California AB962 PASSES!

[Phil3]

All,

The horrible California Assembly bill AB962 was signed by the governor. This means, amongst other restrictions, no mail order or Internet ordering of ammunition that is 'principally' used for a handgun. You can still get handgun ammunition, if you wish to provide personal information and a thumbprint.

How does this affect benchrest guys? More manufacturers will simply not sell ANYTHING ammo related to California, even though it may be legal. They are just not willing to risk violating some law, or dealing with the complexities of CA regulations. This is already particularly true with AR parts and guns. This bill is written in such a way, where it is easy to see vendors steering clear of anything ammo related.

www.calguns.net fought this very hard, and is mounting a counter offensive, but we are just outnumbered, and the governor is hardly any friend of the 2A. Given the high number of people who refuse to give a thumbprint to buy ammo, expect hoarding. I know I will be, although I don't want to. I can stop doing that when I manage to leave this God forsaken place,CA).

Law goes into effect 2/1/2011. And as they say,'As California goes, so goes the country'.

- Phil

 

[afy]

Even though I live in France, where the gun laws are more restrictive than the US, I thank my stars that the law is not this stupid.

This is amongst the most idiotic laws I have seen, my heart goes out to the folks in the People Republik of Kalifornia.

 

[patriot]

Well, I'm sorry California just got a little more unbearable. But we didn’t need the cheerful thought,'And as they say,'As California goes, so goes the country''.

Maybe that is what they say in California, but I'd put it right up there with the arrogant New York City sentiment,'…the rest of the country will follow suit'.

We dumb ole folks in the middle of this here country just meander around until the beacons of wisdom from the coasts illuminate our preordained destiny.

Mark

Run Forrest, Run.

 

[Phil3]

California has 'led' in numerous efforts I am hardly proud of, that ultimately filtered down to other states through Federal mandates. The comment was not meant to be an insult to any, just more of a warning that other states may hold it up as a model for more gun control. You think I want to be in this state?!

- Phil

[/QUOTE]

 

[patriot]

We've made great progress with gun rights in most of the country:
* Conceal Carry implemented and restrictions reduced
* Second Amendment ruled an individual right
* Clinton Assault Weapon Ban expired
* Right to Carry in Federal Parks where States permit the same
* Simplified background checks
* State Rights reclaimed for intra-state manufacture
* Hunting Lands protected
* OSHA ammo and reloading sneak attack exposed
* UN Gun Ban Treaty ignored

Thanks to the vigilance and efforts of a great many people we are headed in the opposite direction of California; a momentum we must maintain at all costs.

Mark

Clinging to Guns and Religion

 

[j_22250]

just goes to show you that anti-gun people are never satisfied. when you give in jst a little they keep coming at you trying to take more. it's real unfortunate that handguns seem to be the best weapons of choice for use in crimes. maybe once ammo becomes obsolete they'll start to take away baseball bats etc.

ofcourse there are ways to get around this law like driving out of state to buy ammo or switching to say a shotgun for home defense, but that is way beside the point.

i can see where taking ammo away may seem like a simple solution without infringing on our second ammendment rights, but a better solution would be tougher punishment for gangbangers caught with unlawful carry of weapons. maybe if thugs were so scared of getting caught they wouldn't rob convinence stores or commit other crimes. maybe government/law enforcment agencies should start cracking down on the actuall problem instead of beating around the bush with possible solutions that aren't gonna really help.

the only people this law is gonna help is the anti-gun people. this could make it much easier for them to try and pass simular laws in other states.

 

[Phil3]

I am pleased to say that two measures are underway right now, to one, repeal AB962 and the other is court based. The latter looks reasonably promising. I hope so. Even though only handgun ammo is affected, Cabelas is already saying that they will cut off all ammo sales to CA with this law. I am sure there will be others.

- Phil

 

[Forum Boss]

A couple thoughts about AB 962, in my opinion...

Ammo IS embraced by the constitutional right to keep and bear arms under the 2d Amendment. Why? Consider this, the Revolutionary War began when the British marched to seize a storage center for arms, powder, and shot. The Brits wanted the arms, but they were just as interested in the powder and projectiles. Historically you can't separate gov't seizure of arms from government restriction of ammunition -- it was one and the same at Lexington and Concord.

Given this history, the founding fathers would think it absurd that citizens would have a right to arms, but not to powder and bullets. The founders weren't stupid. They knew that arms were useless if the government is allowed to seize and confiscate ammunition supplies.

EFFECTS
1. EXPECT more robberies -- Bad guys too lazy to drive to Nevada will now get their ammo by BREAKING into and robbing homes and gun stores.

2. EXPECT gang-controlled smuggling operations to start -- California has now created a new industry for the gangs, along with drug-running. We can expect gangs,and organized crime) to get into the ammo-smuggling market.

3. EXPECT Gun Shops to suffer -- This law will impact California reloaders,even those who don't buy packaged ammo) because it will increase overhead costs for gun stores. They will have to pass those costs along, and will probably do it across their entire product line.

4. EXPECT more extreme laws soon -- The gun-banners won't stop here. Emboldened by the passage of AB 962, you can bet they will try to stiffen the law by limiting the amount of ammo one can purchase,there was such a clause in the original AB 962 text), and by adding new qualifying requirements,maybe a 'pyschological exam' will be required before you can purchase). Eventually you may have to pay the state $1000/year for a license to purchase ammo.

Meanwhile 12% of California's convicted criminals are non-citizens, and the state's politicians, including Kevin DeLeon, author of AB 962, are doing NOTHING to stem the tide of illegal immigration.

Interestingly, this law will require hundreds of thousands of man-hours of record keeping, yet it provides no funding source.

 

[Phil3]

A few notations.

While I agree that firearms and ammo should be treated equally and are part and parcel of the same right as envisioned by the founding fathers, AB962 does not impose any restrictions beyond what already exists for firearms. Fact is, ammo will still be easier to obtain than firearms in CA.

I agree on #1 and 2, but I am not sure on #3. Many reloaders, such as myself, never bought reloading components from a local store. It is possible MORE ammo customers may be forced into stores, now that Internet sales are shut down. For handgun ammo only. It is possible the extra paperwork hassle may produce higher costs for the store.

On #4, the original bill limited transfers of handgun ammo between non-FFL or unlicensed parties, such as between two shooting friends. You could not give your buddy 51 rounds of handgun ammo in a month. There was no limit on the amount of ammo you could buy from a store or other retailer. I agree, the approach by the opposition is death by a thousand cuts, and it is an effective strategy. However, we can do the same, and are,www.calguns.net).

Have you seen De Leon's district? No way he is touching immigration. He won the last election with 82% of the vote, despite about 58% being Democratic registered. He is not going anywhere.

The sinister part of De Leon's bill is that it 'sound good', yet creates another problem,black markets, etc.), which now give him another 'problem' to solve, while simultaneously strangling againlaw abiding citizen's gun rights.

All the record keeping is by the store, no skin off California's back. Just more business crushing regulations.

- Phil