufacturing lab and they will use one of a selection of mold materials that are soft or harder and are anti-allergic. Then you will have a comfortable quiet ear plug that you will be able to wear for extended periods without discomfort.
If your "fitted" plugs came from a gun show and were done on the spot, that was not the fitted I was talking about. Properly fitted plugs are made by carefully taking an ear impression after inserting an Oto Block to limit how far down the canal the impression material goes. A good dispenser can put that block past the second bend for a very good seal and occlusion effect reduction. You will know it is beyond the second bend as the "tickle" will make you cough! Then, the impression is sent to a mold manufacturing lab and they will use one of a selection of mold materials that are soft or harder and are anti-allergic. Then you will have a comfortable quiet ear plug that you will be able to wear for extended periods without discomfort.
Most plugs also caused me to have headaches until I found the blue silicon type. Great suppression and no headache. Problem is that I lost them for a while and have not been able to locate replacements.
Pulled a shirt out of the closet the other day and that set was in the pocket. Yay!
Muffs over these are great.
Still can't wait for my Form 4s to clear...
Pulled a shirt out of the closet the other day and that set was in the pocket. Yay!
Muffs over these are great.
Still can't wait for my Form 4s to clear...
Forum Boss
Administrator
Norm says:
Norm knows a lot about this. However, I still stand by my recommendation of the Leight max with the 33 NRR. I truly have tried 20 or more types of earplugs. And yes I have tried the yellow foamies (most recently while getting an MRI a couple weeks ago). I have tried the silicon, the flanged plugs. The Max are extremely comfortable, relatively easy to insert correctly, and easy to extract. They have a denser finish, so they clean up easily. They spring back into shape better than the yellow foamies.
Between shooting and riding a motorcycle on the highway, I wear plugs probably 6 days a week. I always carry a few pairs of the MAX with me, while other brands are gathering dust.
You should certainly try the yellow "straight-cut" foamies and see what you think, make up your own mind -- do your own sound tests.
As others have said, it's not a bad idea to wear good plugs under muffs. Doubling up does work better than either by itself.
Norm knows a lot about this. However, I still stand by my recommendation of the Leight max with the 33 NRR. I truly have tried 20 or more types of earplugs. And yes I have tried the yellow foamies (most recently while getting an MRI a couple weeks ago). I have tried the silicon, the flanged plugs. The Max are extremely comfortable, relatively easy to insert correctly, and easy to extract. They have a denser finish, so they clean up easily. They spring back into shape better than the yellow foamies.
Between shooting and riding a motorcycle on the highway, I wear plugs probably 6 days a week. I always carry a few pairs of the MAX with me, while other brands are gathering dust.
You should certainly try the yellow "straight-cut" foamies and see what you think, make up your own mind -- do your own sound tests.
As others have said, it's not a bad idea to wear good plugs under muffs. Doubling up does work better than either by itself.
Would any of you gents kindly mention the brand and/or model of muff (shotgun or not) that you are using and are satisfied with, which does not contact your rifle stock and lift up easily?
Right now I'm using these old clumsy things from my pistol range days, and I have trouble keeping the right side muff off my rifle stock during a firm cheek-weld and contact with the stock. I will be wearing plugs under any muff that I may buy, and so a top DB rating is not as much a priority to me as is avoiding this contact problem.
Right now I'm using these old clumsy things from my pistol range days, and I have trouble keeping the right side muff off my rifle stock during a firm cheek-weld and contact with the stock. I will be wearing plugs under any muff that I may buy, and so a top DB rating is not as much a priority to me as is avoiding this contact problem.
BoydAllen
Gold $$ Contributor
Lee,
There is another kind of "plug" that is designed to go over the outside of the ear opening and not in the canal. Of course you will not know if they bother you with out trying them, but they are relatively inexpensive, so you might want to give them a try. I have shotgun muffs that I wear with plugs, and although I understand about your problems with your custom plugs, if you are not getting any better sound blocking with your custom plugs than you have reported, I think that they were not very well done. Mine block more sound than my shotgun style muffs. Like others have said, the soft foam plugs are more comfortable. I have a box of the Howard Leight MAX, 33 db. plugs that I like a lot. although they do not seal my left ear opening without some extra attention. I think that the outer extreme of the canal on that side is just a little too big for those plugs. Here is a link to the type of plugs that seal on the outside. http://www.amazon.com/Macks-Silicone-Earplugs-White-pair/dp/B000067NMJ I think that I will see if I can find some at a local CVS pharmacy, since they list a house brand version on their web site. I will let you know how they work. Good luck with your quest.
Boyd
There is another kind of "plug" that is designed to go over the outside of the ear opening and not in the canal. Of course you will not know if they bother you with out trying them, but they are relatively inexpensive, so you might want to give them a try. I have shotgun muffs that I wear with plugs, and although I understand about your problems with your custom plugs, if you are not getting any better sound blocking with your custom plugs than you have reported, I think that they were not very well done. Mine block more sound than my shotgun style muffs. Like others have said, the soft foam plugs are more comfortable. I have a box of the Howard Leight MAX, 33 db. plugs that I like a lot. although they do not seal my left ear opening without some extra attention. I think that the outer extreme of the canal on that side is just a little too big for those plugs. Here is a link to the type of plugs that seal on the outside. http://www.amazon.com/Macks-Silicone-Earplugs-White-pair/dp/B000067NMJ I think that I will see if I can find some at a local CVS pharmacy, since they list a house brand version on their web site. I will let you know how they work. Good luck with your quest.
Boyd
.22 LR = 134 dB.......RWS -48 22 cal. air gun is one of the loudest measured @ 94 dB (which is the same value as a T-50 Arrow stapler.
The dB rating is not linear......60 dB is twice as loud as 50 dB.
Also, keep in mind if your shooting competitively, you are getting exposed to the entire firing line .......and noise effect on your hearing is cumulative.
The dB rating is not linear......60 dB is twice as loud as 50 dB.
Also, keep in mind if your shooting competitively, you are getting exposed to the entire firing line .......and noise effect on your hearing is cumulative.
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