.284 Winchester Powders

[kyreloader]

I have two loads that both shoot well in my new Brux barrel chambered in .284 Win, 52.2g of H4350 and 56.2g of H4831SC.

When I put my data into the excel worksheet for accurate barrel life it seems like the H4350 load will have better barrel life.

H4350, 52.2g, 3760, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 2077 rounds of accurate barrel life.
H4831SC, 56.2g, 3870, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 1551 rounds of accurate barrel life.

Can I really get 526 more accurate rounds using H4350 versus H4831SC?

Both powders shoot equally well in my barrel, both are known for being temperature stable, I have similar amounts of each powder.

I would like to hear the forum's comments on these two powders for use with 180g bullets in the .284 Winchester.

 

[280man]

Find one powder you trust and go for it. For me it has been H4350. Like Erik said the other day barrels are like race car tires. Burnem up and get another one.

 

[dannyjbiggs]

I have two loads that both shoot well in my new Brux barrel chambered in .284 Win, 52.2g of H4350 and 56.2g of H4831SC.

When I put my data into the excel worksheet for accurate barrel life it seems like the H4350 load will have better barrel life.

H4350, 52.2g, 3760, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 2077 rounds of accurate barrel life.
H4831SC, 56.2g, 3870, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 1551 rounds of accurate barrel life.

Can I really get 526 more accurate rounds using H4350 versus H4831SC?

Both powders shoot equally well in my barrel, both are known for being temperature stable, I have similar amounts of each powder.

I would like to hear the forum's comments on these two powders for use with 180g bullets in the .284 Winchester.

My, my...I would think that you would get longer life using H4831SC! Plus, I get on up to 2,500 - 2,600 rounds on my .284, but only using 52.00 grains of H4350 with the Berger 180 Hybrid. Of course, I've lost some of my original velocity by then.

Danny Biggs

 

[WindSurgeon]

I have two loads that both shoot well in my new Brux barrel chambered in .284 Win, 52.2g of H4350 and 56.2g of H4831SC.

When I put my data into the excel worksheet for accurate barrel life it seems like the H4350 load will have better barrel life.

H4350, 52.2g, 3760, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 2077 rounds of accurate barrel life.
H4831SC, 56.2g, 3870, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 1551 rounds of accurate barrel life.

Can I really get 526 more accurate rounds using H4350 versus H4831SC?

Both powders shoot equally well in my barrel, both are known for being temperature stable, I have similar amounts of each powder.

I would like to hear the forum's comments on these two powders for use with 180g bullets in the .284 Winchester.

My, my...I would think that you would get longer life using H4831SC! Plus, I get on up to 2,500 - 2,600 rounds on my .284, but only using 52.00 grains of H4350 with the Berger 180 Hybrid. Of course, I've lost some of my original velocity by then.

Danny Biggs

Rick and Danny: What velocity are you getting with 52 grains of 4350 (Danny's load) in your .284? Right now I am shooting 55.6 of H4350SC and getting 2820 fps but have significant sticking bolt problems. I do full length resize every other round and bump the shoulder back without any success in stopping the issue. Just wondering what speed the successful shooters are working at. Thanks.

 

[Chappy]

Have you tried H1000 in your 284?

 

[Laurie]

The barrel ife calculator works off the heat input allied to shooting rate (faster you shoot, the greater the heat build-up in the throat area).

H4831sc has a nominal specific energy of 3,870 KJ/Kg (Kilo-Joules energy per kilogram weight) whilst H4350 has a lower 3,760 KJ/Kg value. So, you're using around 8% more powder with H4831 with a roughly 3% higher energy rating, that is the 4831sc load injects around 10% more heat into the barrel.

Being slower burning doesn't necessarily help either despite what one might think - it lengthens the period of bullet movement / time where pressures and heat are at their highest.

Still, I doubt if the difference is as great as 500 rounds, or a third greater barrel life, from 4350 all other things being equal. But ... are you sure they are equal? Running the pair through QuickLOAD suggests that you may be running above 60,000 psi assuming you are using 180s, and that with representative components plus your charge weights for H4350 and 4831sc loads, the 4831sc load runs at a full 1,000psi higher PMax than the 4350 equivalent.

 

[280man]

I was unaware of H4350sc.

I shot 50.3 of H4350 in my last barrel and velocity was 2835ish

 

[dannyjbiggs]

Depending on elevation and temperature, I generally get 2910-2920 fps with a 32-inch barrel after 100 to 300 rounds using 52.00 grains of H4350. This velocity seems to generally holds up to around 1,000 rounds, then in the 2,880 fps area for awhile, and dwindles down to 2,840-2850 fps around the 2,500 round mark. I have worked up a load for the H4831SC at 55.50 grains. It shoots well enough that I would use it in competition if I could not get H4350. My H4350 load seems to have a slight edge on accuracy. So, I've shot very few SC rounds thru my barrels. My chamber is the .284 Whitley. (Knowing that your follow-on question will concern reamer print data...I've attached it.) I'm not very familiar with the straight Win .284 print data--never used one. I do note that the Whitley is slightly larger in the case head area than the Shehane?? I've never been able to discuss with Robert Whitley his design strategy for it?? After 3 to 4 firings, primer pocket attrition starts in. I can start pushing a few seated primers out with a hand de-capping tool. They are all fairly shot out at 8 firings.

Danny Biggs

P.S. I use the Oehler at 10 feet. I'm hoping to have a Shehane on line within the next 3 months to see how the two compare?

 

[WindSurgeon]

Depending on elevation and temperature, I generally get 2910-2920 fps with a 32-inch barrel after 100 to 300 rounds using 52.00 grains of H4350. This velocity seems to generally holds up to around 1,000 rounds, then in the 2,880 fps area for awhile, and dwindles down to 2,840-2850 fps around the 2,500 round mark. I have worked up a load for the H4831SC at 55.50 grains. It shoots well enough that I would use it in competition if I could not get H4350. My H4350 load seems to have a slight edge on accuracy. So, I've shot very few SC rounds thru my barrels. My chamber is the .284 Whitley. (Knowing that your follow-on question will concern reamer print data...I've attached it.) I'm not very familiar with the straight Win .284 print data--never used one. I do note that the Whitley is slightly larger in the case head area than the Shehane?? I've never been able to discuss with Robert Whitley his design strategy for it?? After 3 to 4 firings, primer pocket attrition starts in. I can start pushing a few seated primers out with a hand de-capping tool. They are all fairly shot out at 8 firings.

Danny Biggs

P.S. I use the Oehler at 10 feet. I'm hoping to have a Shehane on line within the next 3 months to see how the two compare?

Thanks Danny. The velocity over 2900 fps is interesting in that I am at 2820 and getting sticky bolt pull. I am wondering if I went to 4350 if I could keep my velocity and lose the sticky bolt.

 

[effendude]

Depending on elevation and temperature, I generally get 2910-2920 fps with a 32-inch barrel after 100 to 300 rounds using 52.00 grains of H4350. This velocity seems to generally holds up to around 1,000 rounds, then in the 2,880 fps area for awhile, and dwindles down to 2,840-2850 fps around the 2,500 round mark. I have worked up a load for the H4831SC at 55.50 grains. It shoots well enough that I would use it in competition if I could not get H4350. My H4350 load seems to have a slight edge on accuracy. So, I've shot very few SC rounds thru my barrels. My chamber is the .284 Whitley. (Knowing that your follow-on question will concern reamer print data...I've attached it.) I'm not very familiar with the straight Win .284 print data--never used one. I do note that the Whitley is slightly larger in the case head area than the Shehane?? I've never been able to discuss with Robert Whitley his design strategy for it?? After 3 to 4 firings, primer pocket attrition starts in. I can start pushing a few seated primers out with a hand de-capping tool. They are all fairly shot out at 8 firings.

Danny Biggs

P.S. I use the Oehler at 10 feet. I'm hoping to have a Shehane on line within the next 3 months to see how the two compare?

Thanks Danny. The velocity over 2900 fps is interesting in that I am at 2820 and getting sticky bolt pull. I am wondering if I went to 4350 if I could keep my velocity and lose the sticky bolt.

Wind,
I would be less worried about velocity and more worried about safety, function and accuracy. Lay the ammo that causes a sticky bolt in the sun for a string and you have big issues. I load for the least amount of vertical at 600 yards, testing in 5 shot groups often more than once. Only after I find my best load is the chronograph brought out for drop chart computation and to satisfy curiosity.

Scott

 

[Keith Glasscock]

The sticky bolt pull might have more to do with reamer dimensions than pressure.

A 284 Win reamer will cut the case web area @ ~.500"

My 284 Lapua/Norma cuts it @ ~.503

If you shoot Lapua cases through the former, you can get a sticky bolt pull. Try some Winchester cases (Mr. Kiff recommends checking to make sure your sizer brings it down enough), or chase it with the Lapua/Norma reamer and your problems might disappear!

How do I know these dimensions? I got the reamers crossed up on a barrel. Used a Win reamer and couldn't get full length sized Lapua cases to drop out of the chamber. Lesson learned.

To answer the OP's question, I don't think that the difference for equal velocities will be that dramatic. I've shot both powders, but prefer H4350 from a stability standpoint. I also had some barrel heating problems with H4831SC. I couldn't get through a string without getting the barrel too hot (I mean melt the glue off holding the velcro on hot).

 

[Keith Glasscock]

Danny,

Do you shoot the .100" freebore or throat it out?

Thanks,
Keith

 

[kyreloader]

To answer the OP's question, I don't think that the difference for equal velocities will be that dramatic. I've shot both powders, but prefer H4350 from a stability standpoint. I also had some barrel heating problems with H4831SC. I couldn't get through a string without getting the barrel too hot (I mean melt the glue off holding the velcro on hot).

Thanks Busdriver.

I have some rounds loaded with IMR 4451 to also see how it shoots them (recently bought 8 lbs) and to compare with the H4350 load as well. It has been cold and snowy here and that has limited my ability to get out and shoot. I did see the temperature test on the Daily Bulletin which made me want to also try this powder. Now I need to find out its nominal specific energy (I have an email out to Hodgdons).

I doubt that I will shoot anything but H4350 in this barrel.

Thanks for everyone's input on this.

 

[KWeigel]

Tag

 

[rifle48]

I have two loads that both shoot well in my new Brux barrel chambered in .284 Win, 52.2g of H4350 and 56.2g of H4831SC.

When I put my data into the excel worksheet for accurate barrel life it seems like the H4350 load will have better barrel life.

H4350, 52.2g, 3760, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 2077 rounds of accurate barrel life.
H4831SC, 56.2g, 3870, 60,000 and 40 sec shot rate equals 1551 rounds of accurate barrel life.

Can I really get 526 more accurate rounds using H4350 versus H4831SC?

Both powders shoot equally well in my barrel, both are known for being temperature stable, I have similar amounts of each powder.

I would like to hear the forum's comments on these two powders for use with 180g bullets in the .284 Winchester.

I realize this is an old thread, but what grain bullet?

 

[Sandstorm]

They all shoot the 180gr Berger Hybrid

 

[ebb]

If you want longer barrel life go with H1000, hybrid 100V or VV165

 

[Steve Blair]

If you want longer barrel life go with H1000, hybrid 100V or VV165

Even a .284 Shehane will not hold enough H1000 to reach pressure. A 7-270 WSM is about the smallest 7mm that can effectively use H1000.