AR weights

[Halmccoyii]

I hate asking questions that may seem basic to experienced shooters, but I’m still fairly new and don’t have many people to bounce ideas off of, so I’d appreciate the input.

I’ve been working up loads for a Daniel Defense DDM4 V7 (16”) that I’m planning to use in a competition this May. I think I’ve found about as good a load as I’m going to get without changing barrels, so now I’m focusing on optimizing the rifle setup.

Recent changes:

• Upgraded trigger from Geissele SSA to SSA-E X
• Added a bag rider to my B5 Precision stock so the height matches my bolt gun
• Running a borrowed Arken EP5 (42 oz), which makes the rifle very rear-heavy—even with a suppressor

To address balance, I added 1.5 lbs of MDT weights as far forward as possible. The rifle now balances about 1.5” in front of the magwell.

There’s a lot of discussion online about adding weight to bolt guns and PRS rifles, and I’ve done that with my chassis bolt gun. This AR is being set up strictly for one bench-rest style event. After the match, I’ll return it to a lighter, more standard configuration (normal optic, no bag rider, no added weights).

My question:

Since a heavier rifle is generally considered beneficial off a bench, does that logic apply equally to an AR platform? Is there anything about the AR system that would make adding weight counterproductive?

For reference, I’m shooting off an Atlas bipod with a rear Protektor bag.

Sorry if this is a basic question — just trying to learn and think things through correctly.

Thanks in advance,

Hal II

 

[Canuckienns]

I shoot bench rest . 600 yards. Weight is good. a 16 inch barrel is not. 20 inch to 24 inch works the best, in both Ar15 and Ar10 platforms.

 

[Halmccoyii]

I shoot bench rest . 600 yards. Weight is good. a 16 inch barrel is not. 20 inch to 24 inch works the best, in both Ar15 and Ar10 platforms.

Definitely sub optimized for this event. But I really don’t use this rifle for that use but since AR was one of the classes, I thought I would make the best of what I had. Just wanted to make sure that I wasn’t doing anything that would actually make me worse.

Maybe I’ll build a long range AR sometime in the future.

Thanks for the input. I appreciate it.

Hal II

 

[ToddKS]

I am guessing you are going to The Blast at Flint Oak. The only thing that would make adding weight counterproductive in this case would be if it somehow adversely affected how you shoot the rifle and produced larger groups as a result.

 

[Halmccoyii]

I am guessing you are going to The Blast at Flint Oak. The only thing that would make adding weight counterproductive in this case would be if it somehow adversely affected how you shoot the rifle and produced larger groups as a result.

Great guess. Yes I am. Never done anything like that. I guess I’ll find out. I added some weights and will go out and shoot in a couple days. I was just asking in case someone said there was a reason it was a bad idea. Again I’m a total newbie so I figured I’d ask experienced people in case I was wasting my time. I have no illusions of being competitive, for sure in AR class, but didn’t want to embarrass myself.

Thanks a ton.

Hal II

 

[Rob01]

Shouldn’t be anything counterproductive at all for the weights being added. I threw a couple in the front of my 6ARc I shoot in PRS style matches and no issues with accuracy. I added a Kil-Spec steel arca rail to add a little more weight up front too.

 

[Fast14riot]

Fwiw, you can move your bipod to help the balance. Yes, a longer distance between contact points is more stable, however you can fine tune it to find the point where the gun recoils straight back and doesn't jump sideways on the bipod.

I tune the gas system to reduce felt recoil and gun jump. If you have an adjustable gas block, dial it down until you cannot cycle and then turn it back up just until it does. I tune all my ARs with standard springs and buffer weights this way.

Also, I've found that not all ARs behave the same with the same hold. Some like to be held hard, others like a little bit of freedom in recoil. If you have a modern smart phone, use the slo-motion video to capture it during recoil and cycling to see what it does.

 

[Tucker 7br]

I hate asking questions that may seem basic to experienced shooters, but I’m still fairly new and don’t have many people to bounce ideas off of, so I’d appreciate the input.

I’ve been working up loads for a Daniel Defense DDM4 V7 (16”) that I’m planning to use in a competition this May. I think I’ve found about as good a load as I’m going to get without changing barrels, so now I’m focusing on optimizing the rifle setup.

Recent changes:

• Upgraded trigger from Geissele SSA to SSA-E X
• Added a bag rider to my B5 Precision stock so the height matches my bolt gun
• Running a borrowed Arken EP5 (42 oz), which makes the rifle very rear-heavy—even with a suppressor

To address balance, I added 1.5 lbs of MDT weights as far forward as possible. The rifle now balances about 1.5” in front of the magwell.

There’s a lot of discussion online about adding weight to bolt guns and PRS rifles, and I’ve done that with my chassis bolt gun. This AR is being set up strictly for one bench-rest style event. After the match, I’ll return it to a lighter, more standard configuration (normal optic, no bag rider, no added weights).

My question:

Since a heavier rifle is generally considered beneficial off a bench, does that logic apply equally to an AR platform? Is there anything about the AR system that would make adding weight counterproductive?

For reference, I’m shooting off an Atlas bipod with a rear Protektor bag.

Sorry if this is a basic question — just trying to learn and think things through correctly.

Thanks in advance,

Hal II

I'll bite...how much does your rifle actually weigh? What is your 5 shot group sizes averaging? Be specific, with actually measurements please.

 

[Bat Rastard]

The Blast is a blast!

 

[Syncrowave]

Since a heavier rifle is generally considered beneficial off a bench, does that logic apply equally to an AR platform? Is there anything about the AR system that would make adding weight counterproductive?

Adding weight will always add "inertia" (in other words, require more force to start moving from a stationary position, and more energy to brake it once it's already moving) and therefore should make the rifle easier to shoot well, which is one reason why there are rules regarding max rifle weight for many competitive disciplines.

The only drawback I can think of is that a 90# rifle will make your muscles tire and quiver faster than a 9# rifle, but a) you shouldn't be holding it so long that your muscles start to tire and quiver, and b) you should be using a "bone supported" position as much as possible, which will minimize muscle shake trouble...

 

[Halmccoyii]

Shouldn’t be anything counterproductive at all for the weights being added. I threw a couple in the front of my 6ARc I shoot in PRS style matches and no issues with accuracy. I added a Kil-Spec steel arca rail to add a little more weight up front too.

View attachment 1743980

Thanks a bunch.

 

[Oso]

Side note: Arken is fat. Check your clearance/ access to the charging handle. I want it wide enough that I can hook it with one finger as I run it along scope body. I don’t want my access limited to to having to dig underneath scope to get a hold on handle. You may need to swap it out for something with extended wings to give adequate clearance around scope body. I only get as wide as I need… the crazy wide extended wings are just snag-o-matics waiting to happen

 

[Halmccoyii]

Adding weight will always add "inertia" (in other words, require more force to start moving from a stationary position, and more energy to brake it once it's already moving) and therefore should make the rifle easier to shoot well, which is one reason why there are rules regarding max rifle weight for many competitive disciplines.

The only drawback I can think of is that a 90# rifle will make your muscles tire and quiver faster than a 9# rifle, but a) you shouldn't be holding it so long that your muscles start to tire and quiver, and b) you should be using a "bone supported" position as much as possible, which will minimize muscle shake trouble...

Sorry. I didn’t do a good job asking the question. This is specifically for a bench rest type competition. This would be heavier than I would want to lug around and shoot. It is right at 14 lbs now with bipod. I assumed no problem but didn’t know if there was some reason a gas gun might act differently.

Thanks a bunch.

 

[Syncrowave]

Sorry. I didn’t do a good job asking the question. This is specifically for a bench rest type competition.

I would check the rule book for the competition you want to participate in, for any weight restrictions.

I assumed no problem but didn’t know if there was some reason a gas gun might act differently.

The only issue where weight might be a problem with a gas gun is if the gun is too light -- for example if you have a super light AR type rifle and then you try to shoot it from the hip or at arm's length, allowing the entire gun to thrash around enough that it doesn't cycle properly or completely. (Pistol shooters call this "limp wristing.")

 

[Halmccoyii]

Side note: Arken is fat. Check your clearance/ access to the charging handle. I want it wide enough that I can hook it with one finger as I run it along scope body. I don’t want my access limited to to having to dig underneath scope to get a hold on handle. You may need to swap it out for something with extended wings to give adequate clearance around scope body. I only get as wide as I need… the crazy wide extended wings are just snag-o-matics waiting to happen

Yes it is fat. All looks good. Access could be a little better but for this purpose I’m good. I won’t use the Arken after this event. I’ll go back to my normal optic for this rifle. Leupold Mark 4 2.5-10 normally lives on it.

I'll bite...how much does your rifle actually weigh? What is your 5 shot group sizes averaging? Be specific, with actually measurements please.

Now with bipod and added weights it is just barely over 14 pounds.

I haven’t shot it yet with weights and new trigger and bag rider that more aligns with my other rifles. I don’t measure a lot of 5 shot groups. Tend to shoot 10.

Groups I wouldn’t say are amazing. Last two were almost identical and I’m learning to shoot/drive the rifle better. 10 shot groups. 1.1” - 1.3”. In Both groups 9 were in .75 - .85 with the first shot being the outlier. Is that a cold bore, maybe, but really felt like me not getting settled into rifle and the bag. Mean radius of .33.

That not going to win anything but maybe close to as good as I get with this rifle. Though I do expect them to tighten up a little if I can get a little more comfortable behind it. Hoping bag rider helps. It sure feels like it on dry firing. Shooting tomorrow hopefully.

Below is pretty common. (Without 1st shot). Haha yes I should count it but I have with and without just no pic here with.

 

[Halmccoyii]

The Blast is a blast!

I’ve heard that. I’m excited. Buddy of mine talked me into it. Will be my first time shooting in any contest.

Maybe I’ll see you there.

 

[Halmccoyii]

I would check the rule book for the competition you want to participate in, for any weight restrictions.

The only issue where weight might cause a problem with a gas gun is if the gun is too light -- for example if you have a super light AR type rifle and then you try to shoot it offhand (for example), allowing the entire gun to thrash around enough that it doesn't cycle properly or completely. (Pistol shooters call this "limp wristing.")

No weight restrictions in this class.

That makes sense about being too light. In its normal config it’s not super light and terribly reliable.

Thanks a bunch.

 

[Bat Rastard]

I’ve heard that. I’m excited. Buddy of mine talked me into it. Will be my first time shooting in any contest.

Maybe I’ll see you there.

I look like my avatar, but older, lol,
I'll be shooting with my two sons. My name is Ken please say hello.
Be forewarned, I will invite you to shoot other stuff around Wichita.

 

[Halmccoyii]

I look like my avatar, but older, lol,
I'll be shooting with my two sons. My name is Ken please say hello.
Be forewarned, I will invite you to shoot other stuff around Wichita.

Haha. I will do that.

I would love to find other things to shoot at. I really on shoot by myself. I built a 200 yard range on one of our places east on 21st and have some longer places to shoot in the flint hills but really don't even know what goes on around here. I wouldn't even know where to look. But I've really enjoyed it and hand loading has become a good hobby but only learned it from the internet and AI quite frankly. Of course it takes a while to weed through the misinformation in both and a lot of trial and error.

Really looking forward to the Blast and just hoping to not embarrass myself. will be fun to see what real shooters can do.

 

[True Grit]

Haha. I will do that.

I would love to find other things to shoot at. I really on shoot by myself. I built a 200 yard range on one of our places east on 21st and have some longer places to shoot in the flint hills but really don't even know what goes on around here. I wouldn't even know where to look. But I've really enjoyed it and hand loading has become a good hobby but only learned it from the internet and AI quite frankly. Of course it takes a while to weed through the misinformation in both and a lot of trial and error.

Really looking forward to the Blast and just hoping to not embarrass myself. will be fun to see what real shooters can do.

This is going to be my first time shooting at the Blast. I've shot enough to realize I'll never win anything, but I'll have a great time trying. I was told to bring a shotgun, there's supposedly a great sporting clays setup at Flint Oaks Ranch. Jim and Sally are fantastic people.