Calibers to fill in a mid-range gap

[centershot]

What is the improvement in velocity for a .223 AI over a standard .223? 100 fps? How close does a .223 AI come to a .22BR?

 

[searcher]

Because you want simple to load for and availability of good brass - I'd go straight .223 as the easy to load for gun (of course your 20 Practical will do anything it will with the lighter bullets- as well as most of what the 22/250 will do). For long range, the 6BR will outdo any of the others you list. Be sure to go heavy and put a nice brake on it if you expect to see hits well - same for the 22 BR. Then again, brakes improve just about ANY varmint caliber as far as viewing the action. In the 6BR, you can run light 58 V-Maxes all the way up to your 105's for super long range.

 

[justinp61]

I have a Savage Model 12FVSS 22-250 in a Stockade Elk Stalker stock with a Leupold VX3 6.5-20 X 40 with a varmint hunter reticle. With a 55gr Sierra Gameking this rifle kills several ground hogs ever year over 400 yards. My longest to date is 446 yards. At 100 yards it will shoot tiny groups.

 

[fredo]

Being that I have a small stable of fire-breathin' dragons, my latest project is a 6x45AI bolt gun to goof around with. Hope its as fun & easy to load for as my former 6x45s, and should allow a bazillion rounds of barrel life. The appeal of building a PPC is there, but wanted to make due with components on hand.
That's the beauty of wildcatting, there's something out there for everyone! Just gotta convince yourself that you need it, and that ain't too hard!!! Specially with threads like these to mull over... 8)

 

[MQ1]

Since you are single feeding, I'd seriously consider a 12 Twist 22BR and either a 6x47 Lapua, a .243, or 6mm Remington in an 8 twist.

The 22BR is an amazingly accurate and easy to load cartridge...you can do no wrong with this choice.

The 6mm choices are more about barrel life IMHO. My 6x47L shot on par with my .243 with a little less powder (but not enough to really matter if you ask me)...it also fed as well as my .243 in repeater form. In any case, I don't think you can make a bad choice here either....243 brass is more plentiful with more choices, if that matters at all to you.

Good luck making a decision. ;D

MQ1

 

[muleystalker]

fredo, what are the specs you are going to use on your 6x45AI ? I'm in the process of building a 6x45 know and was wondering if anyone has done an AI version. I was going to recommend this cartridge tot the OP. My friend built one and we were rock chuck hunting in Nv. a couple months ago, I was really impressed with the results. He sot one at 580 yards with 95 gr. SMK. he says he's getting about 2950 or 3000fps with them. when you run the ballistics on that load it is very impressive for a round built on the .223 case. he's working on some loads right now for the 87gr. V-max. Easy to load for for and fairly economical. great barrel life and a good little deer gun.

 

[DR1586]

Everyone should own a 223, they're easy to load for, they cost very little, and they perform great.

That being said, if you want to channel your inner Robert Frost and take the path less traveled by, then take a look at the 22 Creedmoor, 22 Dasher or if you want to turn great barrels in to tomato stakes and critters into mist, look at the 22-284.

In all seriousness, a fast twist 223 is a great all around rifle. You can still shoot varmint bullets out if it, but also the heavier bullets for better long range performance.

 

[Brians356]

What you need is a good quarter bore. The 257 Roberts is a classic option.

+1. !!

250-3000 AI. The prettiest little cartridge you'll lay eyes on. Fireform bulletless from 22-250, for which premium brass is available if your prefer. The most efficient and useful Ackley improved he ever devised! It is only 100 fps short of the 257 Roberts AI with 75-87 grain bullets, using a lot less powder. Example (Sierra data, 87-gr bullet, 26" barrels):

250 AI: 3400 fps from 41.9 grs RE-15
257 AI: 3500 fps from 46.0 grs RE-15

 

[Brians356]

I have a .250 Ackley Improved that shoots lights out that I think may be the ideal antelope/deer/varmint round all wrapped up in one. It is way more accurate than it should be in a factory re-chambered barrel.

++1.

87-gr TNT for chucks and coyotes, 100-gr BT for antelope and deer.

 

[Changeling]

Why worry about getting closer for a good shot :-[ Use the King of Commercial .22 rifles, 220 SWIFT with a 26" barrel 8)

You can Tenderize/Filet, blow off and heat tan the hide for a nice GROUND HOG RUG in front of your fireplace! What more could one ask for?

Accuracy = EXCELLENT Velocity 4000 fps +. DISTANCE = If you can see it, you can hit it 8)

 

[swd]

If you run the ballistics you'll find the 20 and 22 pretty much cover all the same territory. A 6 BR or 6 Dasher with a 1-8 will take you up a big step in performance. A legitimate 600-1000 yard rifle. I have the 6x45 Muleystalker mentioned. It's a fun and efficient little round. 2850-2900 with a 95 SMK. Easy on powder and barrels with an endless supply of brass and very mild to shoot with surprisingly good performance.

And hey Bro, that rock chuck was 640 ;D

 

[muleystalker]

I knew it was out there, the 580 was the one before that. It was a rough weekend, everything kind of blurred together brother, on top of it the Heat was hell. lol

 

[fredo]

fredo, what are the specs you are going to use on your 6x45AI ? I'm in the process of building a 6x45 know and was wondering if anyone has done an AI version. I was going to recommend this cartridge tot the OP. My friend built one and we were rock chuck hunting in Nv. a couple months ago, I was really impressed with the results. He sot one at 580 yards with 95 gr. SMK. he says he's getting about 2950 or 3000fps with them. when you run the ballistics on that load it is very impressive for a round built on the .223 case. he's working on some loads right now for the 87gr. V-max. Easy to load for for and fairly economical. great barrel life and a good little deer gun.

muley, built that 6x45AI on a Seven action w/PT&G bolt (.062"pin), 22" Krieger #4, 1:8tw.
Chamber is .267"nk, .050"FB. (.223 Lapua brass necks needs turned down to .011")
Dropped in a Micky Gamescout from my old .22-243Win, but had Joe Ducos install KMW adjustable cheekpiece on it, came out great! And I installed PT&G's new Model Seven DBM to run Accurate 5rd steel .223 mags...

for comparison, here's a 71gr Berger FF load, and formed case. Avg. h20 capacity of formed Lapua .223 cases is 32.4gr:

Tried 95SMKs, but @ 2.500", they were too long to want to feed well. Loaded single shot, they were cloverleafing @ 2800fps & bangin' steel @ 550yds easily...

Using QL, found a GREAT load quickly with 87gr Vmaxs & H322, running 2835fps. Seated .010" off the lands @ 2.310", they feed smooth enough for field use. Whacked a couple 'chucks with those 87s and they smack the crapola outta them...

With about 250rds thru it now, I'm very pleased with the 6x45AI! Fun factor is waay high!!! Quite accurate and very economical to feed, which is just what I was wanting it to for. Can't say its a HUGE improvement over the 6x45, as I've been a fan of that round for a while! But I'll look forward to never having to trim a huge batch of cases, that alone is worth the price of admission. And a couple extra grains of capacity don't hurt...

Oh yeah, I'm using Redding Type S .223AI dies. .264 bushing to size fired cases, and the Comp Seater works fine, just backed it out of the press an extra turn. Might could swap the seater plug out, but its working well enough now...

Good luck & have fun!

 

[Tommie]

As others have posted, the 250-3000AI is a truly wonderful cartridge. Superbly balanced. Years ago the bullet selection was pretty slim but that's all in the past.

 

[swd]

Fredo, what powders have you tried? So far in my standard 6x45 with 95 SMK's I've tried CFE223, H4895 and Varget. CFE and 4895 both get 2800-2900 out of a 26" barrel with no ejector marks and primer pockets that last pretty well. Varget only made 2600.

 

[fredo]

swd, thanks for sharing that info, was just about to ask you!
Only have tested with tried&true 2015, along with H322. 2015 is just dandy for mid-weight bullets, and will stick with it for fireforming/volume p-dog ammo. Those old 71gr Berges shot really well, and I've got a ton of 70Blitzkings to load. They were $$$ in my straight 6x45s...

Two other powders that stuck out on QL were H4895 and Varget. Glad to read you had good success with h4895, got a couple lbs of that to mess with! All in all, I'm content with the 87Vmax @2835fps from a 22" barrel. Gonna keep loading this batch of 100 Lapua brass with the H322 til they poop the bed...

I'm wondering if my feeding 'issues' with the 95SMKs is due to that Seven action originally being a SAUM? When I seat the 95SMKs @ 2.500", the tip of the bullet passes right over action's feed ramp. By the time the ogive area of the bullet contacts the ramp & starts UP toward the chamber, the bullet tip is soon hitting into the rear face of the barrel, below the chamber. Did try opening up the feed lips of the magazine, but that didn't help. The 87Vmax (and lighter weight bullets) engage the feed ramp earlier in the bolt cycle, and have no problem feeding...

Welcome to suggestions from anyone!?!

 

[Beruisis]

+1 for the quarter bore: 250 Savage!

 

[5spd]

22x6.8
6x6.8
6x45
Those are what I have and not a single problem in making cases or the case life and I don't use lapua brass. No problems to 700 yards w/any of them.
80-95g in the 6x45 is the perfect match antelope size game.
55g in the 6x6.8 is the one for p-dogs & coyote to 700 yards. 80-95g for antelope does it all & covers the .243 arena w/less powder.
55g in the 22x6.8 matches a 22-250 in speed or better and p-dogs from 50-700 yards are easy. That covers the .222 to 22-250 speeds weights.
All built on Savage SA actions by me.
All are with a heavy sporter/light varmint bbl 22" long, what else is needed...nothing!

 

[fredo]

swd, and any QL aficionados...

Here's screenshot of chamber pressure diagram from QL for my 6x45AI load. Using 6/TCU as default case , with trued h20 capacity from my Lapua brass & c.o.a.l. for 87Vmax (-.010" off)

Pmax/ z1 relationship is very close, that's what I like to see! Put another 100rds thru with this load, and it continues to shoot extremely well. QL projected velocity is spot on with field measurements from Magnetospeed v3 , averaging 2830fps with single digit ES.

Just another one of those instances where QL helped streamline load development for a wildcat!

 

[JarheadAZ]

I'm a solid fan of the .223, and might be considering a 6.5x47 barrel for my Savage Custom LR rifle, which currently bears an L-W 28" .260 Rem barrel. While I'm at it, a 1:9" .22-250 barrel could make for a nice trio.

The .22-250 doesn't need to be a barrel burner if one is willing to explore it as a step up from .223 performance without loading it completely up to the hilt.

Greg