AR Comp Density vs Varget

[Nicoli7153]

Looking at Barnes data for the 168gn .308 TTSX and AR Comp is listed as the preferred powder. I've been using Varget at 44gn and it takes up almost all available space in the Lapua case. Wondered if AR Comp would take up less (or more) space in the case due it's cut or density.

Thinking of switching to a Winchester case to get more internal volume for powder

Using these for big game hunting.

 

[Sandstorm]

If I remember correctly AR comp has similar fill characteristics as Varget.
You may be able to fit a bit more AR Comp..
I was around 2700 with 41gr AR Comp and 175 SMK.....If that helps you out.
Had room for the bullet without compressing and I single feed and load long.
308 Win

 

[Nicoli7153]

If I remember correctly AR comp has similar fill characteristics as Varget.
You may be able to fit a bit more AR Comp..
I was around 2700 with 41gr AR Comp and 175 SMK.....If that helps you out.
Had room for the bullet without compressing and I single feed and load long.
308 Win

Perfect!!! That's just what I was looking for. Thanks

 

[Jager]

According to QuickLoad, both powders have the same nominal density, reaching 100% case fill at 39.56gr.

Your 44.0/Varget shows as a significantly compressed load. Your present lot of Lapua brass must have notably more volume than the 56.0gr QuickLoad has as its default for .308 Win, or you're seating to a longer OAL.

In any case, AR Comp should give you noticeably higher velocity than Varget.

 

[Sandstorm]

Thanks Jager my on target findings are quite similar to QL and as far as speed
you will get them smokin with AR Comp, but the accuracy at my higher velocities was not as
good as in the 2680 range...YMMV
and Varget was more better...lol

 

[Straightshooter1]

Thanks Jager my on target findings are quite similar to QL and as far as speed
you will get them smokin with AR Comp, but the accuracy at my higher velocities was not as
good as in the 2680 range...YMMV
and Varget was more better...lol

44 grs of AR Comp will take pretty much the same volume as Varget. But that AR Comp will give you HIGH pressure and a lot more velocity. You'll just need to use less AR Comp than you do with Varget to stay in the accuracy node. I use 40.5 gr of AR Comp to push 168 SMK's seated long and get just over 2,700 fps our of a 26" barrel and the accuracy is great.

 

[Rtheurer]

AR comp is more akin to H4895 than Varget. I have shot 8lbs of it in a 308.

 

[Hoot]

Alliant's recipe for the 168gr Amax (41.7gr) is a laser in every 308 gun I've tried it in. In my 29" Savage Model 12 BR it produces an average velocity of 2760 at -020 jump and 2790 at -40 with unturned Lapua Palma brass and Rem 7 1/2's. 3-shot groups in the .2's at 100 yds. In LC (LRP) brass the performance can be improved by trying different primers.
I would expect similar performance with your 168gr TTSX. Given they're monolithic, start them with a little lighter charge.

Hoot

 

[Straightshooter1]

Alliant's recipe for the 168gr Amax (41.7gr) is a laser in every 308 gun I've tried it in. In my 29" Savage Model 12 BR it produces an average velocity of 2760 at -020 jump and 2790 at -40 with unturned Lapua Palma brass and Rem 7 1/2's. 3-shot groups in the .2's at 100 yds. In LC (LRP) brass the performance can be improved by trying different primers.
I would expect similar performance with your 168gr TTSX. Given they're monolithic, start them with a little lighter charge.

Hoot

What COAL is your .020 and .040 at?

Am just curious what your seating depth might be.

 

[Nicoli7153]

Was looking at the Barnes loading data with a max of 40.7gn AR Comp as opposed to 44gn of Varget, hoping to avoid a compressed load, which they list as 44.5 with Varget

 

[Hoot]

What COAL is your .020 and .040 at?

Am just curious what your seating depth might be.

2.820 (-20) and 2.800 (-40)

Going to try the same everything in some .014 turned necks (default .015) to see how they compare on Thursday morning. Don't need to turn them for my chamber, just curious how it impacts their performance. I like to tinker...

Hoot

 

[Sandstorm]

My loaded length with the 175 SMKs is 2.853 and im jumping them .020
with a .150 free bore..
Kreiger 12 twist 28 inch HV in a KRG X-Ray chassis.

 

[Straightshooter1]

2.820 (-20) and 2.800 (-40)

Going to try the same everything in some .014 turned necks (default .015) to see how they compare on Thursday morning. Don't need to turn them for my chamber, just curious how it impacts their performance. I like to tinker...

Hoot

Thanks Hoot. That's a rather short freebore compared to all of mine. And it looks like your velocities are right there where QuickLoad calculates it.

I turn all my Lapua brass to .014 just for the sake of uniformity. Because I typically shoot in the mid to upper .3 MOA's (in the .2's every so often), I can't seem to notice any real performance difference. If you're shooting in the .2's you just might see a different, but I kinda doubt it. Maybe if one is shooting in the .1 's, especially long distance, it might be noticeable.??? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Then again, it just might depend on the particular chamber configuration.

Let us know what you find.

 

[Hoot]

The dishwasher delivery guy, who's scheduled arrival this morning axed my range day today and forced me to plan for tomorrow morning (Thursday), stood me up and can't make it until tomorrow morning. Too bad as it promised to be a little cooler up til around noon. So, unless I can't get him out in a reasonable amount of time (before it heats up) then tomorrow's range experiments will have to wait for the next cooler morning, which will be Monday. Normally it would be Sunday but our gun club doesn't allow shooting until noon on Sundays out of respect for the neighbors. So, with a little luck, the dishwasher delivery will go quickly and I can salvage a few hours later tomorrow morning. Otherwise, I'll report in when I have something to share.

WRT turning all my necks, just enough to get them normalized, that'll be one of our long, cold, winter projects. I'm working with just 40 of the 200 new ones I got, until then. Believe me, I could count the number of .1's that I've shot in any caliber, over the past 45 years reloading, on one hand and have fingers left over. A couple using AR based calibers (not .223). .2's come almost as rarely with only a couple of hand's worth. That's why I am excited about this Alliant recipe. I'm not too proud to take an occasional handout.
You mentioned my .308 freebore. It measures .120 for a case length of 2.010. Allowing for the radius of the flatbase bullet that I used, figure on more like .130.



Hoot

 

[LVLAaron]

Looking at Barnes data for the 168gn .308 TTSX and AR Comp is listed as the preferred powder. I've been using Varget at 44gn and it takes up almost all available space in the Lapua case. Wondered if AR Comp would take up less (or more) space in the case due it's cut or density.

Thinking of switching to a Winchester case to get more internal volume for powder

Using these for big game hunting.

AR-Comp is the preferred powder for anything it works in.


It's about the same volume as Varget, but you will need less AR Comp than Varget for the same speed.

 

[Sandstorm]

but you will need less AR Comp than Varget for the same speed.

True that...but my barrel still prefers Varget over all the others....cept perhaps N150
the jury's not in on that one quite yet.....so ill play with it a bit more.

 

[Nicoli7153]

AR-Comp is the preferred powder for anything it works in.


It's about the same volume as Varget, but you will need less AR Comp than Varget for the same speed.

Thanks!!!