Hi, I'm new to loading for the 45/70 for hunting whitetails and would like to know a good hunting bullet and powder combo, using 21" custom barrel with muzzle break, I'd like to be able to shoot out to 200 yards. Also what are the prefered brand of dies to use. Thanks for the help, Mike.
45/70 loading help
- Thread starter Performance Shooting
- Start date
I didn't have to shoot to 200 yards, so I only loaded some 500gr RNFP Hard Cast over a light 5744 charge for use during deer season. I use RCBS dies and a Lee Universal expander.
The Hornady 325FTX bullets over some IMR4198, or H4895, or IMR4895 etc will shoot pretty darn flat for a 45-70. Might be a good starting point. Enjoy that rifle.
The Hornady 325FTX bullets over some IMR4198, or H4895, or IMR4895 etc will shoot pretty darn flat for a 45-70. Might be a good starting point. Enjoy that rifle.
+1^
For deer to 200, I'd probably go with his suggestion of the Hornady bullet and powder for an easy button.
For cast bullets, there's the leading your barrel part to worry about unless you go with coated ones.
I'd just get some Lee dies. I have a set I use for my 45-90 and they work great
For deer to 200, I'd probably go with his suggestion of the Hornady bullet and powder for an easy button.
For cast bullets, there's the leading your barrel part to worry about unless you go with coated ones.
I'd just get some Lee dies. I have a set I use for my 45-90 and they work great
Thompson Center Encore, Barrel by Bullberry Legacy.
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
Stick with the 325s or 350s in a jacketed bullet, unless you like heavy recoil.4198 is my go-to powder. What kind of gun is that custom barrel on?
Thompson? OK! Back to “How much recoil can you take?”
I bought a Ruger #1 because I always wanted one. It’s a handy little lite rifle and I read in my manual that you can load some real truck stoppers in them! Woohoo! I loaded some up and went to the range. I think I shot three before I cried uncle!
Thompson? OK! Back to “How much recoil can you take?”
I bought a Ruger #1 because I always wanted one. It’s a handy little lite rifle and I read in my manual that you can load some real truck stoppers in them! Woohoo! I loaded some up and went to the range. I think I shot three before I cried uncle!
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Its a Thompson Center Encore Frame with barrel by Bullberry Legacy, 23" with muzzle break so not worried about the recoil.
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
“so not worried about the recoil.”
I’ll quote Yoda:” You will be! Yoouu will bee!”
Have you ever shot a 458 Win Mag? In the Rugers, you can get close to that kind of performance. Not sure about the Thompson.
Muzzle break will help, but......?
The nice thing is you can load lite or heavy, to suit your needs.
I’ll quote Yoda:” You will be! Yoouu will bee!”
Have you ever shot a 458 Win Mag? In the Rugers, you can get close to that kind of performance. Not sure about the Thompson.
Muzzle break will help, but......?
The nice thing is you can load lite or heavy, to suit your needs.
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The Barnes TSX in either 250 or 300 are another great choice.
FTX requires shorter brass trim if you care.
Accuracy will depend on whatever you find that shoots but as far killing (and this is picking nits) I like the Barnes better. This is based on 100+ whitetails killed between these two bullets. Both of these bullets shot sub 1" at 100 yards for a three shot group with an aimpoint red dot out of a 1895 16" barreled gun.
I've used 44.4gr of 4198 for the 300 and VV N120 for the 250 based off of the Barnes load recipe.
FTX requires shorter brass trim if you care.
Accuracy will depend on whatever you find that shoots but as far killing (and this is picking nits) I like the Barnes better. This is based on 100+ whitetails killed between these two bullets. Both of these bullets shot sub 1" at 100 yards for a three shot group with an aimpoint red dot out of a 1895 16" barreled gun.
I've used 44.4gr of 4198 for the 300 and VV N120 for the 250 based off of the Barnes load recipe.
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Oh that's right, standard brass is 2.100", the Hornady stuff is 2.030".
If you have factory brass lying around like I do, you tend to forget.
Shorty brass is only needed in the lever guns so that pointed bullets will cycle. Not needed in an Encore.
If I was shooting an Encore in 45-70 I would definitely be testing the Barnes 300gr TTSX. It is a very accurate bullet that is designed to expand at low velocities. I had excellent results with it in a Marlin 1895 but it will not cycle even with shortened brass.
FWIW - The 300 TTSX is also a preferred bullet in the 458 SOCOM.
If I was shooting an Encore in 45-70 I would definitely be testing the Barnes 300gr TTSX. It is a very accurate bullet that is designed to expand at low velocities. I had excellent results with it in a Marlin 1895 but it will not cycle even with shortened brass.
FWIW - The 300 TTSX is also a preferred bullet in the 458 SOCOM.
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XTR
F-TR obssessed shooting junkie
Any of the jacketed 325-350s. I’ve used a fair few of the Hornady offerings. Load them over 5744, 3031, Re7, or 4198. Velocity is up to you. Your fillings will start so loosen at about 2250 to 2300. At 2400 it leaves bruises. I’ve never tried N120 in my 45/70 but itnworks great in the 458SOCOM.
learn not to over size the brass, the case should not look like a corn snake that swallowed an egg when you push the bullets in.
Naked cast bullets start to have issues north of about 1400. At that point you start looking at gas checks or paper jackets. (Read Paul Matthew’s books).
No matter what you saw in that movie staring a Shiloh Sharps, 200 yds is a long shot with a 45/70. Yea, you can shoot them to 1000 yds, but the drop on your load will be in the range of 16 inches at 200 yds from a 100 yd zero. I’ve got my Highwall tuned so I can use my Swaro BRX reticle to hold another half mil every 25 yds from 100 to about 225 and hit but you are throwing bricks.
I cast for two ’74 sharps with Holy Black and load smokelss and 405 Remingtons for my Highwall. I run the 405s at about 1800 over 3031.
Just an aside, probably not helpful but The Remington 405 is a really good bullet for the 45/70 if you can find them. The used to pop up every 5 or 6 yrs. They also work like a dream in my 458SOCOM with. N120, subs and supers.
as noted above, any of the 458 bullets work in a single shot.
learn not to over size the brass, the case should not look like a corn snake that swallowed an egg when you push the bullets in.
Naked cast bullets start to have issues north of about 1400. At that point you start looking at gas checks or paper jackets. (Read Paul Matthew’s books).
No matter what you saw in that movie staring a Shiloh Sharps, 200 yds is a long shot with a 45/70. Yea, you can shoot them to 1000 yds, but the drop on your load will be in the range of 16 inches at 200 yds from a 100 yd zero. I’ve got my Highwall tuned so I can use my Swaro BRX reticle to hold another half mil every 25 yds from 100 to about 225 and hit but you are throwing bricks.
I cast for two ’74 sharps with Holy Black and load smokelss and 405 Remingtons for my Highwall. I run the 405s at about 1800 over 3031.
Just an aside, probably not helpful but The Remington 405 is a really good bullet for the 45/70 if you can find them. The used to pop up every 5 or 6 yrs. They also work like a dream in my 458SOCOM with. N120, subs and supers.
as noted above, any of the 458 bullets work in a single shot.
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20 some years ago I got a 45/70 handi rifle for $100 at a gun show.
I read there were levels of pressure:
Ruger #1 loads
Win 1886 loads
Trapdoor loads
Back then there was no listing for handi rifles.
So I attempted to calculate the max pressure.
I got help from my father, chief engineer gun design with lots of patents, and also from a retired mechanical engineering professor. I learned about Lame's formula for thick walled hoop stress and how to calculate a section modulus.
It turns out the rifle calculates as way stronger than the Ruger #1 loads.
But my first shot in the work up was a Trapdoor starting load.
That first shot recoil hurt so much I did not shoot the rifle again for a year.
I read there were levels of pressure:
Ruger #1 loads
Win 1886 loads
Trapdoor loads
Back then there was no listing for handi rifles.
So I attempted to calculate the max pressure.
I got help from my father, chief engineer gun design with lots of patents, and also from a retired mechanical engineering professor. I learned about Lame's formula for thick walled hoop stress and how to calculate a section modulus.
It turns out the rifle calculates as way stronger than the Ruger #1 loads.
But my first shot in the work up was a Trapdoor starting load.
That first shot recoil hurt so much I did not shoot the rifle again for a year.
Hornady Dies and Lee Factory Crimp Die
48.0 of IMR 4198
350gr Speer FN
In that T/C you can seat the bullet out to the crimping grove in that single shot. I would put a max on it at 48.0 I don’t think it’s as strong a Ruger No 1 to increase the powder charge more.
If deer are the biggest game the Hornady Factory load with FTX 325gr should be alsom!
48.0 of IMR 4198
350gr Speer FN
In that T/C you can seat the bullet out to the crimping grove in that single shot. I would put a max on it at 48.0 I don’t think it’s as strong a Ruger No 1 to increase the powder charge more.
If deer are the biggest game the Hornady Factory load with FTX 325gr should be alsom!
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The 45/70 is a daisy to load for, check the manufacturer recommendations for pressure limits for the rifle. Hornady makes a 300 grain flat nose and a 350 grain round nose that plants them quickly at your range requirements. I believe 4198 will work well.
I found the 444 Marlin and my 450 Marlin (a near duplicate in case volume to the 45/70) work nice in areas where if they jump property line you can't go get them. My old 45/70 stays home most days now.
Hornady Dies and Lee Factory Crimp Die
Reloader 7 preferred powder
IMR 4198
Preferred bullets 350gr Speer FN
Winchester Brass preferred
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45-70 I use heavy dose imr 4198 for 300 gr jacketed bullets for deer hunting, and RL 7 for the heavier 400 gr jacketed bullets. I switched to the 45-90 for even more fun in 20" Winchester 86 light rifle, no muzzle brake, the 300s and 350s are okay. But higher velocities on 400s at 2200 fps and especially the 500 grs at 1810 fps gets around to bruising your shoulder, eventually...and especially with that curved steel butt plate.
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