300 win mag loves expensive bullets

[Minesweeper3433]

My rifle will shoot less than quarter inch with nosler accubonds even in the worst weather that NY and florida had to offer. But they are so expensive that I cant afford to get shoot them often enough to practice with for actual use. I have been using sierras and hornady bullets in the rifle but so far the nosler AB is the only one that really shoots. Is there any other bullets that are cheaper that could be used.
I have tried
ballistic tips 180
partitions 180,200
berger 185,190 both hunting and target
sierra 175,190
sierra 180 game king

The rifle is rem 700 28" krieger barrel rem varmint contour, HS stock and bottom metal. All rounds tested have been single loaded from bench with sling studs removed from stock and barrel allowed to cool between shots.

 

[bozo699]

Minesweeper3433,
Have you tried the Hornaday interbonds? if not give it a try however it's expensive trying different loads as well wear and tear on the barrel, my rifle likes the accubonds as well so I just suck up and shoot them, just be happy your rifle shoots I usually wear my barrel out looking for something that will shoot that well
just my $.02
Wayne.

 

[jbarnwell]

I'm with Wayne on this one, also try the Hornady 180 SST. You didn't mention what powders you have tried, I have found they can play just as big a part in accuracy as bullets sometimes. Good luck and hang in there, load development can be frustrating.

Jarvis

 

[glo]

Welcome to the wonderful world of reloading.

To be honest you were just lucky. You hit the right combination or Case, Primer, Powder, Charge Weight, Bullet Seating Depth and Bullet (type, manufacturer and weight) the first time. Your barrel likes this set-up. Its called hitting the “node” or perfect barrel harmonics.

Now you have to do the real work. Start working up loads for the other Nosler, Berger or Sierra bullets. Or not. It would be much cheaper to stay with the load you already have. Even if the bullets cost a buck more than the others.

But be forewarned. Your rifle may not shoot as well when you run out of components you have on hand. You may not be able to get the exact components you have and that may change the node.

 

[JFMorgan]

Just checked shootersproshop.com. They have the Nosler AB 180 .308 blemished bullets for $16.95.
These are cosmetic not defective bullets. I see little or no difference from their regular bullets

Jim

 

[bheadboy]

There is a significant difference in the ojive of the bullets you have shooting and those you are trying that are less expensive,

have you tried an oal base to Ojive gage to see if seating depth change will help the less expensive bullets.

My 300wm hart, shot all you mentioned well but i had to change the oal seating to compensate for the difference in jump.

Bob

 

[Minesweeper3433]

Almost all the bullets shot less than .5 inch but the accubands give me the ability to hit golf balls at 200 yards with my rifle and turn them into shrapnel. I am def going to look into the blemished bullets as I don't care about the look.

 

[glo]

Again Minesweeper34,
I think you have been lucky. You by your our words say the other bullets shoot “.5 inch”. I would stay with the factory 180gr Nosler AB bullets.

Blems do change the B.C.. Yes, they will perform the same as a factory bullet. That is, blems will expand and penetrate on a game animal just the same as the more expensive factory bullets. But looks is what makes ballistic coefficient. Blems will not ... I repeat, will not have the same ballistic coefficient as factory bullets. Furthermore, blems will have varying ballistic coefficients.

I'll bet you a box of Nosler Accurate Bond, .30 cal, 180gr bullets, Midway catalog # 113331 @ $29.00 for 50, that blems won't shoot golf balls at 200yds.

Let me know what happens if you do find blems. We will all be interested.

P.S. I take back what I said. Blemishes do change the B.C. It can raise or lower the bullet's impact velocity. Then the expansion and penetration will change. Blems can be better or worse. But who knows? They are Blems!

That's why they are marked as “blemished”. Buyer beware!

P.P.S. If the blems are better and have a higher B.C. (which I strongly doubt), you will shoot high... and miss your golf balls. Just food for thought.

Okay, I'll spot you 2 (two) sighters. But you get nothing for a clean and well oiled barrel.

 

[bheadboy]

minesweeper 34,
you need to know and understand what "blems" are, in the process of forming the bullets in the presses, all is automated, except the setup of the forming dies themselves,, the dies wear, are polished, readjusted, etc to maintain the ultimate final configuartion, and thus are not all the same, as different sets of dies may be used to manufacture the "excact same bullet" - Also presses are used to manufacture a large number of different designs, so when changing from one design to another, the dies must be changed

Thus the main reason for blems is when a "run of specific bullet" is started, or paused for some reason, the operator must run a test lot of bullets generally 500-1000 after any ajdustment or pause to then test the resultant bullets to see if they are in SPEC!

this is a very precise process and often will require 2-3 adjustments before the resultant bullets are correct within spec,

The bullets manufactured in the test stage are not run through the polish, inspection stage but set aside and sold by the pound!!
as Blems

So when you buy blems you get good bullets but do not get the qulity of dimension/runout/ojive/weight/oal/polish that SPEC requires.

be warned, they shoot, are good but not great! i have shot a lot of them in pistols, and even at pd when $ was a factor.
they are not consistant

Bob

 

[bozo699]

Big bullet manufacturers like Nosler don't sell defective bullets they scrap them! The blemished bullets they are selling are usually cosmetically blemished not physically damaged. Where I work they don't run 500-1000 then check, they setup the machine, turn it on and take measurements, make adjustments, run a few more and re-measure, they continue if necessary until there within specs, all that were made during testing ARE SCRAPPED! not sold as blemished. Blemished bullets are usually the ones that weren't rinsed correctly or dried correctly and are discolored or something, I would be way more concerned with factory seconds then blemished bullets.
Wayne.

 

[4xforfun]

It's off topic, but I'll go there anyway. No need to let the bbl cool between shots. If a bbl is properly stressed relieved you can get it as hot as you want with no POI changes. Just don't let a loaded round cook in the chamber to long and you will be GTG.

Now, keeping a tube from getting hot greatly extends it's life, in my humble opinion. That could be why you are letting it cool.

 

[Minesweeper3433]

That is exactly why I let my barrel cool. When I was up north in NY we could shoot 5-10 shots in the winter before the barrel heated to touch but now I am in FL and 3-5 depending on temp is the norm. I shoot until I can feel the heat of the barrel over the ambient temp with my hand. We had rifles in the armory up in NY that we shot till they glowed but I didn't have to pay for the barrels or ammo. Got to make this krieger last until I am done with my degree or get another job contracting so shooting hot stops till I can get a longer barrel from krieger. I am going to look into the blemed bullets but I tried some blem ammo in 300 winmag that black hills sold and it did not shoot as good as the regular line stuff. Same load and man # just one was blems and the other red box.

 

[Rustystud]

You failed to give us the barrel rate of twist. For 180 grain bullets I recomend 1:10, 1:11.25, and 1;12 depending on barrel length. Longer bullets like faster barrels. The seating depth of the chamber throat. The 300 Win Mag chambers are known to be cut short so the lloaded case will fit into a magazine. Often bullets over 150 grains are seated with the bearing surface behind the neck shoulder juncture of the case. This is not good for accuracy. I have shoot tens of thousands of 300 Win Mag. I have always come back to H-4831 powder and Federal GMM 215 or Winchester LR Primers. Cases should always be full length sized and trimmed. I have found accuracy nodes arround 3150fps with 180 bullets. I have also found 180 Noslers (any configurations) are easy to tune. (usually jammed) If you shoot Bergers they may need testing from .010 out to .015 in the rifling. I have always jumped Barnes bullets or loaded them down due to pressure issues. Others have had great results with IMR-4350, H-1000, and RE-25.
Nat Lambeth

 

[Minesweeper3433]

1-11 twist 28" 4 groove. Mostly shoot 190 grain bullets out of it now till I run out of those then will get the bullet that this post is helping me figure out. the 208 grain hornady is looking nice and the new bergers but by that point I might need a new barrel as the rounds I have now should last me to the end of this barrel. I just want to figure out everything I can before its time to order a new barrel.

 

[bozo699]

1-11 twist 28" 4 groove. Mostly shoot 190 grain bullets out of it now till I run out of those then will get the bullet that this post is helping me figure out. the 208 grain hornady is looking nice and the new bergers but by that point I might need a new barrel as the rounds I have now should last me to the end of this barrel. I just want to figure out everything I can before its time to order a new barrel.

Why, by then you will have to start all over again.
Wayne.

 

[TheSnake]

Big bullet manufacturers like Nosler don't sell defective bullets they scrap them! The blemished bullets they are selling are usually cosmetically blemished not physically damaged. Where I work they don't run 500-1000 then check, they setup the machine, turn it on and take measurements, make adjustments, run a few more and re-measure, they continue if necessary until there within specs, all that were made during testing ARE SCRAPPED! not sold as blemished. Blemished bullets are usually the ones that weren't rinsed correctly or dried correctly and are discolored or something, I would be way more concerned with factory seconds then blemished bullets.
Wayne.

I have to agree with Wayne here. I purchased several packs of "major brand" blems and measured them several directions and the consistency was to my satisfaction. Other than the stains and water spots, they are good IMO. I haven't loaded up any yet but will next spring. I try to keep the shooting to a minimum at the ranch during deer season.

 

[DIBBS]

Blems do change the B.C.. Yes, they will perform the same as a factory bullet. That is, blems will expand and penetrate on a game animal just the same as the more expensive factory bullets. But looks is what makes ballistic coefficient. Blems will not ... I repeat, will not have the same ballistic coefficient as factory bullets. Furthermore, blems will have varying ballistic coefficients.

Any personal experience with blems, and photos and data to back up your claims? Which bullets did you try, or are you blowing smoke? : Inquiring minds would like to know, as my results with Hornady and Nosler Blems has been positive! As far as the original posters question, I have a 300 WM that shoots well with Accubonds, but it also does VERY well with Hornady Amaxes & Nosler Partitions. Length to Ogive on your reloads is one thing to experiment with using different bullets (not COL), as well as tweaking the powder charge. Half inch is pretty damn good IMHO.

 

[bozo699]

[/quote]

Blems do change the B.C.. Yes, they will perform the same as a factory bullet. That is, blems will expand and penetrate on a game animal just the same as the more expensive factory bullets. But looks is what makes ballistic coefficient. Blems will not ... I repeat, will not have the same ballistic coefficient as factory bullets. Furthermore, blems will have varying ballistic coefficients.

Any personal experience with blems, and photos and data to back up your claims? Which bullets did you try, or are you blowing smoke? : Inquiring minds would like to know, as my results with Hornady and Nosler Blems has been positive! As far as the original posters question, I have a 300 WM that shoots well with Accubonds, but it also does VERY well with Hornady Amaxes & Nosler Partitions. Length to Ogive on your reloads is one thing to experiment with using different bullets (not COL), as well as tweaking the powder charge. Half inch is pretty damn good IMHO.

I agree with this whole post and the signature as well
Wayne.

Support the NRA and vote Republican to keep our RIGHT to KEEP AND BEAR ARMS!!!

 

[bheadboy]

to all above, THERE ARE REASONS BLEMS ARE BLEMS the don't meet manufacturers spec

Manufacturers are in the business of making money, they do not sell a spec item for less than normal price, they dont throw away non spec items that are reasonably good, but not bad

So, do not expect in the finest of test the blems to be as good as the quality of "name brand" you are use to. you can expect them to be good bullets, but they are not top quality by the manufactures standards so you should understand that.

They donot throw away an opportunity to make the normal expected profit on their production.

Bob

 

[bozo699]

Bob,
Where I work we DO NOT sell defective bullets they DO GET SCRAPPED!! What we sell for blemished bullets are as I stated before cosmetic as in stains from washing and they didn't get rinsed correctly, water spots etc. which I might add DOES NOT CHANGE ANYTHING as far as quality of the bullet, as in B.C, diameter, length, weight,etc. Improper diameter, length, weight, etc. that does not make specification GETS SCRAPPED!! PERIOD!! Now we do sell seconds in loaded ammunition from time to time,...What that means is,...dented cases from handling, blemished bullets,..ie. water spots etc. or discoloring of the brass itself,..NOT cartridges without powder or the proper amount of powder, or miss matched bullets or any other thing that could harm you or your firearm PERIOD!! THE END!! I also can't imagine any reputable ammunition's or bullet manufacturer doing any differently as the liability would be to great!! Blemished bullets or brass are exactly what they sound like blemished in appearance ONLY other wise they would be called Defective or Reject bullets shoot at your own risk!!
Wayne.