CZ 17 Ackley Hornet

[Mark M.]

You fellas, who have shot these for a while, What is your go to powder and bullet?

 

[drop_point]

H110, H4198, IMR 4198, CFE BLK. 25 gr Bergers were great but they have disappeared. I have the best luck with 25 gr V-Max at this point. I don't love them, though.

 

[L.Sherm]

I've been around one that shot AA1680 really well.

 

[craig55]

VV-120 and a 20gr Vmax

 

[rickiesrevenge]

A1680 with a 20vmax or 25gr hp

 

[TRSR8]

Hodgdon LilGun or AA1680 are the two best powders I found. I found 1680 at a very reasonable price (a while back) in and 8# keg and have enough to last a lifetime.

i have found AA 1680 to be my universal small case powder, all the way down to 14 Walker Hornet….love it.

 

[shoot4fun]

i have found AA 1680 to be my universal small case powder, all the way down to 14 Walker Hornet….love it.

Also very usable for 460 & 500S&W.

 

[searcher]

They aren't the exact same bullet so it's not a true apples to apples comparison but I've shot the 15gr LF 17 WSM rimfire ammo in my 17WSM and the 15.5 in my 17 Hornets and for such a tiny little bullet they're pretty destructive. Haven't shot them nearly as much or as far, in my 17 WSM and Hornet, as I have the 20gr Vmax and I've mostly only shot ground squirrels with those 15's but they flat blowed em up good as well as have been very accurate.

I'm sure those 15 and 15.5 grainers will kill coyotes but for me if I planned to use my 17 Hornet specifically for coyotes or even rock chucks I would dip in to my stash of Hornady 25gr HP's and load those.

We've shot some coyotes with the 15.5's in 17 HMR and they will definitely kill them - but the 25's are much better. Had a few coyotes take a number of hits before they went down.

 

[BradY]

Trying the nosler varmageddon tomorrow, 20vmax are okay but not great. H4198 because it’s all I can get. Would suggest cfe blk or a1680

 

[No manches"]

A1680 with a 20vmax or 25gr hp

Note".
12.4 grn of AA 1680 for the 20grn Hornady Vmax & CCI 400 with new era brass 2021+.
Older brass was made with a sink stake on primer pocket. Which also has less capacity.

12.6 grns AA 2200 for the 25grn Hornady Vmax.,...again new era brass.

And if you can get a hold on some 30grn bergers..11.4grns LT-32 and Remington 7.5, compress load.

Again new era brass.

If you measure neck thickness on the brass it is all over the spectrum..
From 0.009 to 0.013, I trim all to 0.010..
And toss away anything thinner.

 

[rickiesrevenge]

Dont think I ever tried cfe blk in either of mine. It didnt exist when I built them. Cfe does work well in my 17tcm imp which is similar capacity

 

[Webster]

Had a nice score today, picked up a CZ 527 American rebarreled with a stainless in 17 Ackley Hornet

You might like Varmint Al's website with a lot of info on the 17 Ackley Hornet.

Varmint Al's Handloading/Reloading Page

 

[RCE1]

I've found 1680 great for .22Hornet, .22KHornet and .17Ackley Hornet.

 

[Bugger Picker1]

I'll go back in my chronogaph files and look at data for both powders.
I will say I never saw any primer of brass problems with the Lil Gun and I shot the powder in a wide varying temperature and humidity range.

You can't just run a AH reamer in an HH chamber because the HH shoulder is a bigger diameter. You would need to cut and rethread the barrel. I ran HH loaded ammo thru an AH body die then fired it in the AH chamber. almost no neck clearance and did not shoot well. only lost one per box. The brass was very junky. I am not going to reload it. I did think about keeping the AH case the same length, moving the shoulder far enough forward to make the neck the same length as the HH and also making the shoulder the same diameter and call it a super hornet, I want to shoot 25 grain pills around 37-38 to keep heat out of the barrel. It nay be better to shorten or download a 17 fireball, the good point would be able to load the round in a 77/17 Ruger and use a quality barrel. use the factory barrel for a tomato stake in the garden. By using the Ruger for a doner I would have a decent stock and tunable action to start that would feed, eject and with a few rotary magazines wreak havoc on a pd town. The speed would give nice air dogs, helicopters and flying doubles. Th high fliers are caused by hitting the ground right under the dog. Photograph kills will always be welcomed by your PITA friends at work!

 

[shoot4fun]

You can't just run a AH reamer in an HH chamber because the HH shoulder is a bigger diameter. You would need to cut and rethread the barrel. I ran HH loaded ammo thru an AH body die then fired it in the AH chamber. almost no neck clearance and did not shoot well. only lost one per box. The brass was very junky. I am not going to reload it. I did think about keeping the AH case the same length, moving the shoulder far enough forward to make the neck the same length as the HH and also making the shoulder the same diameter and call it a super hornet, I want to shoot 25 grain pills around 37-38 to keep heat out of the barrel. It nay be better to shorten or download a 17 fireball, the good point would be able to load the round in a 77/17 Ruger and use a quality barrel. use the factory barrel for a tomato stake in the garden. By using the Ruger for a doner I would have a decent stock and tunable action to start that would feed, eject and with a few rotary magazines wreak havoc on a pd town. The speed would give nice air dogs, helicopters and flying doubles. Th high fliers are caused by hitting the ground right under the dog. Photograph kills will always be welcomed by your PITA friends at work!

So you fired 17HH in a AH chamber after F**ng up in a AH body die and it would chamber and fire.
Doesn't appear to have been successful.
I never said anything about just running a HH reamer in a 17AH so not sure where that comes from.
Did I say anything in the post you replied to about "high fliers" are is that just some more aimless wandering in your post?
Maybe I ain't smart enough to get a read out of what you typed?!

 

[Bugger Picker1]

So you fired 17HH in a AH chamber after F**ng up in a AH body die and it would chamber and fire.
Doesn't appear to have been successful.
I never said anything about just running a HH reamer in a 17AH so not sure where that comes from.
Did I say anything in the post you replied to about "high fliers" are is that just some more aimless wandering in your post?
Maybe I ain't smart enough to get a read out of what you typed?!

Maybe I ain't smart enough to write so that you can understand it. Old, dyslexia's and a host of other issues so lt me take it from the Top. Several years ago I read an article by Lane Simpson and I knew better because I had several personal experiences prior to reading one of his articles and was certain that he didn't know what he was talking about.. In this particular article he wrote about a nice looking Contender rifle chambered in 17 Akley Hornet. I decided to build one. I called Mike Bellam and he recommended MGM to make the barrel and I bought an Encore frame locally. I bought the 2 form dies and a FL Redding set of dies. The cases were really weird looking before fire forming. but I loaded fireform loads and went to the range. everyone split in the shoulder. Not happy. I reread the article and I did everything just like he said. Bought different and got the same results. Tried a different brand same thing. I have never been happy with the quality of Hornady brass. And couldn't find any anyway. In his article he stated the difference in the shoulder diameter and one could run the HH cases thu a FL AH body die and shoot them in a AH chamber. He pulled the bullets weighed the charges and came up with an average weight dumped all the powder ran the empty cases through a AH body die and re loaded and they shot great. I decided that the body would not fire the primer I would run loaded ammo through the Body and I did with no problems. He stated thatb the HH case was .050 shorter but caused no problems. Out of 100 rounds I had 4 of them split and none had decent accuracy to my standards. only of those cases split out of 100. The HH cases were a tight fit in the neck and terrible thickness variations. Not once did Simpson mention that the cases should be annealed before fire forming. In the meantime i found Todd Kindler and he asked me about annealing and he told me you have to do that or they will all split. Then when I found this place everybody said the cases had to be annealed before fire forming. I did 2 in the back yard before the cops started circling the neighborhood. The accuracy problem could have been because the bullets were too far from the rifling. Pulling those tiny bullets are next to impossible without damaging them. I think that I will just sell the 200 factory rounds and use Nosler, PV or Lapua brass and start from scratch when I can get back on that project. What are your Thoughts?

 

[shoot4fun]

Maybe I ain't smart enough to write so that you can understand it. Old, dyslexia's and a host of other issues so lt me take it from the Top. Several years ago I read an article by Lane Simpson and I knew better because I had several personal experiences prior to reading one of his articles and was certain that he didn't know what he was talking about.. In this particular article he wrote about a nice looking Contender rifle chambered in 17 Akley Hornet. I decided to build one. I called Mike Bellam and he recommended MGM to make the barrel and I bought an Encore frame locally. I bought the 2 form dies and a FL Redding set of dies. The cases were really weird looking before fire forming. but I loaded fireform loads and went to the range. everyone split in the shoulder. Not happy. I reread the article and I did everything just like he said. Bought different and got the same results. Tried a different brand same thing. I have never been happy with the quality of Hornady brass. And couldn't find any anyway. In his article he stated the difference in the shoulder diameter and one could run the HH cases thu a FL AH body die and shoot them in a AH chamber. He pulled the bullets weighed the charges and came up with an average weight dumped all the powder ran the empty cases through a AH body die and re loaded and they shot great. I decided that the body would not fire the primer I would run loaded ammo through the Body and I did with no problems. He stated thatb the HH case was .050 shorter but caused no problems. Out of 100 rounds I had 4 of them split and none had decent accuracy to my standards. only of those cases split out of 100. The HH cases were a tight fit in the neck and terrible thickness variations. Not once did Simpson mention that the cases should be annealed before fire forming. In the meantime i found Todd Kindler and he asked me about annealing and he told me you have to do that or they will all split. Then when I found this place everybody said the cases had to be annealed before fire forming. I did 2 in the back yard before the cops started circling the neighborhood. The accuracy problem could have been because the bullets were too far from the rifling. Pulling those tiny bullets are next to impossible without damaging them. I think that I will just sell the 200 factory rounds and use Nosler, PV or Lapua brass and start from scratch when I can get back on that project. What are your Thoughts?

I'm old too and have some serious health issues right now.
I've answered your post in a PM.

 

[Ackman]

You might like Varmint Al's website with a lot of info on the 17 Ackley Hornet.

Varmint Al's Handloading/Reloading Page

I've fireformed probably 2,000 Win.22H cases in 2 different chambers, to 17AH. Not even one neck or shoulder lost. No annealing, no splitting. Don't be messing with HH brass. I know Win 22H brass can be hard to find but it's better than Rem and way better than trying to make HH brass work.

As to varmint AL..... Years ago I'd never heard of the guy and read one of his articles in a magazine about, I believe, forming 17AH brass. And thinking, "this guy is full of crap, hasn't a clue". Making something simple into something way more than i needs to be. Total nonsense. Same with just doing other AI cases.

 

[Ackman]

This is all it takes. Run a 22H case into the 17AH neck die, creating a false shoulder. Run it in far enough that it chambers with just a very slight bit of crush....in a bolt gun just a small bit of bolt pressure., enough that you know the shoulder is firm against the chamber. Then load. Fire, and out comes s perfectly formed case. Easy peasy, and quite accurate fireforming..

Winchester brass
Rem 7-1//2 primer
20gr Hammett, Vmax, Berger......Vmax and Berger terminal performance is the same
My loads.....12gr./2200, or 11gr/680 (680 no longer available commercially, 1680 jusr as good)

Varmints are in peril.

 

[Bugger Picker1]

This is all it takes. Run a 22H case into the 17AH neck die, creating a false shoulder. Run it in far enough that it chambers with just a very slight bit of crush....in a bolt gun just a small bit of bolt pressure., enough that you know the shoulder is firm against the chamber. Then load. Fire, and out comes s perfectly formed case. Easy peasy, and quite accurate fireforming..

Winchester brass
Rem 7-1//2 primer
20gr Hammett, Vmax, Berger......Vmax and Berger terminal performance is the same
My loads.....12gr./2200, or 11gr/680 (680 no longer available commercially, 1680 jusr as good)

Varmints are in peril.

Wow, that is exactly what my cases looked like before fire forming. The Winchesters that I used split. I have used the expensive 2 die form set and the Bullberry double ended dies and still problems. I don't have a 17AH neck die but have seen where people have used the seating die with luck. I haven't tried that yet. I am #,000 miles from my loading equipment, it hasn't been above freezing here since the end of September and the snow is almost waist deep.