Berger 105s sorted lengths

[Link]

With that measurement, were you measuring from the base of the cartridge to the o'give?

I am measuring the o'give to the base of the bullet to compare the bearing surfaces. I didn't take the boattail into consideration as they all appear to be close to the same.

Don

 

[Mega]

I think you might need to rethink you measurement method. No 105gr VLD measures anywhere near what you mention even from base to meplat. Ogive to Base doesn't give you a bearing surface measurement either. I'm lost as to what you are measuring, perhaps any insert you are using in Calipres as well.

 

[timeout]

Sounds l

I think you might need to rethink you measurement method. No 105gr VLD measures anywhere near what you mention even from base to meplat. Ogive to Base doesn't give you a bearing surface measurement either. I'm lost as to what you are measuring, perhaps any insert you are using in Calipres as well.

I think he may not be zeroing the caliper when the caliber specific "gizmo" is installed. I never zero mine when set up to check seating depth. As long as I know that length is always included in my measurements it's all good.

 

[Link]

I think you might need to rethink you measurement method. No 105gr VLD measures anywhere near what you mention even from base to meplat. Ogive to Base doesn't give you a bearing surface measurement either. I'm lost as to what you are measuring, perhaps any insert you are using in Calipres as well.

I am using a Sinclair comparator block so we have to subtract 1 inch from the given measurement. I assumed this is how everyone did it, and that is why most everyone else knew what was going on. Sorry for the confusion.
Thank you for your input Don

 

[1shot]

Sounds l

I think he may not be zeroing the caliper when the caliber specific "gizmo" is installed. I never zero mine when set up to check seating depth. As long as I know that length is always included in my measurements it's all good.

I used to do the exact same thing, figuring I’m the only one seeing the numbers. UNTIL I started sharing like data with others. Then it became giant PITA. Now I zero whatever measurement device in using to my “gizmo” and we can all share comparative data.
I hope this helps,

Lloyd

 

[barefooter56]

So, who told you that? Was it Berger or just some unreliable source? If your source is correct Berger will join the ranks of the mediocre. I hope your source is wrong. Maybe a Berger rep will chime in.

Berger Bullets does not mix lots. Never has. Never will.

 

[barefooter56]

My bullets are lot #2810. The partial box of 45 all measure between .537 to .539 base to ogive length when measured with my Sinclair comparator. The bulk of the bullets are .538. In my honest opinion they are from 3 different lots.

We use only the highest quality copper and lead available to eliminate impurities or other material issues. Our material vendors have been in their industry for decades. We have regular meetings at their facility and ours to refresh our mutual understanding of our highest material quality requirements.

Our bullet weight tolerances are listed below. The actual results are usually tighter than these tolerances allow:

• 17 Cal to 30 Cal: +/- 0.2 gr
• 338 Cal: +/- 0.3 gr

Our bullet base to ogive tolerances are listed below. It is important to note that measuring this dimension is difficult as the point of contact is a thin and rounded surface. If you find measurements greater than the tolerances listed below please measure the same 10 bullets several times to confirm that your measuring device is reliable and repeatable (many on the market are not). We use a specially developed process which includes custom made gauges to ensure reliable and repeatable measurements. Most reports of bullets outside this tolerance are found to be the result of how they are measured:

• 20 gr to 115 gr: 0.003 ES
• 120 gr to 210 gr: 0.005 ES

All jackets, cores and bullets within a given lot are made with one die to guarantee consistency.

Each bullet is made on a die that is designated for that bullet. This die is set aside and used again for all lots until this one die wears out.

All tooling is precision made using dimensional tolerances in the .00005. Using precision-made tooling is an absolute requirement. The companies who make our tooling are specifically in the precision tooling business. We meet with them regularly to communicate our tooling needs and special projects. Those who understand precision tool making know that these things are possible but not without deliberate effort and experience.

Please remeasure your bullets as described above. If you find there still id an issue please contact us at 660-460-2802 from 8am to 4:30pm MON thru FRI. We will get you taken care of.

 

[urbanrifleman]

Weigh your primers!!!

 

[barefooter56]

I am using a Sinclair comparator block so we have to subtract 1 inch from the given measurement. I assumed this is how everyone did it, and that is why most everyone else knew what was going on. Sorry for the confusion.
Thank you for your input Don

Link,
When you are using the SINCLAIR NUT comparator you have to be careful of how much pressure you apply to the bullet with the caliper jaw while measuring. Try to be as consistent as possible. Also I suggest you use a "HORNADY ANVIL" unit on the jaw the base of the bullet sits on. Bullet bases are not always perfectly flat and depending on how the jaw hits the base of the bullet this can change the measurement also. And the ANVIL makes it much easier to use the nut also because it gives a bigger base to set the bullet on instead of the skinny jaw face. Also a "budget" caliper can be as .001 to .002 off in its measurements in many cases.

 

[BenPerfected]

Link,
When you are using the SINCLAIR NUT comparator you have to be careful of how much pressure you apply to the bullet with the caliper jaw while measuring. Try to be as consistent as possible. Also I suggest you use a "HORNADY ANVIL" unit on the jaw the base of the bullet sits on. Bullet bases are not always perfectly flat and depending on how the jaw hits the base of the bullet this can change the measurement also. And the ANVIL makes it much easier to use the nut also because it gives a bigger base to set the bullet on instead of the skinny jaw face. Also a "budget" caliper can be as .001 to .002 off in its measurements in many cases.

IMO, todays Berger 6mm 105gn Hunting bullets are so close to perfect, the sort is mostly about just looking for the few outliers. I doubt any 6mm bullet is more consistent.
Show me the money.....
Ben

 

[jsthntn247]

I had some 200’s in different lots that had big differences in bto and overall length. One lot shot almost 1 minute higher than the other.

 

[Link]

Again I'm not complaining just stating what I found. The ogive is a little different as I had to adjust my micrometer seater to get the same OAL. I talked to Berger tech and they were very informative. Nice people. This picture shows how I measure.----------------------------------

-thanks

 

[tuttlefarm]

Again I'm not complaining just stating what I found. The ogive is a little different as I had to adjust my micrometer seater to get the same OAL. I talked to Berger tech and they were very informative. Nice people. This picture shows how I measure.----------------------------------

-thanks

Sorry but those nuts are worthless, get another style with a dial indicator setup....

 

[Capt. Oblivious]

were these FACTORY sealed boxes ?
if not, i think you bought his culls.
my 30 115's are so consistent, i quit sorting.

Reason I stopped buying bullets from other people, if the seal is open Ill rather spend more and buy from a vendor. I tried to class a 1000 x 105gr HVLDs, my equipment can measure the difference so I rather spend that time shooting them. Think I found one or maybe 2 bullets out of the 200 or so I measured that was a little off but I doubt my wind reading can really split the difference.

 

[barefooter56]

I had some 200’s in different lots that had big differences in bto and overall length. One lot shot almost 1 minute higher than the other.

The specifications we use are for A LOT of bullets. Different lots of anything can have different dimensions or traits. A new lot of powder may be slightly faster or slower than your last lot. Your new lot of cartridge cases may have a little more or less volume capacity than your last lot. ETC. When ever you change lots of anything you need to drop the powder charge back and work back up. In your case what I believe was going on is that since one lot of bullets were longer . There was probably a little more bullet down in the cartridge case than the last lot. This increased your pressure / velocity. Both lots most likely seated to the same or very close to the same CBTO though correct?

 

[tmwinds]

Good day
I bought some 105 VLDs from a member, they seem to be in 3 different lengths from ojive to face.
Most measure 1.542 to 1.547 second to 1.565 to 1.570 . Then there a few that are 1.575 to 1.580.
they came in 2 boxes both marked lot 1357 what do you think happened? Maybe 3 different lots? 33 thousandths seems like a lot of variance. They all seem to weigh the same..

PS one lot measured 1.590 -+ What's with burger any how? The measurements are including the 1 inch ojive block. That makes a .050 difference from plus to minus.
thanks Don

I have found that within the same lot Berger bullets vary almost zero. Different lots will vary from other lots but will be consistent within that lot number. It seems I always have a few left from a given lot that is not enough to load the number needed for a match. Occasionally I will sort the left overs into sub lots and use for fire forming or practice rounds. It sounds like someone possibly sold you a combination of several lots. I always measure and recalculate my seating depth when changing lots. I also try to buy as many of the same lot as I can afford when ordering.

 

[#40Fan]

I can't believe how much these bullets have changed. I have an old box of 105's, lot #556, and they are all in the .636" range.

 

[Link]

I can't believe how much these bullets have changed. I have an old box of 105's, lot #556, and they are all in the .636" range.

What do your new ones measure?

 

[#40Fan]

I don't have any new ones. I bought a box of them to try years ago, but stuck with the 107 SMKs.