6.5X47L 123 gr load data help
- Thread starter djporter
- Start date
You can safely go up to about 38.0grs. (or thereabouts) using RL-15, shooting 130 Berger VLD's jammed 10+K into the lands. Therefore you should be able to safely go to 38.5 grs. of RL-15 with 123gr projectiles. Since Varget is almost nearly identical in burn rate and characteristics to RL-15, you should be able to use RL-15's load data to extrapolate a good load using Varget...
123 gr Lapuas with 37.0-37.5 gr of Varget (our 2208 here in Australia) works well for a number of shooters.
I was using CCI 450 Magnum primers, but when it was pointed out to me that I was probably using the wrong primers and I went over to BR4's, my 300 yard vertical went from 0.75moa to 0.25 moa.
Granted it was only a small sample.......5 shot groups of each in round robin order at 300 yds.......but still a strong indication and very good for the confidence.
I was using CCI 450 Magnum primers, but when it was pointed out to me that I was probably using the wrong primers and I went over to BR4's, my 300 yard vertical went from 0.75moa to 0.25 moa.
Granted it was only a small sample.......5 shot groups of each in round robin order at 300 yds.......but still a strong indication and very good for the confidence.
Eco>>Where do you seat your Scenars in relation to the lands? I used to use them and had great luck with them 7-8K into the lands... I could NEVER get Scenars, whether the 123's OR the 139's to shoot OFF the lands. I have also heard from others that seating them WELL into the lands (12-20K) is even better! Any thoughts?
ShootDots,
Like you I could never get the 123s (or the 139s for that matter) to jump successfully. I was jammed 0.006" - 0.008" with every decent load. A very succesful F Class shooter here in Oz did extreme;y well in last Augusts Brisbane "Queens" event, shooting "out of the box" cases.....zero preparation....... and 130's jammed 0.008" with 37.5 gr of Varget (our AR2208)
I did try a sort of "my version" of the Berger recommendation for tuning, shooting their 130 gr VLD in my 6.5 x 47 Lapua, going from a jam to a big jump and it was a fascinating result. Fascinating for me, because a mate who does extremely well in F Class Open here with a 7mm-08 had been playing with hybrids, and told me that the next rifle he built he was going to throat it to jump 0.060"- 0.080". I am an older shooter and somehow that concept of a big jump seemed all wrong to me.
Anyway, i did a genuine, Round-Robin test, shooting 37.5 gr Varget (2208) for groups at 100 yards as follows:
5 x 0.020" Jam 0.68" group Avg 2927 fps
5 x 0.010" Jam 0.48" group Avg 2940 fps
6 x 0.000 Touch 0.66" group Avg 2936 fps
5 x 0.020" Jump 0.51" group Avg 2930 fps
5 x 0.040" Jump 0.61" group Avg 2913 fps
5 x 0.080' Jump 0.41" group Avg 2913 fps.
I then shot 2 more groups of 5 each, of the 10 thou jam, and the 80 thou jump, and the 10 thou jam was my better group.....which is also probably what i wanted to believe !!
I should qualify all of the above by declaring that I am definitely not any decent sort of benchrest shooter. 99% of my lifetime practise has been shooting varmints , normally over the bonnet of a 4 wd. I have no illusions whatsoever, re having any level of expertise, and am very certain that a good shooter would do a hell of a lot better shooting groups with my gear than I can !
Like you I could never get the 123s (or the 139s for that matter) to jump successfully. I was jammed 0.006" - 0.008" with every decent load. A very succesful F Class shooter here in Oz did extreme;y well in last Augusts Brisbane "Queens" event, shooting "out of the box" cases.....zero preparation....... and 130's jammed 0.008" with 37.5 gr of Varget (our AR2208)
I did try a sort of "my version" of the Berger recommendation for tuning, shooting their 130 gr VLD in my 6.5 x 47 Lapua, going from a jam to a big jump and it was a fascinating result. Fascinating for me, because a mate who does extremely well in F Class Open here with a 7mm-08 had been playing with hybrids, and told me that the next rifle he built he was going to throat it to jump 0.060"- 0.080". I am an older shooter and somehow that concept of a big jump seemed all wrong to me.
Anyway, i did a genuine, Round-Robin test, shooting 37.5 gr Varget (2208) for groups at 100 yards as follows:
5 x 0.020" Jam 0.68" group Avg 2927 fps
5 x 0.010" Jam 0.48" group Avg 2940 fps
6 x 0.000 Touch 0.66" group Avg 2936 fps
5 x 0.020" Jump 0.51" group Avg 2930 fps
5 x 0.040" Jump 0.61" group Avg 2913 fps
5 x 0.080' Jump 0.41" group Avg 2913 fps.
I then shot 2 more groups of 5 each, of the 10 thou jam, and the 80 thou jump, and the 10 thou jam was my better group.....which is also probably what i wanted to believe !!
I should qualify all of the above by declaring that I am definitely not any decent sort of benchrest shooter. 99% of my lifetime practise has been shooting varmints , normally over the bonnet of a 4 wd. I have no illusions whatsoever, re having any level of expertise, and am very certain that a good shooter would do a hell of a lot better shooting groups with my gear than I can !
Hey Eco, that 10K jam looks pretty good! Are you running the loads over a chronograph? When I get to the level of accuracy that seems to be "good" I start my "tweaking". First I try 3 different primers over 10 shots each to see if A.) the groups tighten a bit; and B.) to see if the extreme spreads tighten up... Then I select the "best" of those and then run a "ladder seating depth" run and they go over the chrono too. I have found, in MANY, if not most cases, that not only does the seating depth either open or tighten the groups, it has been my experience that when you find the best group, you also have the tightest shot strings! That is NOT always the case>>But it is more often than not. I hope all this helps, at least to some degree.
ShootDots,
Yes I chronographed everything using a MagnetoSpeed . I have shot F Class Open comp on several occasions with the MagnetoSpeed attached for the day. I am absolutely convinced that all it does to my harmonics is an elevation of approx 0.5moa.
I have actually just sold the rifle, so can't do any more development work with that calibre.
I have a 284 Win based on a BAT action going really well,(shot two x 60.5 last weekend at 600 yds and 500 yds and won my very first open Prize Meeting) and will have my 2nd 6 x 47 Lapua going as a switch barrel next weekend. I shot out a barrel at around 1150 round mark, using 105 gr Berger Hybrids at 3100-3150 and it was really accurate and very sweet to shoot. I have missed it badly !
My head struggled with 3 F Class guns, so I sold the 6.5 x 47 Lap and shipped it off last week.
Now I will use the 6 x 47 Lap for 300-500 yards, and the 284 Win for 600-1000 yds or when the weather gets rough......but the 6.5 x 47 is gone for good.
Now I can go the extra step and start trialling seating depths and primer changes. I have them (different primer brands) in the cupboard ready to go. Fortunately I can shoot at 100,300, 500 and 900 yards right here at home, so no excuses now.
Being home by myself on private property, my Ladder Tests mean using a video camera and then slowly and methodically plotting the shots after I have fired the 10-20 shots or whatever I am doing. Painfully slow, but I don't have any other option at this point.
One of my big fears is shooting a barrel out doing "load development" ! We actually pay $200 plus more than you guys for a barrel, plus they are so damned hard to get in to the country. Kriegers available for around $650-00, PacNor for similar, Bartlein just not available, same for Rock Creek(not available) US export controls and Aussie import controls make it ridiculously hard for us to play properly.
Yes I chronographed everything using a MagnetoSpeed . I have shot F Class Open comp on several occasions with the MagnetoSpeed attached for the day. I am absolutely convinced that all it does to my harmonics is an elevation of approx 0.5moa.
I have actually just sold the rifle, so can't do any more development work with that calibre.
I have a 284 Win based on a BAT action going really well,(shot two x 60.5 last weekend at 600 yds and 500 yds and won my very first open Prize Meeting) and will have my 2nd 6 x 47 Lapua going as a switch barrel next weekend. I shot out a barrel at around 1150 round mark, using 105 gr Berger Hybrids at 3100-3150 and it was really accurate and very sweet to shoot. I have missed it badly !
My head struggled with 3 F Class guns, so I sold the 6.5 x 47 Lap and shipped it off last week.
Now I will use the 6 x 47 Lap for 300-500 yards, and the 284 Win for 600-1000 yds or when the weather gets rough......but the 6.5 x 47 is gone for good.
Now I can go the extra step and start trialling seating depths and primer changes. I have them (different primer brands) in the cupboard ready to go. Fortunately I can shoot at 100,300, 500 and 900 yards right here at home, so no excuses now.
Being home by myself on private property, my Ladder Tests mean using a video camera and then slowly and methodically plotting the shots after I have fired the 10-20 shots or whatever I am doing. Painfully slow, but I don't have any other option at this point.
One of my big fears is shooting a barrel out doing "load development" ! We actually pay $200 plus more than you guys for a barrel, plus they are so damned hard to get in to the country. Kriegers available for around $650-00, PacNor for similar, Bartlein just not available, same for Rock Creek(not available) US export controls and Aussie import controls make it ridiculously hard for us to play properly.
Well Eco, I have 4 (yes count'em) FOUR F-Open rifles. However, at this time I only have my 6mmBR to shoot. I had 2 new barrels that were bad>>>one on a 6-6.5 x 47 and the other on a 6.5 x 47. I could NOT get either of them to shoot. The barrels are coming off this coming week and going back to the barrel maker. I JUST got in a new Krieger for my 6.5 x 284. My "old" one is BURNED out completely! However, I can't do anything with it at the moment, because it is going on my BAT action that now contains my 6mmBR. However, in the next couple of months I should have all the new barrels in and work will begin on barrel installation and load development. Hopefully all will be done "soon">> as the saying goes. The "bad barrels set me back several months! I REALLY dislike that. However, having said all that, I will always have a 6.5 x 47 as it is one of my fav calibers. Have a GREAT year my friend!
djp45,
Looks like you aren't getting too many replies to your specific question and these other two have gone off on a tangent somewhere....
So...
I'm also in Australia and shoot two 6.5x47 Lapua chambered rifles... I won't go on about my 130gr Berger / Varget loads but they easily do sub .2 MOA.
My experimental rifle is just a Tikka T3 1:8 Pacnor 27" Heavy Varmint 6.5x47L.
I started with the 123gr Lapua Scenar's using Varget at 37.0gr up to 38.6gr. All my development and rounds are seated 0.002" off the lands. I do not jamb anything. My load development went in 0.2gr increments and my test range is 175 yards. I do not do any testing at 100 yards as the results are just not there to be measured, in other words most accurate loads are just one hole so worthless for evaluation. All testing is done using a Chrony, Coaxial Front Rest and Rear Bag.
I found two accurate nodes with my setup, one at 37.2gr Varget, ES 11 SD 6 average velocity 2,880 fps then 38.2gr Varget, ES 15 SD 8 average velocity 2,990 fps.
Don't like the higher nodes so settled with 37.2gr Varget and so far at 175 yards is returning groups of around 0.250" when conditions are on my side. Temperatures at last test were around 38 degrees Celcius (about 100 F) so I was struggling with heat mirage at times. I need to do some more testing now conditions are cooler. Most groups are 5 shots up to 10 shots when I'm looking for SD figures.
The first 3 shots this barrel saw were with 123gr Scenar and 38gr Varget...the velocities were 2,956 then 3,043 and 3,036 but now a couple of hundred rounds later the same load is down to 2,920 fps as the barrel settles in.
There are a number of shooters here that participate in the 500m Fly and use 130gr Berger VLD's and Varget...pretty much all the same loads of 37.5gr but different seating depths. I have not shot past 500 metres so I can't comment on the longer range accuracy... Later this year more tests as F-Class Open is happening.
I also shoot at home with ranges up to 500m and about to add 900m or close to 1,000 yards.
Best of luck with your load development.
Looks like you aren't getting too many replies to your specific question and these other two have gone off on a tangent somewhere....
So...
I'm also in Australia and shoot two 6.5x47 Lapua chambered rifles... I won't go on about my 130gr Berger / Varget loads but they easily do sub .2 MOA.
My experimental rifle is just a Tikka T3 1:8 Pacnor 27" Heavy Varmint 6.5x47L.
I started with the 123gr Lapua Scenar's using Varget at 37.0gr up to 38.6gr. All my development and rounds are seated 0.002" off the lands. I do not jamb anything. My load development went in 0.2gr increments and my test range is 175 yards. I do not do any testing at 100 yards as the results are just not there to be measured, in other words most accurate loads are just one hole so worthless for evaluation. All testing is done using a Chrony, Coaxial Front Rest and Rear Bag.
I found two accurate nodes with my setup, one at 37.2gr Varget, ES 11 SD 6 average velocity 2,880 fps then 38.2gr Varget, ES 15 SD 8 average velocity 2,990 fps.
Don't like the higher nodes so settled with 37.2gr Varget and so far at 175 yards is returning groups of around 0.250" when conditions are on my side. Temperatures at last test were around 38 degrees Celcius (about 100 F) so I was struggling with heat mirage at times. I need to do some more testing now conditions are cooler. Most groups are 5 shots up to 10 shots when I'm looking for SD figures.
The first 3 shots this barrel saw were with 123gr Scenar and 38gr Varget...the velocities were 2,956 then 3,043 and 3,036 but now a couple of hundred rounds later the same load is down to 2,920 fps as the barrel settles in.
There are a number of shooters here that participate in the 500m Fly and use 130gr Berger VLD's and Varget...pretty much all the same loads of 37.5gr but different seating depths. I have not shot past 500 metres so I can't comment on the longer range accuracy... Later this year more tests as F-Class Open is happening.
I also shoot at home with ranges up to 500m and about to add 900m or close to 1,000 yards.
Best of luck with your load development.
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