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445 Super Mag Question

tred1956

Gold $$ Contributor
Hope this is the right place

Was looking at this caliber, why I don't know. Did buy a set of Redding 445 Dies last night
devil.gif
Not a big fan of the heavy hitters anymore, but nevertheless I noticed something I found interesting. Thinking about a 15 inch Contender barrel with brake. Not sure what bullet weight I will use. MGM list the only twist available as 1/20 and Bullberry list 1/14 or 1/16. I understand the heavier bullets need faster twist but I found this odd. Opinions or experience with either would be greatly appreciated

Thanks in advance
Doug
 
Well I think the 445 should be in the big stuff category. Sorry I didn’t have any experience with this round, just remember when Dan Wesson sold one. I do have a Smith and Wesson 500 in 8 3/8 barrel, and a 480 Ruger Red Hawk with 7 1/2 barrel. I’m also a fan of the large pistols nice to have but rarely shoot them. The contender barrel in 445 sounds like a great project. Sorry for the no help here, but had to post when I saw such a cool caliber as the 445.
Thanks Jason
 
I had a 10.5 inch barrel superblackhawk in .44 mag. Was shooting 340 grain rimrock bullets out to 300 yards. I wanted to try the 405 grainers but knew the 1-20 twist was far insufficient. Not sure if the 445 could push that heavy of a bullet fast enough in a 20 twist to be stable, but in a 16 or 14, it’s a sure thing.
 
Hey Doug,

I am a serious TC shooter. The Gen 1 TC's particularly!! I have several of them with the later stainless frames and I sought out a very particular version/model of the stainless frames as well. I have been shooting them competitively at steel chickens for 30 years and of course I hunt with them. I am out in Africa, and we have taken big stuff with TC's!!!! Hunting buds of mine have taken Ellie and buff with them successfully, but I simply don't have cajones of that magnitude. I eat what I hunt and have no desire to be the food!

A 15 inch Contender in a G2 can be a FANTASTIC handgun or a short rifle. For me, the Gen1 suits my smaller hands really well. With the Gen2 and the later frames, I have to reach for the trigger as the frames are a lot beefier to handle the rifle calibers. If you have larger hands and can live with the crappy trigger (comparable to the G1 mind) of the G2 and Encore, then that is the way to go. The standard TC 14 inch barrel had a 1:20 twist I believe and that worked fine for the 200 to 250gr class bullets. We shot heavier WFN bullets in them too with good results, so 20 will work good. I would still do a 16 twist, but a 14 would probably be too limiting on the lighter stuff. The key to shooting handguns like the TC well is practice.. so start with lighter loads, develop the skills and then gradually move up on the load and bullet mass. The TC's are very light guns. You feel the recoil quick, although with rubber grips it will never get uncomfortable. Where the TC was really good for me on hunting pigs on the stalk, was with a 12 inch bull barrel with a red dot. You will easily hit pigs way out from standing position with a rig like that! The 14 to 16inch guns are better when resting them over rocks, branches and backpacks, even a shortie bi-pod works well. Out to 100m and a decent scope, you can pinpoint where you want the bullet to go.

The 445 Supermagum packs a wallop in the very light G1. I have a Freedom Arms revolver in 454 Casull and with full loads both of them are a handful for sure. Whereas the Freedom Arms digests the heaviest loads and begs for more, I have found over the years that with heavy bullets, which generates a lot of recoil obviously, that the frame actually stretches in the G1 TC. It is simply not as impervious to huge recoil forces as the Freedom Arms.

The stretch is particularly noticeable and severe in the trunnion (barrel) pin and where it connects to the frame. The recoil lugs on the barrel take a pounding and you start breaking the roll pin on the lugs as well as the actual barrel lugs. We have hot-rodded the TC's for hunting for decades and know every aspect of how to shoot them and how to hunt with them.

More of a problem with the G1 TC is that the frame is softer than what one expects. Especially in the recoil lug shelf, the lockup area just below the firing pins in the TC breech face. This area gets rounded out by the continuous pounding to the extent that the pistol may even pop open under heavy loads. Watch out for used frames on 44 mags and the heavy slow calibers like the 45-70. They kill TC G1 frames!!

That is not a weakness of the TC I must point out. It was simply never designed to shoot stuff like 45-70's, 300 Winmag, 375 Hand H and the like which I have seen over the years. How the TC frames ever contains that abuse is proof of the ABSOLUTE GENIUS of the design.

The G2 and Contenders are obviously stronger in those area's, but forgive me when I say they are not True Contenders. The Gen 1 should be recognized as a separate firearm I think. I am a bit of a G1 snob, opinions will obviously differ..lol.

So, to your original question. Yes, a 445 Super in a new TC barrel is a really nice option. I would not recommend doing it on a G1 frame, those old timers must be treated with the respect they deserve. They are FANTASTIC in 22lr, the various 6mm's (6mm TCU is a personal favorite) the 7mm Waters and IMSHA versions and the outstanding 30-30 versions, with again the 30-30 Ackley being the pinnacle of calibers I shoot in them. They shoot bullets up to the 165 and 180 class really well within the parameters for the frame. AND they are AMAZINGLY accurate!!

It surprised me to see how much a 44 Magnum with heavy loads can damage a TC gen 1. For the steel chicken game we shot them hot to pop the rams over. Very cheap to shoot obviously. And of course we nailed feral pigs and other critters with hot loads and hard-cast bullets. We damaged frames though and broke stuff. Especially when the guys started porting the barrels or running muzzle-brakes. Porting only mitigated the muzzle flip, the recoil still pushes the gun straight back and torque is quite noticeable. All the frame bending forces are still transmitted into the frame though, only the flip is reduced.

A proper muzzle brake on the rifle calibers may well mitigate felt recoil as well. I run them on 338 LM and 300 Norma rifles with fantastic recoil results. But they are LOUD!!! Very LOUD, especially in a 15 inch barrel?? I have found muzzle brakes work well in rifle calibers, thus small diameter bullets with a lot of gas which makes the muzzle brake work. I don't think it will be that effective in a 445 Supermag with a 300gr bullet going 1800fps. I think there is simply not enough gas to induce proper muzzle control through a brake.

However, I can really recommend you investing in the TC platform. I will never swap, trade or sell mine. Only out of my cold dead grip will they be prized!!!
 
Hope this is the right place

Was looking at this caliber, why I don't know. Did buy a set of Redding 445 Dies last night
devil.gif
Not a big fan of the heavy hitters anymore, but nevertheless I noticed something I found interesting. Thinking about a 15 inch Contender barrel with brake. Not sure what bullet weight I will use. MGM list the only twist available as 1/20 and Bullberry list 1/14 or 1/16. I understand the heavier bullets need faster twist but I found this odd. Opinions or experience with either would be greatly appreciated

Thanks in advance
Doug
Hope this is the right place

Was looking at this caliber, why I don't know. Did buy a set of Redding 445 Dies last night
devil.gif
Not a big fan of the heavy hitters anymore, but nevertheless I noticed something I found interesting. Thinking about a 15 inch Contender barrel with brake. Not sure what bullet weight I will use. MGM list the only twist available as 1/20 and Bullberry list 1/14 or 1/16. I understand the heavier bullets need faster twist but I found this odd. Opinions or experience with either would be greatly appreciated

Thanks in advance
Doug
Doug, I had Virgin Valley custom guns build a 445 super mag barrel at 15.5". It has a brake machined into the barrel. The gun hammers with 240XTP bullets. I built the pistol to used in the Michigan shot gun zone because it meet the straight wall cartridge requirements. I shot a few deer with it. I moved to Texas and no longer hunt so if your interested in purchasing it PM me.
 

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