Ammo Question/Tuner Question

[gunsandgunsmithing]

National, world, championship matches won at the same settings…..dozen's, if not hundreds, including current world champion.
National, world championship, significant matches won by you……zero.
No opinion by me……simple fact.

That's always what you come back with. Never anything that's non-subjective science. Don't forget to read my whole post, too. The devil is in the details. What I posted was pure, non subjective, quantifiable and established science. Again, you're trying to argue with me when you're argument is with Isaac Newton.

 

[TRSR8]

That's always what you come back with. Never anything that's non-subject science. Don't forget to read my whole post, too. The devil is in the details. What I posted was pure, non subjective, quantifiable and established science. Again, you're trying to argue with me when you're argument is with Isaac Newton.

Simple fact, Mike, no more no less.
Another for you……I can name you two gunsmiths that are responsible for the overwhelming majority of big match wins over two decades, guns shot pretty much tuned where they were set when delivered.
This is not the science olympics.
I mean, frankly, I should keep my mouth shut, I love shooting against tuner twisters.
You and Isaac have a happy new year.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Ok. That must be your way of saying they're smarter than Isaac Newton or something. Hey, whatever works for ya.

 

[Doc22]

Hey guys I love a spirited debate as much as anyone but please remember this is all about me (lol) Im trying to learn here. Besides most of the damage is done, as much for experience as performance.
I reset my tuner to 0 last night and plan on going to the range and testing ammo to find the perfect setting.
I am pretty much resolved to Eley match its the closest I can get to a good price and still quality .

 

[Doc22]

So I realized that this post gets a lot of discussion. I said this previously I think the biggest issue is the term cheap. How do you quantify that term. Is it price point, is it consistency or something else?

 

[JohnW...ski]

At the risk of starting another p contest, I would say that some of the less expensive ammo such as SK and CCI target while low in price have value and are a bargain, while most cheap ammo has no quality and is just that, cheap.

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

Hey guys I love a spirited debate as much as anyone but please remember this is all about me (lol) Im trying to learn here. Besides most of the damage is done, as much for experience as performance.
I reset my tuner to 0 last night and plan on going to the range and testing ammo to find the perfect setting.
I am pretty much resolved to Eley match its the closest I can get to a good price and still quality .

I suggest ti make no more than 5 click adjustments at a time. Going more can cause you to miss what msy have been the setting you are after

Lee

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

So I realized that this post gets a lot of discussion. I said this previously I think the biggest issue is the term cheap. How do you quantify that term. Is it price point, is it consistency or something else?

If as monetary terms lowest cost. As to RFBR I would not use that term, but more in the sense of poor quality. Generally inconsistent lack of the ability to shoot sustainably consistent groups

Lee

 

[JimSC]

nothing statistically significant or scientific here but informal testing of half a dozen different ammo types and lots under test temps from 35 F to 60 F almost every ammo has seemed to perform best at a setting of X plus or minus 1 on my Harrels. You could easily set the tuner at X and never really notice a significant difference but for optimum tune going up or down a click from X may improve some of the ammo types at some of the temps. Been to windy for much testing lately

 

[BowChamp]

Yea I like the results from my Eley match so I am going to stick with it. I saw some RWS earlier today that was $46 for a box. Thats a little overkill to me

Dang...can't say I've seen it that high before.....$23.00 but not $46.00. Maybe it was a 100rd box?? LOL!!!

I'm about as new to this game as anyone here. I shot ARA benchrest this past season. Being a new shooter I didn't have a stockpile of that one great lot of ammo. Instead I shot no less than 3 different brands, 14 different lots of ammo and only used one tuner setting shooting the entire 2023 season. Even my lower quality ammo, used for practice, shoots pretty decent on this setting. No tuner setting will make lower quality ammo shoot as good as better quality ammo.

Glad to have you join in.

 

[MrG52D]

I think there probably is better settings for a particular lot, but when you have 20 minutes to complete your match target, you go with what you know.

Nobody likes a tuner twister at a match, at least the shooters on either side don’t. I have shot with the best shooters in the country, never saw one change the tuner during the match or at least not while they were shooting.

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

I think there probably is better settings for a particular lot, but when you have 20 minutes to complete your match target, you go with what you know.

Nobody likes a tuner twister at a match, at least the shooters on either side don’t. I have shot with the best shooters in the country, never saw one change the tuner during the match or at least not while they were shooting.

Could be they just know how to tune a rifle better than that Newton guy

Lee

 

[TRSR8]

Could be they just know how to tune a rifle better than that Newton guy

Lee

I beat him in two matches a couple years ago, kept screwing with his tuner.

 

[JimSC]

well I am glad that I twisted the tuner down 1 at my last match my scores went from 1875 and 1975 to a 2200 just from giving the tuner a tweak of one click to bring the vertical down a bit. Keep in mind that was the first week I owned that rifle and that my first full unlimited match ever so I am still pretty low on the learning curve with the rifle and tuner and with shooting unlimited

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

well I am glad that I twisted the tuner down 1 at my last match my scores went from 1875 and 1975 to a 2200 just from giving the tuner a tweak of one click to bring the vertical down a bit. Keep in mind that was the first week I owned that rifle and that my first full unlimited match ever so I am still pretty low on the learning curve with the rifle and tuner and with shooting unlimited

Jim
Was that 1 click or 1 complete revolution of 25 clicks?
IMO 1 or 2 clicks are not significant. IMO same like OAL of a range of 0.015 anything past that range can change how the exit timing will be


Lee

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

I beat him in two matches a couple years ago, kept screwing with his tuner.

There it is same like George on post 51 can shoot a factory 52 and embarrass some of them custom rifle owners.
All logic says it shouldn’t be

Lee

 

[VLNBYR]

There it is same like George on post 51 can shoot a factory 52 and embarrass some of them custom rifle owners.
All logic says it shouldn’t be

Lee

And it isn't. Is this George guy somebody who got a factory 52 and showed up at matches and won? Or is this the George who has worked hard for years to become somewhat competitive with one of his many 52's. A super great guy and a good friend but he does not strike fear among the benchrest shooters when he shows up with his 52.

 

[JimSC]

Jim
Was that 1 click or 1 complete revolution of 25 clicks?
IMO 1 or 2 clicks are not significant. IMO same like OAL of a range of 0.015 anything past that range can change how the exit timing will be


Lee

1 click from 364 to 363. 364 seems to be the best spot overall but I will move it 1 click up or down to get to about 1/2 bullet vertical. I am still learning the rifle and the ammo at this stage but it is appearing that just about any ammo at any temp shoots well between 363 and 365 without the tube

Back when I bought my first tuner for centerfire Mike Ezell drilled into my head that 3 clicks could take you from hero to zero. I think the issue with most shooters with tuners is they spin their tuners past the tune then get frustrated and spin it some more. When you are close one click or at the most two clicks is all you need in my experience

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

And it isn't. Is this George guy somebody who got a factory 52 and showed up at matches and won? Or is this the George who has worked hard for years to become somewhat competitive with one of his many 52's. A super great guy and a good friend but he does not strike fear among the benchrest shooters when he shows up with his 52.

John I believe it is the same one

Lee

 

[TRSR8]

well I am glad that I twisted the tuner down 1 at my last match my scores went from 1875 and 1975 to a 2200 just from giving the tuner a tweak of one click to bring the vertical down a bit. Keep in mind that was the first week I owned that rifle and that my first full unlimited match ever so I am still pretty low on the learning curve with the rifle and tuner and with shooting unlimited

And it was all because of that single click? That is absolutely ridiculous?