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30 br powder workup

Mike, with 34.5 of H4198, my 1.00" long 7 ogive bullets give a fair bit of powder compression.....which I don't mind. ;) My drop tube is a 4" Sinclair that has different caliber 'o' ring inserts. With the .17 insert, it gives the same case fill level as an 8" drop tube with a .30 insert.

Compression is enough that with a neck bushing .004 under the neck diameter, the bullets will creep up .003-.004 within about 10-15 minutes of seating. The .925's would be a nice way to end run this.

In general though, it's a .925 world with the BR/Major cases. I just prefer the 1.00 stuff for my junk for a couple reasons.

Good shootin' :) -Al
It's been a while since I shot 1.000 jackets much and I prefer bullets in the 8-9 ogive range, but you do bring up a good point, Al. Part of my reasoning is the shorter neck length of the 30 Major vs a BR. But with n120, I don't have to heavily compress the charge with any bullet that I shoot. My charge is generally a little over half way up the neck with no drop tube and dumping straight from the powder measure. The newer lots appear to be a bit slower than the old n120, though. I recently blended everything I had left of n120. Still need to fine tune it a little but it's shooting well where I'm at with the blend of old and new. I need to chrono it too. I can tell I'm a little slow with it.
 
As a reference, here's 34.5 of H4198 in my 30BR cases. Case length is 1.500. With a 4" drop tube and a .172 tapered orifice/restrictor, the powder is right at .120 below the case neck. With my 7 ogive 1.00" jacketed bullets, the base of the bullet is .165 into the case neck when seated to a .010 jam/seat.

Another thing that can help getting enough powder in the case is a coil spring that fits tightly into the drop tube and is stretched out a bit. The powder travels around the spring....in essence making the drop tube act like it's 'longer'.

For what it's worth..... -Al
RCBvIOdl.jpg
 
My overall case length is a little longer than most, my trim to length is 1.545.

My own bullet is a 112 on .925 jackets. I shoot 35 grns of 4198 or 35.3 grns of LT-30.

where I stray from the usual is I use a very light neck tension and jump the bullet around .015.

Seating depth is very critical in a 30. Once you find it, avoid changing it no matter what.

By the way, in 100/200 yard VFS, the only reason to use anything over a 112 grn bullet, ( in my opinion), is if you like more recoil.
 
As a reference, here's 34.5 of H4198 in my 30BR cases. Case length is 1.500. With a 4" drop tube and a .172 tapered orifice/restrictor, the powder is right at .120 below the case neck. With my 7 ogive 1.00" jacketed bullets, the base of the bullet is .165 into the case neck when seated to a .010 jam/seat.

Another thing that can help getting enough powder in the case is a coil spring that fits tightly into the drop tube and is stretched out a bit. The powder travels around the spring....in essence making the drop tube act like it's 'longer'.

For what it's worth..... -Al
RCBvIOdl.jpg
After trying the spring, I ran across a tip about threading the inside of the tube, which causes the powder to spin, slowing it down. Somewhere in my mess of tools I have a long shank tap that worked for the smaller ID Harrell's drop tubes. You don't have to do the whole thing.
Added picture. As bad as it looks I find that the black stuff helps reduce static charge buildup in the measure.
 

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My overall case length is a little longer than most, my trim to length is 1.545.

My own bullet is a 112 on .925 jackets. I shoot 35 grns of 4198 or 35.3 grns of LT-30.

where I stray from the usual is I use a very light neck tension and jump the bullet around .015.

Seating depth is very critical in a 30. Once you find it, avoid changing it no matter what.

By the way, in 100/200 yard VFS, the only reason to use anything over a 112 grn bullet, ( in my opinion), is if you like more recoil.
There is another reason and in your texas heat, it's possible that you don't see its affects as often. That being, as good as h4198 is in a 30br, it's a tad slow, hence your heavy charge working well. The heavier bullet, hard jam and heavy neck tension would logically offset the powder being a tad slow. I've seen a few 30s that shot best with some jump but not the majority, at all. It's common to see shots pop out the bottom early in the day with h4198, around here. We all blamed range gremlins. The funny thing about that is, I pretty much quit having those gremlins when I went to a 30 major, which likes n120, a bit faster powder than h4198. Fwiw.
 
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There is another reason and in your texas heat, it's possible that you don't see its affects as often. That being, as good as h4198 is in a 30br, it's a tad slow, hence your heavy charge working well. The heavier bullet, hard jam and heavy neck tension would logogically offset the powder being a tad slow. I've seen a few 30s that shot best with some jump but not the majority, at all. It's common to see shots pop out the bottom early in the day with h4198, around here. We all blamed range gremlins. The funny thing about that is, I pretty much quit having those gremlins when I went to a 30 major, which like n120, a bit faster powder than h4198. Fwiw.
I have a 8 pound jug of IMR 4227 that I am tempted to try one day.

I started VFS years back with a 30PPC. We shot H4227 in it. The problem was there was a very fine line between shooting great scores and not being able to get the bolt open.
 
I have a 8 pound jug of IMR 4227 that I am tempted to try one day.

I started VFS years back with a 30PPC. We shot H4227 in it. The problem was there was a very fine line between shooting great scores and not being able to get the bolt open.
That's why I stay away from it. It can shoot small but boy is it sensitive! Use with caution!:oops:
Also, there used to be a Canadian and an Aussie version of 4227. The Canadian was bad fast and spikey. The Aussie, fast too but considerably more predictable about building pressure. Check the label. I THINK, the H powder was all Aussie but the IMR came both ways.
 
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This is a preliminary powder workup for my 30 br. H4198 - 118 Bib - just touching. There is a RAS tuner on it. The tuner is all the way out, so there is only one way to go. What powder charge would you try to tune? This was at 100 w flags on a clam day. - thoughts?
thanks Don.
YWOoooooCH - for a 30BR, that's UGLY!:eek: More powder, & Go straight to RAMMA-LAMMA-JAMMA and don't look back!
< https://bibullets.com/stuff-2/ > This rodeo has been non-stop for 24 years already!;) RG
 
Jackie, your 1.545 'long neck' BR reamer would work nicely with the 1.00" 7 ogive bullets. -Al

P.S.- Did you get your 7.62×39 BR project up and running?
 
MMmmm my necks are to short to jam a 118 BiB much without the bullet falling out. I guess a longer bullet or a shorter rifle. / LOL on a shorter rifle. ;} . I will work with what I have and if it doesn't work I will order some bullets built on a 1'' jacket. I guess when chambering you need to get the freebore just right!
I have the RAS tuner brake trying to cut down on recoil for this ol guy.

I hope to test this week so I will be back.

Some good info here - thanks so much guys.

Safe n Happy 4th to all. - - Don.
 
Don, the 118 BIBs are on the 1" jackets. There are 7 and 10 ogive versions. Both will be able to be 'jammed' provided the free bore is of a length appropriate for the use....which is commonly from zero to maybe .030 at the outer limits. Too much freebore length and/or an excessively large free bore diameter are sure fire accuracy killers for a 30BR.

Just to clarify...whats the free bore of your chamber? Do you have a print of the reamer used? Also, measure the length of the BIBs you have as a double check.

Respectfully, something is way off. Let's see if we can get you on track. -Al
 
MMmmm my necks are to short to jam a 118 BiB much without the bullet falling out. I guess a longer bullet or a shorter rifle. / LOL on a shorter rifle. ;} . I will work with what I have and if it doesn't work I will order some bullets built on a 1'' jacket. I guess when chambering you need to get the freebore just right!
I have the RAS tuner brake trying to cut down on recoil for this ol guy.

I hope to test this week so I will be back.

Some good info here - thanks so much guys.

Safe n Happy 4th to all. - - Don.
Regrettably, this is, likely, your situation: < https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/the-so-called-robinett-30-br-reamer-exposed. >
Your barrel probably features a LONG (1.560" OAL) chamber - you may obtain proper length via fire-forming, as opposed to mechanical neck-up.
It is very likely that your chamber, combined with necked-up brass, leaves 0.040-0.050" of empty chamber neck, which amounts to [neck diameter] excess free-bore, in addition to whatever actual free-bore the reamer produces! A very undesirable situation.:oops:
Especially if my [INCORRECTLY SPELLED, as in Robinette, or, Robinete] name is on the print - it's "look out buddy" . . . you do not have a ROBINETT dimensioned reamer, but rather, something else . . .:eek:
As I have stated many times, it may be better, or, worse, but it not the same. RG

And this:
My terminology may not be correct. The reamer is a .330 Robinett no turn neck reamer. That is how it was explained to me. Upon expanding the necks of the 6mm lapua brass I will need to turn the necks using your formula to get the proper neck thickness and I plan on using a Harrell's sizing die. Am I missing something here. I have tried reading all that I can. This is my first attempt with the 30BR and I want to get it right. Any clarification and help from you is greatly appreciated. Please PM me and get me on the right track.
We need a pic of the reamer print.
Unfortunately, there are a multitude of [so called] Robinett 30BR reamers, which feature differing dimensions, thus ARE NOT what one would expect on a reamer bearing my name - peruse this link:

The [so called] Robinett 30 BR reamer- exposed.

:(If the print states, "NO TURN", that's a "red flag" for certain. :confused: RG
 
Randy, I have had quite a few shooters order the reamer I use, not realizing that if they make their cases by necking them up instead of blowing them out, the cases 3AE1A139-35B9-4CA4-B6DA-75BA1E5A46E4.jpegwill in all likelihood be too short for the 1.555 overall chamber length.

This is especially true with the 118 bullets with a higher number ogive. Even with a true zero freebore reamer.

here is what the 1.545 trimmed to length case looks like in my chamber, and where my bullet sits in the case with the off the lands seating depth.DC2EAD3B-9A0C-4C2A-8203-5B75461E9A9C.jpeg0B2B86B4-BEF3-41DE-BE5A-90688CA31652.jpeg
 
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The light bulb is glowing on my rifle. This rig shot excellent a few years ago, then I put it on the shelf because I ran out of powder. Since then my new lot of H4198 is different. I also took the tuner / brake apart to clean it. I originally necked them up with a mandrel making the neck to short. What worked before doesn't seem to work as well today. So I'm starting a new, w 34.5 as Mike suggested. With your help I have a load that shows promise and I will be back.

Some great info here, thanks again for the education.
 
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Jackie, your 1.545 'long neck' BR reamer would work nicely with the 1.00" 7 ogive bullets. -Al

P.S.- Did you get your 7.62×39 BR project up and running?
Al, it took me forever to get the reamer, then we got into the shooting season, work at he shop picked up, so even though I have all the parts gathered up, it got put on the back burner.

Now I am trying to get something going for The Tack Driver. I have given up on my long range 103 bullet for the moment, I just can’t make it Agg. It has to be the most finicky thing I have ever messed with.

So it will probably be my 30 BR or 6PPC.
 
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All of this talk about 30brs made me pull my work in progress back out today to see if the load I worked up a few months ago was legit. Can’t say about agging through the day. I methodically worked up a load with my 30br several months ago and it shoots good with Lt. 30.

Today, started off good and got better. I increased the load by .03 and then another .04. 3 shot groups at 100 yards.

image.jpg
 
This is a typical target that was shot a few days ago. They are h4895 at 34.5 with Bib 118s. The bottom one is with some jump and 0015 neck tension. Top one is touching with .0035 neck tension. It's unreal the willingness of some of our members to help a ol guy out.

thanks everyone. Don.
 

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Seat a bullet into a sized case (no powder) as long as possible; like stop as soo as you feel it go into the case. Then close the bolt. Take it out and measure it. Start testing there and work into the case from there at .003 intervals.
 

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