Annealing Flame issue Part II

[diego-ted]

I seemed to have resolved my flame nozzle issue. I am now looking for opinions on what I think is a problem. As shown in the video after the case leaves the initial flame and is being removed by the rotated wheel the case stays in the flame. It does this because of the positioning of the nozzle in relation to the machine. Is this over heating the case?

Thx Ted

 

[Fred B.]

Your cases are gone. Your flame is too close to brass and the moment you see propane flame changes color from blue to yellow or orange, you brass is compromised.

 

[Cecil S.]

I have a Bench Source and used Templaque to learn my set up. The tip of the Blue Flame touching the case is how I set my torches with a 3sec. dwell time. But someone will come along with better information.

 

[diego-ted]

Flame to brass about an inch? The brass neck while in the inner blue flame just barley started to glow? By my judgement the flame did not start to change until after the case left the inner blue flame. P.S. This brass is used only for mock up If I turn up the speed I do not get any color change to the brass while in the inner blue flame? Any more opinions.

thx Ted

 

[whatsupdoc]

You are correct once the case rotates it should be out of the flame, timing will be impossible, you will need to change torch position.

 

[Webster]

I seemed to have resolved my flame nozzle issue. I am now looking for opinions on what I think is a problem. As shown in the video after the case leaves the initial flame and is being removed by the rotated wheel the case stays in the flame. It does this because of the positioning of the nozzle in relation to the machine. Is this over heating the case?

Thx Ted

Looks like the flame is heating only one side of the neck, less heat to the other side. If the neck turns orange or red it is probably to hot. I put cases in my case neck turning case holder, chuck it in a small electric drill to rotate the cases. 3-4 seconds with a Burnsamatic hand held torch. Been doing it that way for about 5 yeears. No problems seems to work good enough for me. I never do more than 50 at a time.

 

[coldboreshot]

I seemed to have resolved my flame nozzle issue. I am now looking for opinions on what I think is a problem. As shown in the video after the case leaves the initial flame and is being removed by the rotated wheel the case stays in the flame. It does this because of the positioning of the nozzle in relation to the machine. Is this over heating the case?

Thx Ted

Dwell time in the flame, way too long. I set my flame tip just touching but the Templaq indicates about 6-8 seconds in the flame when the color changes.

 

[47WillysGuy]

I counted about 20 seconds of flame on the case. I use 6-8 sec and the case neck just starts to turn red, dull red. I would think your case would be fully annealed and void of any spring back of the metal at that length of time. Ruined...

Test the case, if it has spring back, it's ok.

 

[diego-ted]

Looks like the flame is heating only one side of the neck, less heat to the other side. If the neck turns orange or red it is probably to hot. I put cases in my case neck turning case holder, chuck it in a small electric drill to rotate the cases. 3-4 seconds with a Burnsamatic hand held torch. Been doing it that way for about 5 yeears. No problems seems to work good enough for me. I never do more than 50 at a time.

bottom wheel rotates case while in flame. case neck just starts to change color "rose" at the point the bottom wheel picks it up. Thx

 

[diego-ted]

I counted about 20 seconds of flame on the case. I use 6-8 sec and the case neck just starts to turn red, dull red. I would think your case would be fully annealed and void of any spring back of the metal at that length of time. Ruined...

Test the case, if it has spring back, it's ok.

16 seconds on the timer in the inner blue flame, then yes the outer flame is touching during the removal. Thus the
Dilemma


thx

 

[Straightshooter1]

I seemed to have resolved my flame nozzle issue. I am now looking for opinions on what I think is a problem. As shown in the video after the case leaves the initial flame and is being removed by the rotated wheel the case stays in the flame. It does this because of the positioning of the nozzle in relation to the machine. Is this over heating the case?

Thx Ted

A picture of the case afterwards would help us all with some diagnostic. But, 16+ seconds in the flame is a LONG time and can not see how it wouldn't overheat the rest of the case.

The key to good annealing is to get the job done quickly so the rest of the case isn't affected. Time can vary depending on various cases as to the amount of brass being heated (e.g. small cases and thin case walls heat much faster than large cases with thicker walls). For my .308 cases, mine are only in the flame 5-6 seconds depending on the ambient temperate in my garage where I do my annealing. When the garage is hot from the AZ summer temps, it takes less time than when it's 40° cooler.

 

[NZ_Fclass]

Dump it. Build an induction annealer.

 

[gman47564]

deigo turn your tourch down to where the inner blue flame is just about to touch the case... also time the wheels where when the bottom wheel picks up the case the top wheel drops another one in... the case in that video was annealed too long... you want that case coming out just before it starts to turn pink... also some cases dont color up like others...

 

[rckendall]

deigo turn your tourch down to where the inner blue flame is just about to touch the case... also time the wheels where when the bottom wheel picks up the case the top wheel drops another one in... the case in that video was annealed too long... you want that case coming out just before it starts to turn pink... also some cases dont color up like others...

Yes, turn the torch down and use Templaque, otherwise you are just guessing.

Richard

 

[Preacher]

Stop wondering and buy the AMP....

 

[CaptainMal]

Good lord that was a long, long time in a very intense flame. The entire neck and shoulder ended up near melted.

Sure the machines are fine and maybe worth the money. Yet, I note that different cases take different amounts of heat to just start to change flame color to red or show a very slight neck color change. Most of my Lapua cases in various calipers take 6-8 seconds SPUN in a socket on an electric screwdriver. Some other brands like Remington 30-30 cases take as little as 4 seconds. Most take a second or two more at start-up, maybe because the torch flame loses heat just heating the torch tip.

Anyway, what you have shown is a mess. Ironically I am heading to garage to anneal some 308 range brass before cleaning. My guess is it will take about 5 seconds at a much lower flame intensity to start to see a change in torch color in a rather dark garage. To me that's done right. To me what you did is beyond the "well done".

Call "Trash Can Salley" to pick up the mess.

 

[diego-ted]

Good lord that was a long, long time in a very intense flame. The entire neck and shoulder ended up near melted.

Sure the machines are fine and maybe worth the money. Yet, I note that different cases take different amounts of heat to just start to change flame color to red or show a very slight neck color change. Most of my Lapua cases in various calipers take 6-8 seconds SPUN in a socket on an electric screwdriver. Some other brands like Remington 30-30 cases take as little as 4 seconds. Most take a second or two more at start-up, maybe because the torch flame loses heat just heating the torch tip.

Anyway, what you have shown is a mess. Ironically I am heading to garage to anneal some 308 range brass before cleaning. My guess is it will take about 5 seconds at a much lower flame intensity to start to see a change in torch color in a rather dark garage. To me that's done right. To me what you did is beyond the "well done".

Call "Trash Can Salley" to pick up the mess.

Did you not see where I said the neck barley changed color to a rose red? It never glowed, I was in a very dark room. I have annealed thousands of cases "using a different machine" So I understand what the process is. anyhow I think part of the issue was the glow of the red light from the digital read out, it was happering my ability to see the color change. Once I blocked it out I could see the change at about 10 seconds.

Thx for the help and comments. Keep them in the X.

 

[Hohn]

Yes, turn the torch down and use Templaque, otherwise you are just guessing.

Richard

If the case needs that much time in the flame to anneal, I'd suggest you turn the torch *up*.

 

[divingin]

End result color change is affected by oxides and chemical contamination on the brass. I've had some turn the near-purple you see on military ammo, others have a barely discernible straw wash coloring. This with the same flame and dwell time, and the same end result (using a pair of pliers to test elasticity.)

 

[Hohn]

Stop wondering and buy the AMP....

If $1400 for an annealer was trivial, I'm guessing the OP wouldn't be torch annealing...