defiant/ pierce action worth it???

[Nature Boy]

There’s a pride in owning something that’s custom to your desires and different than run-of-the-mill. That has value.

If it wasn’t true companies like James Purdey & Sons wouldn’t still be making custom firearms since 1814 and selling them for what most people take a 30 year loan out to pay for their house

 

[jonny315]

Thank you everyone for your opinions, I have decided to buy a Bighorn TL3, and im planning on using a prefit shouldered proof research carbon fiber barrel chambered in 300 prc. I have done some research and I seem to like new calibers, the prc seems to be an interesting round. The only problem I have is getting a prefit… noone has them in stock and if I have a gunsmith chamber it the cost goes to 1100 instead of 850 sheesh!

What do you guys think of the bighorn TL3?

 

[WeatherbyFan]

I have had about 40 custom rifles built, some totally full custom to just trueing&Squaring a factory action with a good aftermarket barrel,

I’ve used 5 Defiance actions for various builds, a cpl Stiller Predator actions, The Defiance Actions are as nice and smooth an action as you will ever see, but I can’t honestly say they shoot any better than a Trued&Squared Kimber Montana action with the same barrel,
My gunsmith says some of the worst actions to deal with is late model Remington 700s and older Weatherby Mark Vs,
LAW actions being one of the best factory actions he’s worked with Tikka, Kimber and Sako A7s all a close second.

 

[D.Stone]

Thank you everyone for your opinions, I have decided to buy a Bighorn TL3, and im planning on using a prefit shouldered proof research carbon fiber barrel chambered in 300 prc. I have done some research and I seem to like new calibers, the prc seems to be an interesting round. The only problem I have is getting a prefit… noone has them in stock and if I have a gunsmith chamber it the cost goes to 1100 instead of 850 sheesh!

What do you guys think of the bighorn TL3?

The TL3 is generally well regarded by a lot of people. It's very similar to a CRPF Model 70 action as far as the bolt is concerned. Swappable bolt heads are cool as well.

My tiering of custom actions for PRS type stuff would be Impact>Defiance>Bighorn.

 

[dcali]

If you're happy with "sub moa all day long", the action does not matter at all. Some are nicer than others and have different features, but the accuracy will be there with just about anything. A factory action with custom barrel can do better than that.

 

[David101]

One of the BIG issues that most of the custom actions follow the Remington 700 design. How can you have a huge step up in Accuracy and performance if you use the same foundation?

The custom actions that go out and build actions designed specifically for Target Rifles and throw out all the old paradigms are more likely to build that new break through Designed action.

The action is important especially in today's world of fully floated barrels and straight no taper 1.25in barrels that is a lot of weight that has to be supported and controlled once it starts to vibrate after a shot. The relatively thin wall of the Rem 700 repeating action just pales in comparison to some of the custom single shot target actions.

 

[Matt in Virginia]

FWIW,
I really like Borden Rimrocks... Only thing I don't care for, and this is a mighty small nit to pick, is Jim's lack of a Borden made stainless steel rail. He has talked about it. That said he likes aluminum and who can fault him on results. May try Murphy again.

Regards, Matt.

 

[Dud]

One of the BIG issues that most of the custom actions follow the Remington 700 design. How can you have a huge step up in Accuracy and performance if you use the same foundation?

The custom actions that go out and build actions designed specifically for Target Rifles and throw out all the old paradigms are more likely to build that new break through Designed action.

The action is important especially in today's world of fully floated barrels and straight no taper 1.25in barrels that is a lot of weight that has to be supported and controlled once it starts to vibrate after a shot. The relatively thin wall of the Rem 700 repeating action just pales in comparison to some of the custom single shot target actions.

I don't think I agree with your premise. Most custom actions that are Remington 700 compatible only share the action screw spacing, magazine cuts that line up, the trigger is compatible, the bolt handle fits the notch on a 700 stock and the shape of the rear tang is similar.

None of those things really impede the creativity or innovation in bolt action rifle design.

For heavy rail guns the only reason to have commonality is for convenience finding parts, a 700 compatible action isn't going to be ideal but special firearms designed to take advantage of a rule book aren't really advancing the art of firearms, they are just advancing competition which is something that relatively few people pay attention to.

 

[Tommie]

I know we use the term “custom action” but aren’t they just precision-built actions? The manufacturers have several different configurations and you buy the one you want. Not much custom happening there.

 

[David101]

@Dud I agree with what you are saying and in a way I think it is also in line what I was trying to say.

@Tommie There are a few manufactures out there like Barnard, RPA, Borden that have departed from the "Clone" mentality to really producing something new. It might not look like anything radically departed from the bolt action we are used to seeing. However new innovation is always welcomed especially when it works.

 

[dbduff]

Buy a custom action for your needs. You'll never regret it. It will reward you in ways you haven't' realized.

 

[Dud]

@Dud I agree with what you are saying and in a way I think it is also in line what I was trying to say.

@Tommie There are a few manufactures out there like Barnard, RPA, Borden that have departed from the "Clone" mentality to really producing something new. It might not look like anything radically departed from the bolt action we are used to seeing. However new innovation is always welcomed especially when it works.

There are a few actions out there that seem to be about equal to a blueprinted Remington 700 but most depart from the design significantly in a few or many ways and almost all hold tolerances that are much closer than an average production action.

They can actually be a value choice when you look at all of the features they jam in to a Remington footprint.

If you're concerned about vibrations in the action after a shot, you should really be looking at barrel block type stock/chassis that lets the whole receiver free float.

 

[Tommie]

@Tommie There are a few manufactures out there like Barnard, RPA, Borden that have departed from the "Clone" mentality to really producing something new. It might not look like anything radically departed from the bolt action we are used to seeing. However new innovation is always welcomed especially when it works.

I get that, but my point was: what does "custom" mean? Do they build an action completely from scratch and use my personal dimensions, specs, etc?

 

[David101]

I think "Custom" can mean different things to different people. For me it means an action made by a manufacturer who's main business is selling actions that there factory has made and they are not a copy of an already existing design.

 

[golong]

If sub MOA, even half MOA, is your goal then don't bother with custom. If you are going for 3/8 or 1/4, then yeah take the plunge.

A tuned factory action is a couple bills short of some of the custom actions. I have a couple of Defiance Machine actions. One came with and still has a burr on the inside of the action. Small enough that it I don't send it back to have it fixed, but tall enough that it put a groove in the bolt and scratches brass. I have see 2 others that have the same burr, all 3 were purchased this year. I also have another Defiance that had machining problems with the bolt - they fixed it and sent it back in about 1 business week.

Advantage wise, custom actions from reputable manufactures have outstanding warranties and from what I hear most have good turnaround times when issues come up. Having thicker recoil lugs that are machined with the action rather than pinned is a huge thing for me, as it having an integrated rail and a larger tang. You never want any of those to shift if you are going for max accuracy and precision. As others have mentioned, they are smoother than factory. Bolt release may be more convenient as well, sans Tikka. You may also find they have longer mag cuts, and some give options on the type.

I still like Defiance despite the issues. However, you may want to look at Bighorn as you can buy shouldered pre-fit barrels for them.

 

[D.Stone]

@Dud I agree with what you are saying and in a way I think it is also in line what I was trying to say.

@Tommie There are a few manufactures out there like Barnard, RPA, Borden that have departed from the "Clone" mentality to really producing something new. It might not look like anything radically departed from the bolt action we are used to seeing. However new innovation is always welcomed especially when it works.

What makes the RPA more remarkable than a Remington 700 clone?

I own one. Just because it's different doesn't mean that it's better. There is a reason you do not see any Quadlocks in any shooting sports outside of Palma.

 

[69mach]

I 2nd defiance. I’ve got 2 defiance deviants and plan on adding another one before long. Haveing said that my defiance won’t do anything that a worked over rem 700 wont do in the accuracy dept. custom actions just do it in style.

 

[D.Stone]

If you are curious about Defiance, then I have a treat coming up at the beginning of next week that may surprise some people.

My Defiance action shipped, and it will be up here in Alaska next Monday. I'll do a short over-view of it once I get it, because it's a rather uncommon configuration.

 

[golong]

If you are curious about Defiance, then I have a treat coming up at the beginning of next week that may surprise some people.

My Defiance action shipped, and it will be up here in Alaska next Monday. I'll do a short over-view of it once I get it, because it's a rather uncommon configuration.

Tag here when you write it up.

 

[D.Stone]

Well here it is. This is basically as expensive as a Defiance action can get. I'll do a more thorough write up in the coming months once I get it turned into a functional rifle.

This is a Defiance Deviant Ultra-light with the Mauser style Controlled Round Feed Extractor, mechanical ejector, and 3 position safety. And it's nitrided as well.

The short review is basically that this is like a much better Winchester Model 70. I'm actually really excited to get this put together into an ultralight build.