6 Dasher, BRX, 6CM,6SLR

[Tim Singleton]

Help on next build, long range target shooting, local club matches.
300 to 600 yards.

I've been reading several days on this forum about the 6cm and 6slr.

They both sound like excellent long range 6mm rounds.

But I'm still leaning toward a 6br improved for my next build.

What are your thoughts?

 

[NateG]

Club matches meaning what style of shooting? (Across the course high power, prone, F-class, benchrest, other?)

I've got a 6BRX and a 6CM that I've used for 600 yard prone matches (and across-the-course more generally) and don't think either is a bad choice at all. The 6CM feeds a bit smoother for rapid fire stages, and offers a bit (but not a whole lot*) of wind performance. Flip a coin and none of those options will disappoint you.

*My 6CM barrel seems a bit on the slow side compared to some others (Including Joe Hendricks'--the 6CM's designer). I get about 3020-3050fps with a 105 from my various BRXs with 30 and 32" tubes, but I don't get much more than that (about 3100) with a 115 from my 28" 6CM. If you look at the numbers from Berger, there's not that much difference. I'm pretty sure Joe's gets a goodly bit more speed from a 115 down his tube (with the same load) than I do. But, that load out of my gun is *extremely* accurate, so I'm happy with it. But I'm always wondering what my preferred 32" tube would do with all that nice, slow powder. Next tube will be longer... :evil grin:

 

[Alex Wheeler]

3-600, I'd go 6br.

 

[Tim Singleton]

Mostly bench shooting egg and groundhog shoots. May try F class this year.

 

[wwbrown]

600 yards and closer I wouod very hard at a 6BR as I am not sure there is a better round for that close work. Go to a Dasher or BRX if you want a little more speed.

 

[Nik]

600 yards and closer I wouod very hard at a 6BR as I am not sure there is a better round for that close work. Go to a Dasher or BRX if you want a little more speed.

+1

 

[Gundog64]

Help on next build, long range target shooting, local club matches.
300 to 600 yards.

I've been reading several days on this forum about the 6cm and 6slr.

They both sound like excellent long range 6mm rounds.

But I'm still leaning toward a 6br improved for my next build.

What are your thoughts?

I have both a 6 CM and a 6 BRX. If I was to build a gun just for 3 to 600 yards, I would stay with the BRX. In my mind you are burning 17 grs. less powder (on average) and still moving a 105 at 3000 fps. 600 yds and under I see no advantage in the 115's over the 105 Hybrid.
The bullet I use ALWAYS depends on what shoots the most accurately (105 Hybrid, VLD, 115 VLD) in that particular gun. So far I am getting the best results with the Hybrid in both but the 105 VLD is a very close second. The 115's never seem to shoot quite as well but they still shoot good. I also shoot my fire form loads in matches and really do not feel I give up much. Oh yes, less recoil and muzzle blast with the BRX, many have told me my 6 CM has a very distinct and loud muzzle blast.

 

[MarkS]

I like the 6BRX for myself. Go with the 6BR IMP's flip a coin, all are good.

Mark Schronce

 

[racesnake]

6mmBRX, 6mmBRX, 6mmBRX!!!

 

[gmorganal]

Save yourself the headache of fireforming and go with the 6BR. We had a guy shoot an .880 five-shot group in our last club match and got second to a BR that shot an .850. You cannot beat a 6BR at 5 to 600 yards.

 

[johara1]

I would go with the BR family, if you want the edge go with a improved one. The BR can not keep up with the conditions at 1K, the Dasher is on the top of the list........ jim

 

[nosualc]

600 yards and closer I wouod very hard at a 6BR as I am not sure there is a better round for that close work. Go to a Dasher or BRX if you want a little more speed.

Wade nailed it.

Can't go wrong with a 6BR. A BRX or a dasher will get you another 100fps which is an edge, but it comes with the added cost of fire-forming. That extra 100fps won't really make a difference for you unless you've got everything else dialed in tight.

-nosualc

 

[johara1]

If the extra speed isn't worth it why does the BR hold the records? The BR is good but the Dasher is better......... jim

 

[nosualc]

If the extra speed isn't worth it why does the BR hold the records? The BR is good but the Dasher is better......... jim

Better? Agreed. Worth the hassle? That is debatable, and depends on the shooter.

Presuming the same bullets, a ~3% speed difference isn't going to make enough difference at 300-600 to make a difference unless everything else is just right (the rifle, loads, and shooter).

For a beginner or even an intermediate level competitive shooter, IMO it does not warrant the extra time and effort of fire-forming. I'm inferring that the OP is in this category because the way he asked his question (he said nothing about BR, BTW); apologies to him if this is an incorrect inference.

Why does the dasher hold the records? Because that's what many of the BR shooters use, and for them the 3% is an edge they can take advantage of.

FWIW, I shoot a BRX, and the fireforming is a hassle. It's also worth it, for me, but it's not for everybody.

-nosualc

 

[johara1]

I think your 3% is very conservative, the Dasher will push the 115 DTAC faster than the BR will the 105. I have never shot 600 IBS I do a little 1K...and the BR isn't conceptive on a regular basis. So why would you start with a handicap? Bit the bullet and go for the win, I don't see going to practice. I have shot very small at 3 and 5 hundred yds. but i no longer wear out a barrel at mid ranges for practice. I did see under .600 at 500 yds. with Dasher,is it worth it without a doubt...... jim

 

[Bob3700]

If you are only shooting 300 and 600 yds, all you need it a straight 6mm BR. The larger cartridges are not worth the decreased bbl life and they are all chasing the 6mm BR for accuracy.

Learn to read the wind and enjoy the small groups your BR will shoot.

Bob

 

[johara1]

What is small? and what is long barrel life? 2" and 3"is small at 1K and i'm on the 3rd set back on a Dasher barrel and 2nd on an other,with over 3000 rds. on the one it can still shoot in the 4 -5" range for ten shots at 1K ........ jim

 

[Bob3700]

The standard BR will see 3000 accurate rds without setting it back. The BRX and Dasher are hotter rounds and per your experience, you have set yours back three times to get to 3000 rds. It is just the nature of the beast. More performance, less bbl life.

A BR will shoot in the .2-.3" range at 100 yds if you are doing your part loading and holding.

The hotter improved BR cartridges are not necessary for 600 yds. They are great at that mid range distance but they give you the extra HP to shoot all the way the 1K. There are those who shoot the std BR at 1K but they really lack the horsepower at that range. Wind deflection is much greater in a std BR. Why mess with fire forming cases if you don't have to.

The larger cartridges (243, 6CM, 6mm SLR etc.) need more load development to shoot the small groups that the BR will and they use significantly more powder to do the job (33 gr vs 43 gr). Are they superior at 1K over the improved BR cartridges? In the wind, they are better as the bigger case will propel the 115 gr bullets faster and cut the wind better.

I shoot the BRX at 1K as well as the 6mm SLR. When winds are low (within my shooting skills) the BRX is very impressive at 1K with a 107 SMK. Once the wind kicks up, the 115 DTAC out of the SLR definitely gives you an advantage over the BR class. In fact, I believe the SLR with a 115 DTAC is right there with a 6.5x284 (got one of those as well).

Have shot out a few BRX bbls and an SLR bbl. BRX is usually ready for a setback around 1200-1500 rds. Same with the SLR. The throats just start cracking due to the steady diet of heavy, high BC bullets. There are no free lunches.

So, you are just shooting 300-600 yds, keep it simple n shoot a straight 6BR and spend your time learning to read the wind.

Just my experience.

Bob

 

[johara1]

Bob, My Dasher shoots in the zero's at one hundred,2 -3" at 1000. I will pull a barrel that will not shoot in a .100 at 100 yds. It's funny that the records at 600 and 1000 are Dashers,so the little extra must mean a lot....... jim

 

[Bob3700]

Donovan and Jim,

Big difference between benchrest shooting and the string fire of a prone or F-class shooter. Your bbls hardly get warm with 5 shots and a few sighters!

I have retired four BRX bbls and am on my second SLR bbl. All Bartline 5Rs 30 -32" lengths shooting prone LR with sling and irons.

You are not getting any extra accuracy from your improved cases, just better wind drift that an extra 150 fps affords. That extra FPS really shows up at 1K for sure.

From what you are telling me your Dashers will shoot to 3000 rds and beyond while delivering .00 - .10" groups at 100 yds with no set backs?. You can also hold sub 3 Inch groups during this time as well? That is the difference in bbl life of a bbl that never gets hot vs one that will burn your hand when your 25 rds are finished.

The fire cracking that takes place in the throat on the improved BRs is quite pronounced by 1500 rds. Not so on my friends straight BR. That is why I set the BRX back at that point. Don't want to let the accuracy degrade before I do the set back.

You mention that the records at 600 and 1000 yds are all Dashers. That is strictly BR shooting where you have the luxury of machine gunning five rounds down range in your condition in a few seconds off your sand bags and rests. Trade that for 20 rds held with your own arms/hands and 15-25 seconds between shots waiting for your target to reappear. Different game all together. Your bbls never even get warm. That contributes significantly to your long bbl life right there. Heck, a 6.5x284 would go way beyond 800-1000rds under those conditions.

We live in different worlds and see different results.

The world records shooting off your belly with iron sights are not held with Dashers. A top Palma shooter will give your Dasher a run for its money with an old 308 at 1K.


Bob