Developing a load for big calibres

[Hamo]

Hi everyone.

I have wanted a .338 lapua for a long, long time. Years in fact. I finally found a great deal on a used 338 lap (6 grand new, second hand $2500 in great condition), and couldn't resist. I know the 338 lap shoots $5 bills so I want to try and minimise cost. Reloading is my only option and I managed to get some very cheap once fired brass which should do well.

I regularly shoot up to 1000 yards with my .308 - I have several 308's and I can usually get a good load developed in an afternoon. Typically I pick my projectile (The type of target shooting I do here only allows a few different types, so that's an easy choice). Dial in my powder in 0.5 grain increments, and shoot a string of 5 round groups with each load. I pick the best one, and then play with the seating depth if i'm still not happy with the groups. In all honesty though I have never found any of my rifles to be too fussy with the seating depth, and factory seating depth when I measure varies wildly, but my target rifle still shoots factory loads great - It shoots my developped loads which are a grain hotter much nicer though.

Now burning through 50 - 100 handloads of .308 in an afternoon is not too bad, but doing the same for the .338 will be a pain in my wallet and my shoulder. Does anyone have tips for developing a load for the .338? would I be better off going for 1 grain increments, playing with different powders, bullet weights etc. I intend on starting with a known load and trying to work around that. I think a 250 grain pill would be a nice starting point, realistically I can't shoot more than 1000 yards so getting the extra weight at 12-1500 yards isn't really a problem.

 

[R.Morehouse]

There is a monster thread around here i think called " Load Development At 100yds ". The info on the first 10 pages or so may give you a system that will save you some powder and bullets to get you narrowed down considerably on choosing a load to work with.....Have fun with your new adventure...

 

[jlow]

If you want to really shorten the reload cycle, do two things. One is learn how to do OCW load development – read Dan Newberry (who developed this method) description, and the thread that Erik Cortina started below.

To further shorten the reload cycle, lean how to use QuickLoad as it will allow you to zero in on the accuracy node using OCW more efficiently. Using these methods, expect to shoot around 60 odd rounds still to ensure the best most accurate load. As much as we all want to do it with 10 rounds, it is not going to happen...

http://optimalchargeweight.embarqspace.com/

 

[Hamo]

Thanks for the replies!
I have not heard of OCW load development but will look into it. I'd be happy with a .75 MOA load out of 50 rounds... assuming the rifle can deliver that. Obviously, tighter would be better but have to set realistic targets given its a factory remington 700... yet to be tweeked.

 

[MRogersII]

Hi everyone.

I have wanted a .338 lapua for a long, long time. Years in fact. I finally found a great deal on a used 338 lap (6 grand new, second hand $2500 in great condition), and couldn't resist. I know the 338 lap shoots $5 bills so I want to try and minimise cost. Reloading is my only option and I managed to get some very cheap once fired brass which should do well.

I regularly shoot up to 1000 yards with my .308 - I have several 308's and I can usually get a good load developed in an afternoon. Typically I pick my projectile (The type of target shooting I do here only allows a few different types, so that's an easy choice). Dial in my powder in 0.5 grain increments, and shoot a string of 5 round groups with each load. I pick the best one, and then play with the seating depth if i'm still not happy with the groups. In all honesty though I have never found any of my rifles to be too fussy with the seating depth, and factory seating depth when I measure varies wildly, but my target rifle still shoots factory loads great - It shoots my developped loads which are a grain hotter much nicer though.

Now burning through 50 - 100 handloads of .308 in an afternoon is not too bad, but doing the same for the .338 will be a pain in my wallet and my shoulder. Does anyone have tips for developing a load for the .338? would I be better off going for 1 grain increments, playing with different powders, bullet weights etc. I intend on starting with a known load and trying to work around that. I think a 250 grain pill would be a nice starting point, realistically I can't shoot more than 1000 yards so getting the extra weight at 12-1500 yards isn't really a problem.

I shot one years ago in a 1000 yard HG. I would be happy to share load data. Shot some very small groups but also many more large ones. Tends to be a very violent round to manage effectively, and not exceedingly accurate (in my observation). Send me your email in a PM. Michael

 

[4xforfun]

First thing I do is ask the "experts". I realize you haven't been around this web site very long, but you will learn who they REALLY are. Same with the Longrangehunting.com website....which has a bunch of the big Lapua shooters on it. Don't go out and try and re-invent the wheel. Find out what powder works in a majority of guns. Don't let the guys who yell "use the search engine" scare you away. I am not saying don't use it....but sometime it won't answer all of your questions.
Also....start with two or three shot groups. With big guns I shoot two shot groups. With the Lupua/Edge I jump my powder between .7 and one full grain per load. Once you find a sweet spot (node) you can work around it with 5 shot groups and smaller powder jumps. I see no reason to use 5 shot groups right away.

Good luck, have fun, and welcome to the dark side.

Tod

 

[M-61]

1st thing I would get is a 25lb bag of lead shot. Years ago I had to sight in a friends 378 Weatherby. It wasn't painless but way better with that bag. Until that experience I thought I never flinched. The bag of shot made it doable.

 

[4xforfun]

I shot one years ago in a 1000 yard HG. I would be happy to share load data. Shot some very small groups but also many more large ones. Tends to be a very violent round to manage effectively, and not exceedingly accurate (in my observation). Send me your email in a PM. Michael

I have been out of comp for a while, and I TOTALLY agree with your assesment of the 338 and 1K comp.....BUT.....that was years ago. I think that the main drawback of the 338 back in the day was the bullet......no selection and bullet consistancey was not up to par with the smaller bullets. I think that with today's powder and better bullets, results might be better. If I ever jump back in to the comp world I will chamber up a 36 inch tube for my 85 pound HG in 338 Edge or Lapua...probably an EDGE since I have the reamer, dies and brass sitting on the shelf. Might be the ticket ...especially if the wind is blowing!!

Tod

 

[wedgy]

http://www.reloadersnest.com/frontpage.asp?CaliberID=140

 

[seymour fish]

Hi everyone.

I have wanted a .338 lapua for a long, long time. Years in fact. I finally found a great deal on a used 338 lap (6 grand new, second hand $2500 in great condition), and couldn't resist. I know the 338 lap shoots $5 bills so I want to try and minimise cost. Reloading is my only option and I managed to get some very cheap once fired brass which should do well.

I regularly shoot up to 1000 yards with my .308 - I have several 308's and I can usually get a good load developed in an afternoon. Typically I pick my projectile (The type of target shooting I do here only allows a few different types, so that's an easy choice). Dial in my powder in 0.5 grain increments, and shoot a string of 5 round groups with each load. I pick the best one, and then play with the seating depth if i'm still not happy with the groups. In all honesty though I have never found any of my rifles to be too fussy with the seating depth, and factory seating depth when I measure varies wildly, but my target rifle still shoots factory loads great - It shoots my developped loads which are a grain hotter much nicer though.

Now burning through 50 - 100 handloads of .308 in an afternoon is not too bad, but doing the same for the .338 will be a pain in my wallet and my shoulder. Does anyone have tips for developing a load for the .338? would I be better off going for 1 grain increments, playing with different powders, bullet weights etc. I intend on starting with a known load and trying to work around that. I think a 250 grain pill would be a nice starting point, realistically I can't shoot more than 1000 yards so getting the extra weight at 12-1500 yards isn't really a problem.

Hamo, cheap brass is false economy unless your goal is to turning money into noise. Any method that develops a load for 308 works for 338, or 50 bmg, etc. you seem to have a sufficient number of ill-informed intentions, denial states, and buzz-words, such that further advice is un-necessary .

 

[hogpatrol]

Not as big but for the 26 and 28 Noslers, I went with half a grain increments for load development. I concur with the post about brass. If it wasn't shot in that particular rifle, it may add another layer of load development getting the brass fire formed, i.e. false economy. My .02, with that rifle, I'd buy new brass and RL-33 powder. Forget about Retumbo, 869, etc. lest you turn dollar bills in to noise and smoke.

 

[jlow]

Not as big but for the 26 and 28 Noslers, I went with half a grain increments for load development. I concur with the post about brass. If it wasn't shot in that particular rifle, it may add another layer of load development getting the brass fire formed, i.e. false economy. My .02, with that rifle, I'd buy new brass.

I would second the comment as it relates to cheap brass. It starts out saving you money, but in the end it actually cost you more in terms of not just money but time and of course there is the frustration....

 

[ebb]

I can save you some time and money. Get reloader 33 and don't bother with anything else powder wise. It is made to work with the 338 and fits it so much better than the others it is light years ahead. This is coming from a guy that has 16lbs of retumbo, 16lbs of US869 , and 20lbs of WC 872, all the go to powders of big magnum cartridges in the past.

 

[Hamo]

Fully appreciate the comments on cheap brass, but out of curiosity, how would once fired, annealed, full length sized and trimmed brass be different to new brass (case life aside).

Thanks for the comments re: powder. Unfortunately in Australia its difficulty to get some of the american powders. I can't seem to find anywhere that sells the Reloader 33.
I can get equivelants to Retumbo and Reloader 22 which I might try. Research has shown a good local load of 92 grains of Reloader 22 with a 250 grain pill. Its a starting point I guess. I'll keep trying for the RL33 as it sounds like a good powder to start on. Hopefully I can it or something similar locally.

 

[hogpatrol]

Fully appreciate the comments on cheap brass, but out of curiosity, how would once fired, annealed, full length sized and trimmed brass be different to new brass (case life aside).

Short answer, not all chambers and dies are created equally. For example, say your 1x brass was shot in a sloppy chamber and your chamber is a tighter one. Are you going to be able to push back the neck/shoulder AND base enough with a standard die to make it fit? The only way to tell is to take your standard case measurements and then try it. Didn't know you were located in Oz. With regards to the firearm situation, you have my sympathies.

 

[MRogersII]

Fully appreciate the comments on cheap brass, but out of curiosity, how would once fired, annealed, full length sized and trimmed brass be different to new brass (case life aside).

Thanks for the comments re: powder. Unfortunately in Australia its difficulty to get some of the american powders. I can't seem to find anywhere that sells the Reloader 33.
I can get equivelants to Retumbo and Reloader 22 which I might try. Research has shown a good local load of 92 grains of Reloader 22 with a 250 grain pill. Its a starting point I guess. I'll keep trying for the RL33 as it sounds like a good powder to start on. Hopefully I can it or something similar locally.

I found workable loads with both Retumbo and H1000 using the 300's.

 

[4xforfun]

Fully appreciate the comments on cheap brass, but out of curiosity, how would once fired, annealed, full length sized and trimmed brass be different to new brass (case life aside).

Thanks for the comments re: powder. Unfortunately in Australia its difficulty to get some of the american powders. I can't seem to find anywhere that sells the Reloader 33.
I can get equivelants to Retumbo and Reloader 22 which I might try. Research has shown a good local load of 92 grains of Reloader 22 with a 250 grain pill. Its a starting point I guess. I'll keep trying for the RL33 as it sounds like a good powder to start on. Hopefully I can it or something similar locally.

One word....primerpockets.

OK....TWO words...primer pockets!!

You decide.

I just re read your post...."case life aside".

Case life is HUGE, so I will stick with my answer!!

 

[Outrider27]

If it, or an equivalent, is available where you are, I second MRogersII with regard to trying H1000. It has worked well for me with both 300s and 250s.

 

[Hamo]

Sorry about the delay

I finally got a chance to test some loads. I picked 300 grain Nosler competition projectiles and AR2225 powder, and away I went.

A quick update on the rifle

I bought it second hand being told that it was a "Rem 700 tactical chassis" - This is a stainless, ceracoted 338 lap in an MDT chassis. When it arrived and I tore it down to check everything and it became apparent that it was not as described. Judging from the muzzle brake and the bolt handle I think I have a Rem 700 MLR which has been placed in a MDT chassis. Essentially its the same rifle but not in stainless. For a second hand rifle its in excellent condition. A few cosmetic marks but If I had bought I would have accepted it as ware and tear from the showroom.

The trigger however is atrocious. I think it would find better use as a quick release in an industrial setting. I don't have a trigger pull gauge but its got to be around 7 or 8 lbs. I could forgive it if it broke nicely... but it doesn't. really gave me a hard time trying to place some good groups.

I topped it with my bushnell elite 4.5-30x50 scope. Its unlikely to be my final scope but it seemed to hold up to the recoil OK. I think it will have to be a nightforce, but the Vortex viper FFP scopes are tempting.


As for a range report. There was a 15-20 knot cross wind which was gusting so it was difficulty to make much headway on a load development. I managed a 1 MOA group with 90 grains of 2225 at 200 yards. I think I'm finding the sweet spot so hopefully next time theres a quiet day I can decide on a regular load. I need to fix or replace the trigger first though, sub-MOA groups with this trigger would be an achievement. I do have to say though, that after 30 rounds my shoulder was on fire. 338 lap is one heck of a caliber, and it does punish the unprepared. I have a new respect for the round and the rifle.

More to come

 

[T-shooter]

Hi everyone.

I have wanted a .338 lapua for a long, long time. Years in fact. I finally found a great deal on a used 338 lap (6 grand new, second hand $2500 in great condition), and couldn't resist. I know the 338 lap shoots $5 bills so I want to try and minimise cost. Reloading is my only option and I managed to get some very cheap once fired brass which should do well.

I regularly shoot up to 1000 yards with my .308 - I have several 308's and I can usually get a good load developed in an afternoon. Typically I pick my projectile (The type of target shooting I do here only allows a few different types, so that's an easy choice). Dial in my powder in 0.5 grain increments, and shoot a string of 5 round groups with each load. I pick the best one, and then play with the seating depth if i'm still not happy with the groups. In all honesty though I have never found any of my rifles to be too fussy with the seating depth, and factory seating depth when I measure varies wildly, but my target rifle still shoots factory loads great - It shoots my developped loads which are a grain hotter much nicer though.

Now burning through 50 - 100 handloads of .308 in an afternoon is not too bad, but doing the same for the .338 will be a pain in my wallet and my shoulder. Does anyone have tips for developing a load for the .338? would I be better off going for 1 grain increments, playing with different powders, bullet weights etc. I intend on starting with a known load and trying to work around that. I think a 250 grain pill would be a nice starting point, realistically I can't shoot more than 1000 yards so getting the extra weight at 12-1500 yards isn't really a problem.

I'm sure you have a good muzzle brake. Another way to save your shoulder is with a "Limbsaver" pad. It takes about half the noticeable recoil out of my 12 gauge with 3" magnum slugs. A push vs a slap.