Custom versus Cooper

[barrowsr]

I have a light weight barrel Rem 700 22-250 that is to be the basis for a prairie dog/casual target gun. After adding up the expenses of new barrel, stock, action truing and trigger it could easily exceed the cost of a Cooper. I'm wondering how much money it would take to bring the Remington up to or exceeding the Cooper's accuracy level. Anyone else been down this road or see a flaw in my thought process,occurs often as pointed out by my wife)? I've ruled out the custom action route as just too expensive. I figure I might be able to sell the Remington for+/- $400 if I don't use it as a basis for the project. Thoughts?

Robin

 

[MarkS]

I have been there and done that. I rebuilt will out shoot the Cooper, a barrel will do that. In any gun project, all cost are the same, barrel, stock, triger, and smithing cost. The main difference is the cost is the action. By the time you tune a Remington you are near the cost of a custom action.

The cost of a Cooper is more than the cost of some used custom guns.

Now to what all this is about. Used custom guns. Let someone else spend the money. I have 3 custom gun that I got used at half tha price.
The best place to get a used gun, is on the borads or benchrest matches. most re going to be PPC's the bolt face can be opened to a 308 or it may be for both as it comes.

You will get a good stock, action, trigger. The barrel can be punched to any 6mm round. Or you can add a barrel of your choice.

I have always wanted a Copper, but for the cost I can get a used custom, and they are much more gun for the money.

Check out the boards and find some local Benchrest matches or the guys that run them. you can find some good buys.


Mark Schronce

 

[fdshuster]

Robin: PM sent

 

[mikecr]

For one, BR guns aren't hunting guns. So saving on used BR guns, only to try & adapt with changes that ruin it, doesn't help most.
Second, the Cooper is a damn good hunting gun for the money.

It's only faults really are fairly slow twist rates, No trigger options, and barrel metal left in white,instead of coated black).
These things can be addressed locally, and cheaply.
My son does well beyond 500yds with his M21 in 223.

And then there is Savage. A whole world of potential there.

 

[barrowsr]

I really appreciate the responses. This forum continues to impress me as the go-to place for my rifle accuracy questions. In response to Mark’s suggestions there is more information I probably should have shared. The gun will be used for a lot more varmint than target shooting and no benchrest competition. I would love to buy a custom solid bottomed action for stiffness. Custom actions cost a minimum of $800 and most are over a grand. Add a barrel, fitting, chambering and stock plus a trigger and its easy to pass two grand. The used route is often suggested and I have been looking a lot. Most used target / varmint rifles are Rem. 700 with varying degrees of accuracy work done by a wide variety of gunsmiths,all smiths are not equal). All used rifles I have seen have fiberglass stocks that just are not my taste. I like wood stocks - even laminates and solid black look better to me that the rainbow assortment of fiberglass stocks many shooters prefer.

The chances that I’ll find a used solid bottomed/stiff action in 22 BR or 22-250 with a stock I would be seen in public with is pretty slim. Then there is the issue of why someone is selling a custom rifle. Maybe it is to pay the rent or just maybe it is because it won’t shoot. I’ve run into the same issue with rifles, pistols, shotguns, cars and motorcycles; it’s nice to build a custom exactly as you want it but when the final accounting is done I would have gone faster for less money if I’d just bought a new vehicle that had the specs or speed I was looking for.

My internet is not to disagree with the used rifle route but more to discuss the self imposed constraints this project has and the majority of used guns I’ve seen on the market.

Regards,

Robin

 

[MarkS]

barrowsr,

This gun just came on line on this site. Great buy for $1300.00. I would bet good money the shooter is going to a right bolt left port, rt eject gun. All you would need is a Hunting stock later. and maybe open the boltface up to 308 for a 22br.
Hall is a great action, I have one.


http://6mmbr.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=3732308

Mark Schronce

 

[Sin_arms]

For what you are looking to do I do not see why you couldn't go with a stock Savage rifle and get what you want out of it. Or even swap to a premium barrel and you can shoot in the .2-.3' if you are able to.

 

[mikecr]

Mark, I gotta disagree with your apparent generalization of a HUNTING gun. The pretty red BR gun is atleast a mile from it.

Point blank BR guns are low energy guns. Short stocks and barrels, puny Davidson bases, no recoil pad, no swivel studs or meat to set them, no safety. They are glaring and stand out as offensive to hunters.

Now changing all this would be expensive, and flat out ruin a very nice purpose-built gun. Not every 'gunsmith' can properly mate a barrel to that action, nor correct the stock for hunting,including weighting for balance and inletting for a safety), nor mount practical scope bases..

I learned these things the hard way, with a crossover project of my own:
A 6.5wssm built for both Williamsport LG, and woodchuck hunting. Bat, Jewel, Shethane, Border 5R, Bryant, Kavanaugh.. It has a safety, quick-connect studs, adjusted recoil pad, epoxy coated, epoxy painted, Controlled round feed with standing blade ejection.
Shoots great, alot of fun, -not practical for hunting. Too heavy at 16lb 6oz, and if I pull the mercury weighting, it gets way out of balance. Right at home on a bench rest, but hates a bipod. The gun is also physically too large.
So I park it next to a sexy T2k awaiting future use other than hunting -for both.

Practicality puts a chasm between BR and hunting.

 

[MarkS]

Mike,

Yes, If you are wanting have a light hunting Rifle with a mag. A Remington or Savage would be the way to go. I would go with the Savage Precision Varminter. A custom barrel can be added for around $350.00.
All the PD hunting I had done has been from a portable bench. A bench gun shoots great from a portable bench too.

But, if you are asking about upgrading a Remington to make it like a Cooper, all cost need to be weighted.
Remington upgrade:
Starter gun $500.00
Action tune $200.00
Barrel fitted 450.00
Jewel trigger $200.00
Av. Stock installed Apx $425.00 wood or Lam wood would run more for finished. You can get a drop in of factory for less.

Total $1700.00

Hall 22PPC
$1300.00 gun
Replace BR trigger for bottom Safety trigger, by selling the Br trigger about $50.00 difference.
A new Stock is going to run the same the Remington $450.00. - $50.00 for the trigger guard on the Hall. No dropin for a Hall.
Open boltface to 308 and punch ppc to 22BR Apx $150.00.

Total $1800.00

You should be about to get $150.00 for the Benchrest.
Drops total $1650.00

Scope mounts would be the same for both. Use Weaver steel bases, 2 Remington front ) and Burris Sig Zee rings.

I will take the Hall everyday for the same money.

The custom action make great switch barrel gun. All of my custom actions have more than one barrel.


Mark Schronce