6mmBR Die Questions

[Sled2live]

I purchased a savage bolt action 22-250 and am in the process of having a Shilen 1-8 twist .272 neck 6mm BR barrel installed on it. I am new to the caliber, and primarily plan to use it for Texas Whitetail deer and hogs as well as shoot it in the occasional turkey shoots at the local range.

I started looking for a set of reloading dies for it and with the plethora of different die sets and variances....quite frankly I am confused as to what dies i should get. Hence my questions here. I don't plan to seriously compete, but want to get sub MOA accuracy if possible. I 've heard for years that this cartridge as well as the 6ppc are inherently accurate to begin with and easy to load accurate rounds for. Do I need competition level dies with bushing neck sizing to get sub MOA accurate loads, or can I use standard type dies and set the bullets just off the lands as I have done for my other rifles? I am totally unfamiliar with the neck sizing practices I have been reading about on this site.

I have reloaded for years and probably have been lucky in that all of my rifles will shoot under MOA after I have found what load they like (lots of different bullets and powders....seating depths etc.) I suspect that if I knew more about how the competitive shooters load their ammo, I could have found my rifle's preferred load much quicker. I suspect that the neck sizing probably has more to do with it than I knew.

So back to my question on this new build....what do you all recommend that I should get? Standard FL resizing die? Bushing type neck sizing die only? DO I need a competition type seating die? I was thinking that I should get a standard 2 die FL and seating die set and add a bushing type neck sizing die. Suggestions are welcome. Please educate me.

Thanks
Scott

 

[fdshuster]

Scott: I've been using the Redding Type S FL neck bushing dies for my 6BR's, 6ppc's, 223's, 222's, 308, etc. Lapua brass naturally, and since they do cost $84/100 now, like to get maximum life out of them, and I do, with over 40 loadings on some.

Loaded round neck diameter with the newer blue box Lapua will be about .267", for your chamber neck diameter of .272", so a .266" or .265" bushing would work. The point being that you're only "working" the brass .007" so you could expect very good case life. Actually, for the blue box Lapua, a .270" chamber neck would also be a good choice. My reamers are .269" necks but I do a light clean-up outside neck turn on my brass. If you don't want to turn the case necks, then a .270" would be the minimum.

An additional advantage with the bushing dies is that you are in control of how much neck/bullet tension, not the die maker in the case of a non-bushing sizing die. Also, the non-bushing die will over-size the case necks, requiring the use of the expander, not always a good idea.

If you do not already have a copy, contact Sinclair Intl. (800-717-8211) and request a free copy of their latest catalog. All available dies are described, as made by Forster, Redding, RCBS, etc. Even if you never buy anything from Sinclair, the catalog is a wealth of information.

For bullet seating with a threaded die I do prefer the Forster Benchrest Micrometer Seater. But, I also use the Wilson seaters with an arbor press. Just two different ways of doing the same job, bullet seating.

 

[shooter63]

excellent advise good shootin. regards shooter63

 

[SierraCJ5]

I was faced with the same decision about a year ago when I started with my first 6BR. The advice that kept coming up was to give a Harrell's full length bushing die a try so I went that route and have been completely satisfied. If you do decide to get a Harrell's die you'll need to send them three cases that are FULLY fire formed to your chamber so they can measure them and send you the best fit die. This can be problematic for a newcomer to the chambering since it's unlikely you have a way to neck-size the fired brass. I bought a used standard Redding neck die for this purpose. I typically use a .267 bushing with blue box brass and Berger 105s; my chamber has a .272 neck. This combo minimally works the brass so long as I bump the shoulder. 001 each time. I use a Forster ultra micrometer seater. With this combo accuracy has been fantastic and I don't feel limited by loads at all.

Youll absolutely love the 6BR, it's a real pleasure to shoot and load for. Enjoy!

 

[RangerRob]

+ 1 on FD
Work the brass as little as possible, and annealing will help extend that $0.85 brass life.
If memory serves correct, my Redding set has the micrometer seater, the neck bushing die, the body/neck bump die, and the decapper.
But of course my memory is well shot out.
Where am I?.....


Oh yeah, I shoot a Model 12 in 6BR. It loves Berger VLDs but I normally feed it the cheaper 105 Amax, which it handles very well.

 

[Sled2live]

Thanks for the advice from all who have contributed. So educate me about "bump the shoulder .001 each time"....what are we talking about here?

 

[BoydAllen]

It refers to adjusting a die so that as cases are sized, there shoulders are moved back that much in relation to their heads. I highly recommend careful, measured die setup over doing so by feel. Others may argue the point about how dies should be set up, but I am confident in my reasoning, and can explain in detail when called upon to do so.

 

[bozo699]

It refers to adjusting a die so that as cases are sized, there shoulders are moved back that much in relation to their heads. I highly recommend careful, measured die setup over doing so by feel. Others may argue the point about how dies should be set up, but I am confident in my reasoning, and can explain in detail when called upon to do so.

Consider yourself called upon
Wayne.

 

[fdshuster]

Sled2live: I'll add my 2 cents worth, then shutup. You are left with 2 choices: You can neck size only without touching the case shoulder (or touching it, but not moving it), but that will only last for a couple of firings, depending on the pressures you are loading to. If doing that, then you will soon begin to have hard bolt closing, and will have to adjust the die so the shoulders are pushed back a few thousandths.

Second choice is to adjust the sizer die so the shoulder is pushed back .001" or .002" each and every time the case is sized. Call it "neck sizing with just a little shoulder push back". Many consider this to be the better choice. It's for you to decide.

 

[1holeaddict]

Sled2live: I'll add my 2 cents worth, then shutup. You are left with 2 choices: You can neck size only without touching the case shoulder (or touching it, but not moving it), but that will only last for a couple of firings, depending on the pressures you are loading to. If doing that, then you will soon begin to have hard bolt closing, and will have to adjust the die so the shoulders are pushed back a few thousandths.

Second choice is to adjust the sizer die so the shoulder is pushed back .001" or .002" each and every time the case is sized. Call it "neck sizing with just a little shoulder push back". Many consider this to be the better choice. It's for you to decide.

It is consistenct we are all looking for so i have chosen option 2. It works very well and you dont have to keep thinking about when you are going to start getting tight bolt closures. I do own a 223 built by Hart Rifles and have only ever neck sized for it with no issues.
Good Shooting

 

[Sled2live]

OK, I get the picture. Has anyone here figured out how to adjust your dies to "bump" the shoulder back without having to buy precision measuring equipment? Like maybe .001" is about a quarter turn on the die? Half turn?

I just agreed to purchase this set of dies from a forum member: Redding Type S Match Die Set. Includes a type S neck die, with a .267 titanium nitride bushing. Redding body die, F/L. Redding competition bullet seating die.

Without actually seeing the dies yet, I'm wondering out loud about how to adjust the "bump".

 

[bozo699]

OK, I get the picture. Has anyone here figured out how to adjust your dies to "bump" the shoulder back without having to buy precision measuring equipment? Like maybe .001" is about a quarter turn on the die? Half turn?

I just agreed to purchase this set of dies from a forum member: Redding Type S Match Die Set. Includes a type S neck die, with a .267 titanium nitride bushing. Redding body die, F/L. Redding competition bullet seating die.

Without actually seeing the dies yet, I'm wondering out loud about how to adjust the "bump".

No you need equipment, it doesn't have to be expensive, a caliper with a bump insert for it will work, I use a Buhay tool that is expensive but it isn't necessary, You can do it by pulling your bolt apart and slowy turning your die down and keep chambering until the bolt just drops but I prefer tools!
Wayne.

 

[Sled2live]

Thanks for the help! When I get everything in my hands, I may be back asking more questions. I really do appreciate all of the helpful advice....seems like a friendly place compared to some of the other forums I follow.

Thanks Again to all that have helped educate me on my new 6mmBR....I'm excited!

Scott

 

[bozo699]

Thanks for the help! When I get everything in my hands, I may be back asking more questions. I really do appreciate all of the helpful advice....seems like a friendly place compared to some of the other forums I follow.

Thanks Again to all that have helped educate me on my new 6mmBR....I'm excited!

Scott

Best of luck Scott and most of all enjoy.
Wayne.

 

[1holeaddict]

OK, I get the picture. Has anyone here figured out how to adjust your dies to "bump" the shoulder back without having to buy precision measuring equipment? Like maybe .001" is about a quarter turn on the die? Half turn?

I just agreed to purchase this set of dies from a forum member: Redding Type S Match Die Set. Includes a type S neck die, with a .267 titanium nitride bushing. Redding body die, F/L. Redding competition bullet seating die.

Without actually seeing the dies yet, I'm wondering out loud about how to adjust the "bump".

Im pretty sure the tech at Redding told me that .001 is 1/78 of a turn. Spend the $35 and buy the Hornady set. Well worth the pennies

 

[BoydAllen]

A little math lesson: Dies are typically threaded 7/8 x 14 threads per inch, which means that if you turn something with that pitch threads 14 full turns, it will have moved an inch. So if we divide 1" by 14 we find out that one turn moves a die a smidge over seventy one thousandths of an inch. Changing a die's setting .001 requires and adjustment of 1/71 of a turn.
"Now about this can I do this accurately without some sort of a tool...No you can't. You will need a dial caliper ( I like 6". Harbor Freight is OK in a pinch.) and one of these. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-UrMTyJ1_E
Or you can buy an Harrell's die, and he includes a little brass gauge, that you can use for 6BR and 6PPC cases . Of course, you will still need the calipers.
The thing is, off the shelf dies are most likely OK for factory chambers, but in order to make sure that they have the bases covered, they may size the brass from your chamber more than is absolutely necessary. In any case, if you get a Harrell's die, he will use a few of your fired cases to select the die that is best for your chamber, and you don't have to buy the Hornady gauge. Take your pick. If you decide on a Harrell's die, you should call him. If you do, tell him I said hi. He is a really fine fellow.

A couple of friends who had rifles built with high end barrels and custom chambers ignored this advice the first time around, and found that their chambers were too small for the factory dies that they had bought, and ended up buying twice. Perhaps one of them has one of those dies that he will sell you. Good luck with your project.

 

[Sled2live]

Thanks.
I enjoyed the video, it helped my understanding. "Bumping" the shoulder was what i envisioned and I see how it can be done with precision now.

Scott

 

[bozo699]

Thanks.
I enjoyed the video, it helped my understanding. "Bumping" the shoulder was what i envisioned and I see how it can be done with precision now.

Scott

Scott,
If you go with the Hornaday bump gauge tool or any tool that attaches to a vernier caliper, you will drive yourself nuts chasing the amount of bump if you don't practice using the exact same force to close the calipers each and every time, a little practice and it's a snap.
Wayne.