Some gun writers, shouldn't be. An article I read a few years back the writer was condemning the .40 S&W cartridge. One of his lame reasons was the excessive recoil, that in his words were almost up to .45ACP level. In a following paragraph he went on to praise the .45ACP for it's mild recoil (?????), couldn't quite figure that one out. Since then when I see his name on an article, I just skip over it.Whatever the {cartridge} case is, the REALLY important thing is that they are going to use a TIGHT TWIST. Something people have been telling them for 50 years. Only to have a manufacturer (backed by several paid off gunwriters) that, "It would be stupid to use a tight twist...that affects accuracy in a bad way."
Personally, I'd like to see every class of cartridge out there get made in .270 with a tight twist. You'd probably see some real innovation.
6.8 Western introduction(Winchester)
- Thread starter 284winner
- Start date
Good point. I was thinking of the average guy at Academy buying a hunting rifle off the shelf not the long range world so to speak. Amongst the average hunting crowd I see at the range, long barrels don't seem to be as popular
Lots of .40 cal haters out there. It's now the red headed step child of the pistol world. Just another fake news article. There are many that feel the same about this 6.8 also. I just think it's great to have a factory rifle offering fast twist barrels and ammunition sold for them. Even in Ron Spommers information video stating the 6.8 came along to displace the good old .270 win. Couldn't be further from the truth. It's simply marketing and while I don't think it'll negatively effect the 270 Win, it definitely will make it more popular.
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I don't think it's just marketing. It's adding capability that the .270 didn't have before. Ron Spommers, like many gunwriters actually has to make that popping noise before he writes an article or does a video explaining something he knows nothing about.
WAY too many gunwriters take and categorize a product (cartridge) for their needs, not what it was put out there for. And WAY too many corporate board doofs listen to the nerd with BCG's saying what the gunwriters say, instead of listening to what the intent of the product is. That's why gunwriters need to be called out. And when they say, "Hey, don't shoot the messenger." I say, "We do if that's what it takes to get the message across." (figuratively speaking not literally)
This cartridge, the 6.8 Western, is about LONG RANGE. Not replacing the good 'ol .270 for hunting. But that's where it gets shoved, hunting. I can't tell you how many shooters I cross paths with that think long range shooting is stupid and you don't need to do it. Then turn around and can't zero a rifle at 100 yds.
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Well put. I do consider this new 6.8 a niche rifle/cartridge for sure but also think they marketed it for that purpose. It fills a void that didn't exist in factory offerings. Really surprised it wasn't Hornady's brainchild. I honestly figured they'd be the company that introduced the cartridge. They are on the fast track with heavy for caliber bullets and it would have been in line with their current introduction of LR ammunition. They'll introduce a heavy .277 bullet eventually. They can't just sit on the sidelines too long. Gotta love competition between companies.
Agreed, it is a niche. The fastest growing niche market in the shooting industry.
"Lots of .40 cal haters out there. It's now the red headed step child of the pistol world. Just another fake news article."
Yep. 40 S&W is the red-headed stepchild, but the 10mm is the new golden boy, praised for it's unmatched stopping power in automatic handguns.
Funny. As I recall, the 40 was created as a shortened 10mm, due to the difficulty of qualifying with the 10mm and it's excessive recoil.
People are nuts.
Yep. 40 S&W is the red-headed stepchild, but the 10mm is the new golden boy, praised for it's unmatched stopping power in automatic handguns.
Funny. As I recall, the 40 was created as a shortened 10mm, due to the difficulty of qualifying with the 10mm and it's excessive recoil.
People are nuts.
Still own a couple 40s. Personally I like them. Maybe the 9 has all but replaced it but like everyone knows, big heavier bullets make sense if the shooter can control the gun and hit the target. The 9 makes more shots faster but the 40 is easily controllable and shoots heavier bullets with more energy. I'm not gonna beat up either because they all have a place in my life. The 10mm is my favorite woods carry pistol. Has been since the mid 90s.
Depart123
6.8 Fudd Rocket.
The whole drift away from the 9mm was based on the 1986 Miami shootout. Bad guys getting hit with 9mm and not getting stopped. The FBI wanted to standardize .45 cal. but small stature shooters couldn't qualify. The 10mm came along because someone said, "I know, we'll use a smaller diameter bullet." That was even harder to qualify with. Thus, the .40 was born. It's a great cartridge with a good balance of terminal ballistics and controllability.
IMO, and MO only, that if you can't hold a shooting standard, you need not be in a shooting job.
That said, there was a lot more about tactics, mostly lack thereof, that was the real cause of the 1986 debacle. Any time you put handguns up against carbines or rifles, you are going to suffer greatly. Which the FBI did. All the talk about which handgun is the best is useless if the shooters don't first learn to shoot at a high degree of competency and MOST importantly, learn how to tackle this kind of problem as a TEAM, not a bunch of individuals. Up-arming of access to carbines would have really been the discussion needed to have. Not which handgun round would be better suited to come up inadequate against bad guys packin' carbines.
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All great points. When the 40 came out, it closely mirrored the stopping power of the 45 based on factual studies. Little more firepower, little less recoil. Today the same thing happened to the 9mm vs 40. Better bullets offering close to equal performance and a little more firepower. I agree with your if you can't shoot the standard offering, find another career. Hardly what makes good politically correct acceptance but a realist approach. It's not about hurting feelings but rather defending and protecting those in service and our cities, states and country. When my department replaced the .38 revolvers with the G22 Glocks, many smaller stature and female officers couldn't qualify. Believe me, many were alone at the range with some of the trainers and in the end, qualified. Couldn't hit the 10, 9 or 8 ring but wound up qualified. Happened to several female officers. Doesn't help them or where they serve if that's what has to happen. After I retired the Glock22 was replaced by the Glock 17s. Couldn't say what's happened since but guessing it's not much different. Same frame, different cartridge. I love my 40s, 9s and 45s. I have use for all of them. Different seasons basically dictate what I carry and when. My G20&G40 are woods carry only. I think after retiring my favorite is my 43X. After carrying a G22 for so long, the little compact is a delight to carry. Not trying to hi-jack my own Post but I'm a believer in shoot what you like and what you shoot the best. Confidence is a huge factor also. The new 6.8 is the same. If it makes a person happy for whatever reason, buy it, shoot it and add It to your existing lineup. I haven't bought a new rifle in so many years, I can't remember when I did. I enjoy putting them together to fit the need. It's much faster than waiting on one to show up from a manufacturer.
Depart123
People are stupid.
On one hand..."9mm is the best!!"...on the other hand..."45acp is the best!!"...but somehow, that 40 cal cartridge right in the middle sucks.
The 40S&W is too powerful and snappy for the 9mm tacticool crowd, and doesn't have enough girth for the 45acp Fudds....and not enough velocity for the 10mm "master race".
It is the "compromise cartridge" that doesn't really compromise much of anything, yet is hated by many.
On one hand..."9mm is the best!!"...on the other hand..."45acp is the best!!"...but somehow, that 40 cal cartridge right in the middle sucks.
The 40S&W is too powerful and snappy for the 9mm tacticool crowd, and doesn't have enough girth for the 45acp Fudds....and not enough velocity for the 10mm "master race".
It is the "compromise cartridge" that doesn't really compromise much of anything, yet is hated by many.
I was tired of not being to get range time and frankly hunting with my .338 Win Mag. I'm 73. I bought a 6.8 in Browning X-bolt. My decision came down to two things. Was it big enough to hunt Alaska - Moose on down and could I get ammo and/or reloading supplies so I could have range time. I bought the rifle and 400 rounds of ammo from Sportsman's Warehouse. RCBS had the dies and I ordered a set. Found 170 and 175 bullets in the reloading stores. My only other option at the time was a .308. Guns were aplenty and ammo was on the shelf. When I bought the 6.8 there was no 30 cal bullets for reloading. There is now. I'm happy with the gun and the .338 is retired. I have 3 30-06s I may bring out of the closet now that I can get bullets. Life is good and there are no regrets.
They also have an advantage in that they don't make rifles. If you are Savage, Bergara, etc, are you going to chamber a new cartridge marketed by a competitor?
To my knowledge, the 6.8 Western still has not been offered in a factory rifle by anyone except the siblings - Browning/Winchester.
I considered it before I started my ongoing 280AI build. I decided the AI did everything it did and more.
If someone is going to buy a short action hunting rifle, I suspect they will just buy a 6.5 PRC or maybe a 7mm-08. If you look at the following listing, you'll see 243. 6.5CM, 6.5PRC, 308 and 7-08 every time.
https://www.bergara.online/us/rifles/b14/ridge-rifle-2/
110 High Country in True Timber Strata | Savage Arms
The 110 High Country is built for the toughest terrain. Features a True Timber Strata stock, spiral-fluted barrel, protective Cerakote finish, and AccuFit.
Back when the saum, WSM, 7 rem mag and many others came along there were no long, high BC bullets readily available and rebranded previous cartridges don’t get those new silver bullet juices flowing to lubricate and open up the wallet like a new whiz bang cartridge.
Hell , it really wasn’t long ago a 300 Mag with 190smk was a common long range combination.
Now I don’t own a rifle that’s not 1-7 to 1-8 twist from .224 to .338
I just remembered the .277 Fury is out. Once cheap brass to reload starts flowing out of Army training facilities, I expect it to put the final nail in the 6.8 Western cartridge.
That’s assuming it’s reusable, that other manufacturers embrace the high pressures and chamber for it and reloaders don’t have issues with it and embrace the high pressures to get any real advantage.
The Army's training ammo is not going to have the steel base or the high pressure "war loads." Consequently, I think we will see a lot of good brass available within a couple of years.
All the current cartridges out there are the low pressure versions even if they have the steel base (for show). The regular pressure loads should be able to match this.
- 150g bullet at 3100fps in a 24" barrel.
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