44 mag

[Laguna Freak]

I’ve read some of the threads on here related to 44 mag loading and am looking for a few more replies.

I load for rifles but I’ve not loaded for handguns yet. I’m preparing to get set up to load for my Taurus Raging Bull. I’m primarily loading for hogs and bear defense.

With that in mind, I’m curious what y’all think about pros and cons of the Swift A Frame (240 & 280) vs Speer 270 gr Deep Curl vs hardened cast bullets of same weight.

Also, what die brand(s) do you 44 mag loaders prefer and why.

 

[Rednexx]

I have never hunted or had to use a 44 Mag. on hogs or bears, I am assuming you mean Black Bears, but if Grizzly or Brown, I think the 44 Mag. is a bit light, I would think 454 Casull or 480 Ruger, 475 Linebaugh or similar. I have never used Swift A Frame bullets, but if it were me I think I would use a Wide Flat Nose Gas Check and go a bit heavier say 250 or 300 maybe even a bit more. As far as die brand I would use Forster if they made handgun dies, otherwise Redding Carbide maybe Lyman Carbide.

 

[Intheshop]

Interestingly,casted up a few hundred Lyman 429244GC bullets this morning. It's 255g with gas check.

 

[SierraCJ5]

Been loading 44 mag since '94, my favorite revolver cartridge and possibly the most flexible available. Ive always used RCBS carbide dies and haven't found a reason to change brand yet. Have had good luck with all brands brass although I do prefer starline these days. Full power loads call for a healthy charge of H110 with a magnum primer; CCI 250 work well. Some revolvers have long cylinders and are more suited for heavy bullets, not sure how the Taurus ranks in this area. As a result be careful with load data for the Ruger Super Redhawk, a notoriously strong revolver. I'm of the belief and many others still consider hard cast the gold standard for tough heavy game. Perform a very secure roll crimp in the groove to prevent binding the revolver due to bullet jump; it's best to crimp in a separate step from seating. Have fun!

 

[msinc]

Interestingly,casted up a few hundred Lyman 429244GC bullets this morning. It's 255g with gas check.

View attachment 1203597 View attachment 1203598

This is a fantastic bullet and really all you need. Very accurate too. Suggest you also look at the Lyman Devastator{see below}. There is no such thing as "hardened" lead...lead is not hardened like other metals. Lead can be made into a harder alloy by adding certain metals, but that is not what you want. They call lead bullets "hard cast" to get folks who don't understand to buy them. True hard alloy lead will lead up your bore and not shoot very accurate after not too many rounds. You are concerned with the Brinell hardness number of the bullets, not sales hype. Best of luck sir.

 

[Twicepop]

Hard cast will lead your bore if undersized to the cylinder throats, if properly sized it's not an issue. Size your cast bullets to the throat diameter or +.0005" and you should be OK. If using the proper alloy with a good lube, sizing to throat diameter or up to +.001" larger should almost negate the need for a gas check

 

[ebb]

Intheshop tell us about your casting equipment? Ive never seen anything like it.

 

[Laguna Freak]

Been loading 44 mag since '94, my favorite revolver cartridge and possibly the most flexible available. Ive always used RCBS carbide dies and haven't found a reason to change brand yet. Have had good luck with all brands brass although I do prefer starline these days. Full power loads call for a healthy charge of H110 with a magnum primer; CCI 250 work well. Some revolvers have long cylinders and are more suited for heavy bullets, not sure how the Taurus ranks in this area. As a result be careful with load data for the Ruger Super Redhawk, a notoriously strong revolver. I'm of the belief and many others still consider hard cast the gold standard for tough heavy game. Perform a very secure roll crimp in the groove to prevent binding the revolver due to bullet jump; it's best to crimp in a separate step from seating. Have fun!

Thank you!
My Raging Bull is over 20 years old, has double cylinder lock up, and is an accurate and comfortable shooter that recoils straight back into the palm (ported muzzle). I have no idea how its tensile and shear strength compares to the Ruger. It is stainless steel so I would guess it certainly is not stronger but I could be wrong because I know nothing about the ss alloy Taurus used. I’ve shot many “supposedly” hot Desert Eagle rounds through it with no problem.

What minimum length would you refer to as a “long cylinder”?

Like many shooters that hand load, I do like to push bullets as fast as is safe and accurate.

Thanks to all who share their sage counsel.

 

[linebaugh]

If you run cast bullets or cast gas checked there are companies that design WFN and LFN bullets with longer noses to take advantage of your cylinder length thus allowing maximum powder capacity.
I used to shoot LFN (long flat nose) 325gr bullets at 1325fps from a 7.5" bbl. H110 or WW296 are going to be your go to powders. That combo will shoot stem to stern on most north american animals and it will leave a 1-1.5" wound channel the entire length. It will also break all manner of bone and still carry the intended bullet path afterward.
Size to the cylinder throats or .0005 over if possible. Seat your bullets and crimp in 2 seperate steps to avoid bullets jumping crimp.

If you dont need many rounds Garrett or Buffalo bore may fit the bill and you would not need to get into reloading.
Cast Performance, Beartooth, Montana Bullet works all make a damn good bullet. You don't want a hollow point as they limit penetration too much.
The jacketed bullets you called out are probably some of the best. You will want deep penetration so go heavy. 300 gr if they make them. In addition I think there is a 300 gr speer gold dot flat point which would also be a good choice.

Prepare for stout recoil. Heavy loaded 44s are nothing to sneeze at and will for sure let you know you are dealing with some serious power.

 

[Iowa Fox]

Interestingly,casted up a few hundred Lyman 429244GC bullets this morning. It's 255g with gas check.

View attachment 1203597 View attachment 1203598

The Lyman 429244 is a good one, My old 4 cav is a very easy casting mold, good crisp fill out, open the mold and the bullets fall out at .4335.

That's a very interesting stand and smokestack you have your pot setting in. Would like to hear more about it.

 

[FeMan]

I load 320 grain hard cast WFN gas checks in my 44 with W296. I have flopped hogs out to 80 yards with them. They are accurate, hit hard and work great on game.

If you have not loaded handgun bullets before beware that you really need to pay attention to case capacity. Seating bullets a little deeper with everything else being the same will raise pressures faster than many realize. Another reason why crimping is important.

 

[msinc]

......."You don't want a hollow point as they limit penetration too much"..........

On a deer, boar or a black bear with a 44 magnum pistol??? Your kidding right!!!! The Lyman Devastator has dropped DRT too many for me to ever agree to that statement. Rhinoceros maybe.

 

[MrK.]

I have a suppressed Ruger 77/44. When I developed loads for it I wanted the heaviest jacketed .44 caliber bullet available. At that time it was 300 grains and I assume it still is. I did bullet tests at 20 yards and 1050 fps, the results are below. BTW, deer or hogs have not been able to tell the difference between any of the three.

 

[biggun2869]

Any carbide set but get a profile (redding) and follow the instructions

 

[Intheshop]

All I shoot is cast Laguna,and these days spend more time behind varmint rigs with lead than handguns. Throw in a few larger bores for deer hunting. The 1980's saw me as a dedicated handgun hunter,spending huge amts of resources refining the skills.Fear not,velocity/pressure..... it is your friend.

"One way" to describe cast is like adjusting a paint spray gun. I'm a good solid journeyman paint guy,Bc'z is a master,but in anycase.... there are controls on a spray gun that aren't as simple as they appear. There's about 4 different adjustments that need to be in sync to lay down "this" paint,on "this" day.... through this gun. Same with cast.

It's a moving target so to speak and trying to put "static" #'s on it just leads to frustration for the guy starting out. Similar to welding,or masonary. Anything that is a high skill,low tech on the tools(questionable statement when you start shopping Sata),there's a learning curve. You just have to put quality time in with study,experiments,and ideally a mentor.

Revolvers are a different breed than other firearms in that the chamber,ain't connected to the barrel(you know what I mean). Further,there's multiple "chambers" with that one barrel. Then there's barrel constrictions,right at the worst possible point(where brrl passes through frame),it's a wonder they're as accurate as they are?

Another,"fear not" or along those lines is the notion that,"it's a handgun,my abilities aren't worth the effort to refine the ammo"..... hogwash. Handguns,when you find a load it really likes.... it REALLY becomes easy to hit with. Yes,you gotta practice.....just sayin,especially with cast,that your efforts at the loading bench can show big rewards on target,dramatically so.

 

[Intheshop]

6" inline duct fan,in between two coffee cans.

Cast for years upstairs in an unfinished BR. There was a sheet metal enclosure,with a plenum that vented out through the soffit. Life was good.

Finishing the room left me high and dry and "needs" changed. The chimney thing isn't 100% about sucking in lead fumes.... lead fumes don't get really nasty until you're well past prudent casting temps but,it's a good idea. The main goal was to provide a, "reducing atmosphere". Think heat treating metals,and am COMPLETELY talkin out my ass here. Another way I looked at it was like shielding gas when welding.... and if I was still getting a tax deduction for it,argon could be used over the melt to provide a cleaner atmosphere. The fan setup,comes from years of design/build on dust collection systems. You can very easily see pockets of stagnant air where the pickups are,either poorly designed or the spacing isn't right.

That was the main goal,creating a sort of vacuum head,over the melt.

 

[Screamer]

I shoot Hornady 240 gr .430 dia. over n110 or imr4227 in my older Redhawk. Both loads shoot great the 4227 has the edge in accuracy. N110 gives more speed. XTP's hold together & penetrate very well. They kill very well.

 

[Laguna Freak]

All I shoot is cast Laguna,and these days spend more time behind varmint rigs with lead than handguns. Throw in a few larger bores for deer hunting. The 1980's saw me as a dedicated handgun hunter,spending huge amts of resources refining the skills.Fear not,velocity/pressure..... it is your friend.

"One way" to describe cast is like adjusting a paint spray gun. I'm a good solid journeyman paint guy,Josh is a master,but in anycase.... there are controls on a spray gun that aren't as simple as they appear. There's about 4 different adjustments that need to be in sync to lay down "this" paint,on "this" day.... through this gun. Same with cast.

It's a moving target so to speak and trying to put "static" #'s on it just leads to frustration for the guy starting out. Similar to welding,or masonary. Anything that is a high skill,low tech on the tools(questionable statement when you start shopping Sata),there's a learning curve. You just have to put quality time in with study,experiments,and ideally a mentor.

Revolvers are a different breed than other firearms in that the chamber,ain't connected to the barrel(you know what I mean). Further,there's multiple "chambers" with that one barrel. Then there's barrel constrictions,right at the worst possible point(where brrl passes through frame),it's a wonder they're as accurate as they are?

Another,"fear not" or along those lines is the notion that,"it's a handgun,my abilities aren't worth the effort to refine the ammo"..... hogwash. Handguns,when you find a load it really likes.... it REALLY becomes easy to hit with. Yes,you gotta practice.....just sayin,especially with cast,that your efforts at the loading bench can show big rewards on target,dramatically so.

I really have not considered casting my bullets. At least not at this stage of the game, and you are confirming that I don’t have time or space for it these days. So, I’m relegated to buying bullets whether jacketed or hard cast.

Do you custom casters have opinions on the bullets mentioned above? Cast and bonded-jacketed?

 

[BDman]

Bear tooth and, whomever picked up LBT's designs (Montana Bullet maybe?) are both excellent bullet makers. I've used both in my .44 mags and heavy .45 LC for years. The WFN in 250-300gr in either caliber can be loaded for about 900-1000 fps and provide excellent accuracy and penetration as well as being comfortable to shoot. Or, can be loaded to higher velocities if you feel the need. The lower power loads will, however, shoot end to end through most NA animals as Linebaugh said.

I quit shooting jacketed bullets a long while back and don't miss them at all. Gas checks can help when dealing with very rough or uneven bores but I don't find the need even for them with quality revolvers. Just my .02

 

[SSL]

Bear tooth and, whomever picked up LBT's designs (Montana Bullet maybe?) are both excellent bullet makers. I've used both in my .44 mags and heavy .45 LC for years. The WFN in 250-300gr in either caliber can be loaded for about 900-1000 fps and provide excellent accuracy and penetration as well as being comfortable to shoot. Or, can be loaded to higher velocities if you feel the need. The lower power loads will, however, shoot end to end through most NA animals as Linebaugh said.

I quit shooting jacketed bullets a long while back and don't miss them at all. Gas checks can help when dealing with very rough or uneven bores but I don't find the need even for them with quality revolvers. Just my .02

My sentiments exactly. I haven't used jacketed bullets in my .44s or .45 Colt in over forty years. It's hard to beat the original Keith designs, but the LBT designs might do that for some purposes. If you are planning to cast your own, you would be well advised to check out NOE for about any design you might want. I use a mix of Lyman and NOE molds depending on the design I want for a particular revolver. I use a Lee sizing die custom cut to size to .432" (for a Ruger with an over-size bore) and .431" and tumble lubed with liquid lube with no leading issues at velocities from 900 to 1,400 fps with my alloy, which appears to be just slightly softer than Lyman's #2 alloy. Bullets come out from 6 to 10 grains heavier, depending on the mold size, with my alloy than listed for #2.