CHEST (PILLOW) PAD LEGAL OR ILLEGAL FOR F-CLASS

[Scott H]

Question for the F-Class rules experts.

I have a seat cushion that is folded in half and put under my chest when shooting.

I use this to help take stress off my lower back.

I have used this at 2 NRA sanctioned events and never questioned about it or called out for illegal equipment.

Today at a non sanctioned event, it was mentioned to me that it was illegal equipment. "Artificial support for the chest"?
They did not stop me from using it, but just a reference for future matches to prevent issues or DQ. MD was very nice about it but did bring it up.

All I can find in the F-Class rules is as follows:

3.10 Ground Cloth or Ground Pad— A competitor may use one or more
ground cloths or ground pads if they are not constructed or used in a manner
to provide artificial support.

5.2 Artificial Support—Any supporting surface except the ground not
specifically authorized for use in the Rules for the position prescribed. Dig-
ging of elbow or heel holes at the firing points which form artificial support
for the elbows, arms, or legs is prohibited. Use of artificial support, including
back braces, is prohibited except as individually authorized by NRA for a
physically handicapped shooter.

So if the chest pad is not allowed, how is it different from bags or towels placed under elbows for shooting positions or for your hand for joystick stabilizing?

Your thoughts on this please.

THX

Scott

 

[Chaotik]

My understanding is that artificial supports for the chest are not legal in F class. You can apply for a Adaptive shooting waiver (which may take months to years, requires detailed pictures of your proposed support and also requires a statement by a physician). Using the adaptive waiver will make you ineligible for any national records. I used this waiver for several years when I was shooting F class, but now it is just too difficult even with the waiver. Now I am strictly shooting benchrest.

 

[yukonal]

I use one to take some pressure off of my neck. I have had neck surgery, have limited mobility, and some degree of constant pain. I'm going to use mine. Period.

 

[Scott H]

My understanding is that artificial supports for the chest are not legal in F class. You can apply for a Adaptive shooting waiver (which may take months to years, requires detailed pictures of your proposed support and also requires a statement by a physician). Using the adaptive waiver will make you ineligible for any national records. I used this waiver for several years when I was shooting F class, but now it is just too difficult even with the waiver. Now I am strictly shooting benchrest.

Thx for your feed back on this. So then if the chest pad is not allowed then why not the elbow bags and towels?

 

[rardoin]

Thx for your feed back on this. So then if the chest pad is not allowed then why not the elbow bags and towels?

It is in the function of the pad/towel. If used to reduce abrasion…..legal. If using to stabilize/support the shooter’s position….foul. Simple.

 

[Mulligan]

Foam wedge for back support

I hope to be a new F class competitor this coming year. I have a really bad back and a stiff neck and it is more than a bit difficult getting down into position with my front rest tripod and bag in the rear. Is it legal to put a sort of wedge under your chest to take the strain off the back as...

forum.accurateshooter.com

Same conversation from yesteryear

CW

 

[Cochran]

I always lay a folded over hoodie on my mat for extra chest padding. Once several years ago an NRA referee at the nationals questioned it but was satisfied with my answer. I’ve since shown a different NRA referee and a referee at an ICFRA championship my gear and neither had a problem with it.

 

[Scott H]

It is in the function of the pad/towel. If used to reduce abrasion…..legal. If using to stabilize/support the shooter’s position….foul. Simple.

Thank you for your explanation. makes total sense when put that way.

so if i say it's for preventing the ripping out of my chest hair, from the massive recoil of a .284, making me slide backwards 6 inches after every shot, probably would not work. lol

Thank you again for clarification.

Will not be using it anymore.

 

[Scott H]

Foam wedge for back support

I hope to be a new F class competitor this coming year. I have a really bad back and a stiff neck and it is more than a bit difficult getting down into position with my front rest tripod and bag in the rear. Is it legal to put a sort of wedge under your chest to take the strain off the back as...

forum.accurateshooter.com

Same conversation from yesteryear

CW

Thx, I didn't see this in my search for this topic.

Now by reading through this older thread, it seems it is not conclusive as legal or not legal.

As for rardoin's comment above, I can say under that description it would not be legal and I agree with that, but the elbow bags have dimples in them and which could be qualified as artificial support because it keeps the shooters elbow from moving or sliding easily.

I am asking these questions because I am not clear on this per F-Class rules as written.

And as I also stated I have used this pad in 2 NRA matches, both were state championship matches and one required rifle weigh-in. Nothing was said at either match. That is why this question came up.

Thank you

Scott

 

[rardoin]

Scott, I’m uncertain how long you have been shooting F-class but, in the beginning, I also used a wedge pad under my chest for support. Without it I felt that my cervical spine issues would make it impossible to shoot without the support. It was also pointed out to me that it’s use could be protested at larger matches. I intentionally left it at home on my first trip to the Berger SWN and realized I really didn’t need it. It took me a year to get comfortable enough to ditch it. Will you be protested…probably not unless you win. Definitely make sure the pillow doesn’t make grooves for your body to slide in. LOL

 

[Fuj]

Well here's a thought.....How does that rule apply to a women wearing
a thickly padded bra ?? I mean, is there a gender clause in the rule ??
I'm not telling ya' to start wearing padded triple "D's" under your shirt
but it would sure get the rules committee in a bunch......LOL Which does
ask a question in the rule. What if the chest support is actually part of
your attire ?? Lets say you wear a ballistic vest under your shirt. It would
not be part of your ground equipment, but personal clothing ?? Like every
thing, it's debatable until a rule says it is not.......

 

[Rocketvapor]

OR a heavy coat during the winter?

 

[chkunz]

I was thinking about the origin and purpose for the creation of F Class and it seem like the spirit of the creation has been lost as the sport has evolved.

 

[jackieschmidt]

I do not participate in F-Class, but do keep up with it.

Wasn’t there a “knock Down Drag out” discussion a while back about what constituted a “legal” mat that the shooter could lay on the ground?

As an outsider looking in, it would appear that every rule regulating a particular shooting Discipline does serve a purpose and while might seem trivial at first glance, are in fact well thought out to insure an even playing field for all participants.

 

[Scott H]

Scott, I’m uncertain how long you have been shooting F-class but, in the beginning, I also used a wedge pad under my chest for support. Without it I felt that my cervical spine issues would make it impossible to shoot without the support. It was also pointed out to me that it’s use could be protested at larger matches. I intentionally left it at home on my first trip to the Berger SWN and realized I really didn’t need it. It took me a year to get comfortable enough to ditch it. Will you be protested…probably not unless you win. Definitely make sure the pillow doesn’t make grooves for your body to slide in. LOL

I have been shooting F-Class a little over 6 years now. Never used a pad until this year because of a back muscle strain, which is fine now. The pad just makes it so much more comfortable to shoot. I do not need it and will stop using it. The 2 NRA sanctioned matches I didn't place for medals so that could be the "why" for not being called out on it. This last match where it was mentioned, all the shooters and MD there were great and am glad it was mentioned because I didn't know that was an issue.

It would be nice to have clearer rules to eliminate these type of questions but that could lead to writing a 800 page book that nobody would read.

Scott

 

[XTR]

Personally, my thoughts on this and many other questions in F class is “if you feel the need to ask don’t do it”. . I like that the F class rules are simple, we as competitors will be the ones that force it to be complicated. If you want to see where this ends up go look at Service Rifle

I’ve seen a guy use a cot mattress for a mat, I’ve seen more than a few use pillows, then there is carpet under the bipod.

As noted above, there is a process (albeit a poor one in today’s NRA) for exceptions.

 

[chkunz]

Here is another thought. I recently shot a 1000 yard NRA prone match (any/any with coat and sling) but due to some health issues I could not get in the legal position with coat and sling. I got permission from the Match Director to shoot "out of competition" so my scores were not posted or sent into the NRA. But I was able to shoot and have fun and no one lost their mind.

 

[Dave M.]

Question for the F-Class rules experts.

I have a seat cushion that is folded in half and put under my chest when shooting.

I use this to help take stress off my lower back.

I have used this at 2 NRA sanctioned events and never questioned about it or called out for illegal equipment.

Today at a non sanctioned event, it was mentioned to me that it was illegal equipment. "Artificial support for the chest"?
They did not stop me from using it, but just a reference for future matches to prevent issues or DQ. MD was very nice about it but did bring it up.

All I can find in the F-Class rules is as follows:

3.10 Ground Cloth or Ground Pad— A competitor may use one or more
ground cloths or ground pads if they are not constructed or used in a manner
to provide artificial support.

5.2 Artificial Support—Any supporting surface except the ground not
specifically authorized for use in the Rules for the position prescribed. Dig-
ging of elbow or heel holes at the firing points which form artificial support
for the elbows, arms, or legs is prohibited. Use of artificial support, including
back braces, is prohibited except as individually authorized by NRA for a
physically handicapped shooter.

So if the chest pad is not allowed, how is it different from bags or towels placed under elbows for shooting positions or for your hand for joystick stabilizing?

Your thoughts on this please.

THX

Scott

Legal

 

[TylerFromMS]

Legal until you beat someone that thinks you shouldn't have beat them and is friends with the match director. Then double illegal.

 

[rardoin]

Legal until you beat someone that thinks you shouldn't have beat them and is friends with the match director. Then double illegal.

Lil’ eagle!