284 or 30-06

[Eric Leonard]

if you wanted to shoot the absolute farthest you could with a 308 boltface what caliber would you use,,maybe a 284 with the 180-195s or a 30-06 with the 215-230s,,

which should shoot the best the farthest,,or would you consider something else like a 280 AI??

 

[cmillard]

I think an 06 with lapua brass, custom throat, 9" twist with a 3 groove canted, polygon or radial rifling finished at around 31-32 inches and 230 grain hybrid with some h4831 powder or some similar single base.

 

[Sheldon N]

The extra speed you'll get with the lighter 7mm projectile tips the scale in favor of the 7mm especially since the BC of the Berger 195 hybrid is better than that of the 230 Hybrid.

280AI is the most powder you can get behind a 7mm projectile with a standard 308 bolt face. RL26 seems to be the powder with the best velocity in that case size and projectile weight.

I'd be looking at a 280AI, fast twist long barrel, shooting the 195's with RL26.

Only thing that would tip the scales toward a 30 cal would be if you were to consider shooting Warner Tool Flatline solid projectiles. Not cheap, but their 198gr bullet has a very impressive G7 BC of .430. Additionally it will run much faster velocity than you'd expect given its weight.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I also like the 280 ai. Its a simple process to open up your boltface to a magnum if thats what you really prefer.

 

[jim_k]

The farthest something will shoot is not the farthest you will hit anything. Take any rifle/shooter you want - lie him/her (for a Gallagher girl) prone with their favorite rifle for one shot every day, which will be a cold-bore shot, either clean or fouled, at the discretion of the shooter. Distance will be 1,000 yards. I'm only asking 5 consecutive days from different geographic locations, in 5 different compass directions, and the shot will be taken 15 minutes after official sunrise. I'll give you a free shoe-shine if anybody on earth can hit those five shots within 5" of the intended point of impact, and that will be any rifle, any prone rest, on an official F-class bullseye target (not even an animal silhouette), and it's a known-distance shot. Anybody out there want to bet a free shoe-shine they can do it? Bueller?

 

[DocDoc]

The farthest something will shoot is not the farthest you will hit anything. Take any rifle/shooter you want - lie him/her (for a Gallagher girl) prone with their favorite rifle for one shot every day, which will be a cold-bore shot, either clean or fouled, at the discretion of the shooter. Distance will be 1,000 yards. I'm only asking 5 consecutive days from different geographic locations, in 5 different compass directions, and the shot will be taken 15 minutes after official sunrise. I'll give you a free shoe-shine if anybody on earth can hit those five shots within 5" of the intended point of impact, and that will be any rifle, any prone rest, on an official F-class bullseye target (not even an animal silhouette), and it's a known-distance shot. Anybody out there want to bet a free shoe-shine they can do it? Bueller?

The extra speed you'll get with the lighter 7mm projectile tips the scale in favor of the 7mm especially since the BC of the Berger 195 hybrid is better than that of the 230 Hybrid.

280AI is the most powder you can get behind a 7mm projectile with a standard 308 bolt face. RL26 seems to be the powder with the best velocity in that case size and projectile weight.

I'd be looking at a 280AI, fast twist long barrel, shooting the 195's with RL26.

Only thing that would tip the scales toward a 30 cal would be if you were to consider shooting Warner Tool Flatline solid projectiles. Not cheap, but their 198gr bullet has a very impressive G7 BC of .430. Additionally it will run much faster velocity than you'd expect given its weight.

The .280 Sherman is a little more work than the .280 AI, but it gives more cases capacity and velocity.

 

[Eric Leonard]

The farthest something will shoot is not the farthest you will hit anything. Take any rifle/shooter you want - lie him/her (for a Gallagher girl) prone with their favorite rifle for one shot every day, which will be a cold-bore shot, either clean or fouled, at the discretion of the shooter. Distance will be 1,000 yards. I'm only asking 5 consecutive days from different geographic locations, in 5 different compass directions, and the shot will be taken 15 minutes after official sunrise. I'll give you a free shoe-shine if anybody on earth can hit those five shots within 5" of the intended point of impact, and that will be any rifle, any prone rest, on an official F-class bullseye target (not even an animal silhouette), and it's a known-distance shot. Anybody out there want to bet a free shoe-shine they can do it? Bueller?

I understand all that and agree,,but if you cant get the bullet to the target with remaining velocity of about 1300 fps your odds of making hits go way down,,

in the 280 AI can you get enough speed with the 195 Berger or 197 SMK to actually get less wind drift and longer supersonic flight than with the 180 or 168 class bullets,,I never loaded for a 280 or a long barreled long throated 30-06 either and have no idea what to expect,,,I have shot enough 338 LM to know I dont want to shoot 80 cent bullets and 100 grs of powder a shot,,

I am shooting a 243 now and the 105 orange box vlds at 3200 fps shoot really well at 1,000 yards,and holds up pretty well at 1300 but I want to move the gongs on out to 1500 and not get completely embarrassed if I wound up somewhere that they were shooting a mile,,just for fun of course,,

I dont think anybody here is claiming to be Carlos Hathcock,,

 

[birdog]

if you wanted to shoot the absolute farthest you could with a 308 boltface what caliber would you use,,maybe a 284 with the 180-195s or a 30-06 with the 215-230s,,

which should shoot the best the farthest,,or would you consider something else like a 280 AI??

I would take a look at the equipment list of 1,000 yard IBS or NRA F-Class matches and see what the serious competition guys are using. You will find one of your 3 choices in the winners circle quite often

 

[jim_k]

OK, I erased my first response, because I read more closely what you are after. To get to 1 mile and ping a gong, you need a 280 AI with a 30-32" barrel, and JLK 180 gr bullets. Load them to about 2,950 fps and whang 'em. You might need a bullet pointer, like the Whidden, but it's close, since JLK's are pointed pretty good out of the box. Not 80 cents a bullet. The ELR guys will know more, since I have not shot that far, but ballistics is just math. Yes, 338 LM is more $ than I have, too, and it's just a bridge too far.

 

[Capt. Oblivious]

30.06 and 215gr Hybrid gets me to 1300y with no problems but if I had to build n rifle now id also look at a 280ai with the big Bergers.

 

[mac86951]

Certainly seems the current .284 bullets have stepped away from 6.5 or .308 in high BC. 280AI or 284 seems the popular vote.

I'd also be inclined to look at a 30-06AI if throated for the 200.20x. AI to keep brass growth at bay, .308 to keep barrel life up a little.

Absolute farthest distance with .308 bolt face will certainly be the highest BC bullet at a high velocity, guessing the math on .284 would squash a 6mm or 6.5mm -06 for drop at 1000y; and is ahead of anything larger too.

-Mac

 

[284winner]

If there's no certain energy issue or impact velocity requirement to this question, I would say the 06 would certainly do it for the best value ( brass, components wise). The 280, 284 option would offer better exterior ballistics at the longest ranges due to the high BC advantage. Plus push them faster and flatter ( 308 bolt face considered).

 

[Carolina Man]

Eric, unless you just want to build a new rifle you need to look closer to your 243. John Whidden just won the long range matches at Camp Perry with a 243. Look into some serious specs with a 243 and the 115 DTACs bullets. I don't have any up to date info but some old data from Bryan Litz indicates the 243 to be flatter at 1000 yds than any of the others mentioned.

Some suggest looking at what's winning at 1000. Most BR matches are being won with 6mm rifles, mostly Dashers. F class long range is 7mm. Your a benchrest shooter so get out your 243 and star working with some 115s




in the 280 AI can you get enough speed with the 195 Berger or 197 SMK to actually get less wind drift and longer supersonic flight than with the 180 or 168 class bullets,,I never loaded for a 280 or a long barreled long throated 30-06 either and have no idea what to expect,,,I have shot enough 338 LM to know I dont want to shoot 80 cent bullets and 100 grs of powder a shot,,

I am shooting a 243 now and the 105 orange box vlds at 3200 fps shoot really well at 1,000 yards,and holds up pretty well at 1300 but I want to move the gongs on out to 1500 and not get completely embarrassed if I wound up somewhere that they were shooting a mile,,just for fun of course,,

I dont think anybody here is claiming to be Carlos Hathcock,,[/QUOTE]

 

[284winner]

I understand all that and agree,,but if you cant get the bullet to the target with remaining velocity of about 1300 fps your odds of making hits go way down,,

in the 280 AI can you get enough speed with the 195 Berger or 197 SMK to actually get less wind drift and longer supersonic flight than with the 180 or 168 class bullets,,I never loaded for a 280 or a long barreled long throated 30-06 either and have no idea what to expect,,,I have shot enough 338 LM to know I dont want to shoot 80 cent bullets and 100 grs of powder a shot,,

I am shooting a 243 now and the 105 orange box vlds at 3200 fps shoot really well at 1,000 yards,and holds up pretty well at 1300 but I want to move the gongs on out to 1500 and not get completely embarrassed if I wound up somewhere that they were shooting a mile,,just for fun of course,,

I dont think anybody here is claiming to be Carlos Hathcock,,

If you do in fact consider the 243 certainly because it IS worthy of consideration, you must also match that to the 6.5-284 for those longest ranges as well. With today's newest bullets (140 RDF & 147 ELD-M) you will without a doubt be rivaling any heavy bullet in 30 Cal out to any long range situation ( from a 308 bolt face cartridge). Do not over look the 6.5 option either.

 

[Eric Leonard]

I must admit that I might just want another rifle,,LOL,

my 243 load takes 21 MOA to make 1,000 yards from a 100 yard zero,,and I do plan on chambering a bbl I already have to 243 for this rifle also to try the new 110 SMK,

 

[Sniper338]

OP

Narrow down what your wanting to do... put some criteria to it and close the open ended questions.

When you plan a mission you find your mission criteria, which then narrows your search as to what you can do.

I bet you could narrow it to 3 cartridges easily, then reseatch those three to find what meets your needs...

 

[Eric Leonard]

mission accomplished ,,the rifle will be on a Shehane Tracker ST1000-F stock with a Stiller Predator V RBLP 308BF action that will be a 243 95% of the time but will be able to switch to a straight 284 Win by just screwing one bbl off and the other one on,,,,

I was really considering the 30-06 but it seems the numbers just wont allow it,,

 

[Gb300wm]

I second the '06ai. Plenty great 30 cal bullets and the 200 bergers may just get you where you want to be.

 

[jakelly]

Well, in a 32" barrel a 6.5-06 AI will push a 147 ELD over 3400 FPS. Just saying.

 

[boltgunluvr]

if you wanted to shoot the absolute farthest you could with a 308 boltface what caliber would you use,,maybe a 284 with the 180-195s or a 30-06 with the 215-230s,,

which should shoot the best the farthest,,or would you consider something else like a 280 AI??

From what you've stated, the 7 mm gets the nod.