Best Single Stage Press

[DJ111]

Hi,
I am having trouble with bullet run out and I think it is being caused by my press. It is a RCBS Rock Chucker and the ram is loose and I can see it move at the end of the stroke. It works fine for varmint loads but .006'' run out is not going to cut it for bench work. I would like to stay with a single stage as I do not want to buy an Arbor press and dies quite yet. It also shows neck run out up to .003'' so I believe it is the press.

What will be the best press to buy that will have the least amount of bullet run out figuring the dies are good?

Thanks,
Dallas

 

[rustycj8]

Dallas, seems to me you're looking for a Forster Co-Ax press. Its design lends itself to centering to the die. I have not taken any measurements to prove it but maybe somebody else with more experience can help.

 

[DJ111]

Thanks for the suggestion, it looks like a very nice press. Has anyone used the Harrel's Compact Press?

Dallas

 

[6BR]

DJ, I would recommend using an Harbor press and use a Wilson Seating die. Your run-out problem will go away quick. I use these both the Harbor press and Wilson Seater die and I love them both.

 

[BoydAllen]

I think that you are incorrect in your assumption that a loose ram fit is the culprit that is causing your runout. One of the outstanding 1-200 yd Benchrest shooters in Texas, Jackie Schmidt, uses presses that have had their rams turned down slightly to let the cases self align with the dies.

Invariably the problem that you describe is caused by reloading dies, specifically, standard type FL dies with expander balls, and the seaters that are usually paired with them. What caliber and dies are you using? Another thing, if necks are unturned,even if the dies are perfect there will be runout on the bullet equal to the runout in case neck thickness. In this situation you should measure the thickness runout of your necks only attribute the amount over that to your sizing and seating setup.

 

[DJ111]

Thanks for the ideas, it looks like I need to look more into my dies as I am using the expanders in them.

Question now is how are most people going about their decapping of primers if they are not using the decapping and expander assembly?

Thanks,
Dallas

 

[GermanS1]

Dallas, your starting point should be what Boyd wrote - without perfect brass, runout will always be random and related to neck thickness variance. The sizing and seating dies also have quite an influence on total runout, that's a big topic by itself. How dies are set up is yet another topic, one quick tip is to put an O-ring under the die's lock ring to allow it to move a bit when the case goes in. I use the #17 O-ring from Ace hardware. It should be set up to compress about 1/4 turn.

The Rockchucker that you're using is my favorite press. I've had a number of Rockchuckers over the years, there are three in my shop right now. They have excelent leverage for normal reloading tasks, they're reasonably sized and the quality level is very good.

As to your last question,decapping) I do it with the full length sizing die.

An examination of what dies you're using, what brass, what caliber and for what purpose will probably generate a good deal of useful discussion here. The press is probably the least of your worries when it's all examined.

 

[Winchester69]

...the ram is loose and I can see it move at the end of the stroke. It works fine for varmint loads, but .006'' run out is not going to cut it for bench work.... It also shows neck run out up to .003'', so I believe it is the press.

While some compliance can be beneficial to the loading process, and it may be possible to effectively introduce it through tolerance in the ram, visible movement due to wear will drive the working force off center. Whether your run-out is due to wear or due to the die's expander is something that must be determined. Straightening the stem on the die and allowing compliance,looseness) in the button/stem may alleviate your problem.

If it develops that the cause is due to the worn press, and you can try your dies on a friend's press to make this determination, RCBS can fit an oversized ram. How successful they will be in centering the new ram is a question in my mind. However, the price should be right.

Should you eventually decide on a new press, take a look at Redding's offerings if you want another O-frame.

Regarding your de-capping question, a separate universal de-capping die will suffice. However, depending on the brand of your die, some makers have replacement spacers to eliminate the expander. Using a smaller caliber expander does the same thing. Off-press de-capping, using a punch and base, is another approach. It has the benefit of keeping your press clean, reducing ram wear.

 

[Clark]

Don't spend 10 years of you life with a Rockchucker and THEN pay for a Forster Co-Ax, like I did.

Get the Co-ax now, and let the Rockchucker gather dust for 10 years.

 

[stiles]

If you can, use a CO-AX first before you buy, the ergonomics of that press is just different. I like the Redding Big Boss II as a standard cast iron O press.

Neil Jones makes a had operated decapper.

 

[kevinbritvec]

I stopped decapping on my main presses years ago. As soon as I return from the range I run the brass through a dedicated Lee $15.00 C press with a decapping die and all that carbon and spent primers goes in a box located right underneath it. The I thow them in the tumbler right away. Keeps that crap away from the good presses and cleans the brass ASAP.

I've also gone to using Sinclair's or K&M neck turning mandrels for expanders, instead of the ball and pin set-up that dies come with. Then longer expanders come in several sizes and if you want you can spin them smaller. The length of the these expanders help uniform the neck tension better because the entire neck is inside 100% of the way. It's just a better way to go. I always had fits trying to get standard die's pins and expander plugs centered when addressing the neck. Now I don't have to worry about it.

 

[Winchester69]

If you can, use a CO-AX first before you buy; the ergonomics of that press is just different. I like the Redding Big Boss II as a standard cast iron O press.

I myself have a fascination with the Redding turret press. Yet, its virtue is in its implementation; there are so many opportunities for introducing inaccuracy,variation) during its manufacture. From a practical standpoint, I own and use the Baby Boss because of its smaller size,ergonomics) and minimalist design, requiring fewer machining operations in its production.

I have long thought that the attraction of the Co-Ax is more illusory than having anything to do with either its capabilities or ergonomics. I believe it is the impression that the user has of it. Some like it; some can leave it. I attribute that difference to the perceiver's admiration for either simplicity or complexity. Those who are fascinated by the intricacies of this H-frame design can find no fault with it. Those who appreciate a simpler design find little attraction.

My theory, and I'm sticking to it. This is my reason for advising people to buy the one that appeals to them.
.

 

[Mikem]

I have done some rather extensive testing concerning case runout, and the conclusion was that most neck runout is inherently in the case its self, imparted there by the annealing proses.

This is easy for you to test your self, if you have a concentricity micrometer. I bought one, but returned it as it was not well designed, and made my own, with a Starrett dial indicator and two custom V blocks, and its much more accurate, and easier to operate. But cost more.

How to test:
Reload a round your normal way, then check its runout after loading, and using a permanent marker, place a dot on the high side of the case neck. Then fire it, and reload it a second time, now take its runout reading and again mark the necks high side. You will find the two marks are vary close, if not in the exact same place. By rotating the case 180 deg in the die the second time, you will eliminated the press, and dies. But the high side of the case neck will always be in the same place as you marked. So it has to be in the brass composition or the annealing process.

 

[NRV]

I don't have what is considered top end equipment, but my measured run out has been what I consider very acceptable. I enjoy shooting and hunting, but financially have to 'make do' with the items I have. That being said, I seem to average .002 - .003 run out, with most rounds being less than that using a Lee Classic Cast press and Lee Collet sizer and Hornady seater dies. I think what helped my setup is that I converted my press to use the Hornady Lock-N-Load bushings. Each bushing has an o-ring which allows the die some side to side movement to self align with the case.

I don't have a neck turning setup, so I believe that the collet dies are the next best solution, as they size the case neck from the inside. Neck tension may not be uniform, but the bullet is straight in the case. I also found that sizing during the same session as seating seems to make the seating operation 'feel' more uniform.

Sorry for the lack of hard evidence, I just don't have the tools to measure these things. Just wanted to say that low run out is possible with less expensive equipment.

 

[leakeyjohn]

Your inquiry asks which is "best"? I would hestitate and respond RCBS but then immediately I relalized best has many flavors

1. cost
2. number of cartridges to be be reloaeded
3. length of case
4. do you intend to use it in a fixed location or mobile
4. what quantity of cartridges will be reload

 

[Conaso]

What LeakyJohn says!

Build yourself a matrix and do your research...

Fourteen Reloading Presses Compared: Single-Stage Shootout – Ultimate Reloader

ultimatereloader.com

reloading press « Search Results « Daily Bulletin

bulletin.accurateshooter.com

The Best Reloading Presses | American Firearms

History always repeats itself regarding ammunition shortages in times of civil unrest, political turmoil, and pandemics. We have seen it repeatedly, and without fail, ammunition is one of the first resources to disappear. When these events occur, it’s handy to be able to reload your ammunition...

www.americanfirearms.org

 

[M-61]

Thanks for the ideas, it looks like I need to look more into my dies as I am using the expanders in them.

Question now is how are most people going about their decapping of primers if they are not using the decapping and expander assembly?

Thanks,
Dallas

No clue what most people use.
I use a pin punch and a hammer.
Gives another look at the brass also. Plus I’m never in a rush.

 

[sqrlgtr]

I use a Harvey hand deprimer, it allows me to deprime whenever or wherever I want/need too, plus the benefits M-61 mentioned above. I like the Rock Chucker to size with but use an arbor press and dies to seat with. Will add anything that has necks turned goes through redding bushing die, anything that doesnt get turned usally goes through lee collet die with the use of redding body die.

 

[3Ackleys]

Your inquiry asks which is "best"? I would hestitate and respond RCBS but then immediately I relalized best has many flavors

1. cost
2. number of cartridges to be be reloaeded
3. length of case
4. do you intend to use it in a fixed location or mobile
4. what quantity of cartridges will be reload

His "inquiry" was posted 14 years ago. Probably figured it out...

 

[Conaso]

Missed that date...

Although, leakeyjohn's response it's a good answer to an often-asked question.