.280 Remington or .284 Win

[Deton8tor]

Just as a matter of learning, why is the .284 Win chosen over a straight .280 Remington? I have seen a lot of info on the F class shooters and others moving to the .284 win. Velocities are very similar and loading pretty straight forward. Is it the case / shoulder design? Asking because I am gathering parts for a 7mm build. Barrel length will not be longer than 28" and I will probably shoot 168's or 180's. Thanks for sharing your experience.




Thanks for the information.

 

[ShootDots]

Just as a matter of learning, why is the .284 Win chosen over a straight .280 Remington? I have seen a lot of info on the F class shooters and others moving to the .284 win. Velocities are very similar and loading pretty straight forward. Is it the case / shoulder design? Asking because I am gathering parts for a 7mm build. Barrel length will not be longer than 28" and I will probably shoot 168's or 180's. Thanks for sharing your experience.




Thanks for the information.

I think there are 2 major reasons for choosing the .284 over the .280 Rem. 1.) If you look at the case capacity, the 284 Win has almost identical capacities NOT to the "straight" .280 BUT to the .280 A.I., which is considerable; and 2.) The .284 has had a reputation for excellent accuracy. There are drawbacks to the .284Win, namely if you run almost anywhere near a "max" load, you most likely experience a loosening up of the primer pockets, which lowers case life. Whereas the .280 has no such problems. On the other hand Shiraz has contracted with Norma to make a "straight" .284 that SHOULD address the weak primer pockets. If it does, this will revolutionize the .284 and it's improved derivatives, because of the "potential" of producing superior brass that will last A LOT longer! If it does as it states, this will be a game changer.

I hope this helps..

 

[DBailey]

I think there are 2 major reasons for choosing the .284 over the .280 Rem. 1.) If you look at the case capacity, the 284 Win has almost identical capacities NOT to the "straight" .280 BUT to the .280 A.I., which is considerable; and 2.) The .284 has had a reputation for excellent accuracy. There are drawbacks to the .284Win, namely if you run almost anywhere near a "max" load, you most likely experience a loosening up of the primer pockets, which lowers case life. Whereas the .280 has no such problems. On the other hand Shiraz has contracted with Norma to make a "straight" .284 that SHOULD address the weak primer pockets. If it does, this will revolutionize the .284 and it's improved derivatives, because of the "potential" of producing superior brass that will last A LOT longer! If it does as it states, this will be a game changer.

I hope this helps..

Hey Ben, I hate to start a debate but I can guarantee you that your case capacity figures are reversed.
The straight 280 Rem. on average has the same case capacity as the 284 Shehane.

EOD350,
Brass selection is the main reason most choose the 284 Win. along with the shape of the cartridge case.
The 280 Rem. is old school and everyone on here knows that old school won't work. : lol

 

[ShootDots]

Dave, look at the Hodgdon loading manual. It has all 3, the .284, .280Rem and .280 A.I. You will see that the powder capacity and velocities are nearly identical for the .284 and the .280A.I. I did neglect to mention that with the .280A.I. you can use slower burning powders, which should help with throat life.. But do take a look...

 

[DBailey]

You got me there Ben, I didn't look at the book just the hundreds of cases at my and my good friends house that we actually measured the capacity of.
On the throat life deal, I'm already embarrassed to tell people how many rounds are on my favorite 280. As a matter of fact the number is so high I quit counting.

Just a side note. The pressure limitations listed in the books for the 280 Rem. were a result of the rifle that the round was originally chambered in. They were semi-auto and pump actions, It was not a modern target rifle.

 

[ShootDots]

Dave, I believe that the .280 is an awesome round. I think the .280A.I. is even better! I think BOTH rounds are actually better than the .284, as the .284 presently sits. BUT if Shiraz's work with Norma pays off as he anticipates, I will change my mind...

 

[lawman29]

The Nosler reloading manual gives case capacity, they vary based on the bullet weight. It states for their 175 grain bullet: .284 = 57.0 gr water .280 = 61.1 gr water and .280AI = 64.6 gr water.

 

[Dgd6mm]

I'm curious as to the case capacity of the .284 Shehane, I have one and have not purchased brass or loaded a round for it yet.

 

[ShootDots]

The Nosler reloading manual gives case capacity, they vary based on the bullet weight. It states for their 175 grain bullet: .284 = 57.0 gr water .280 = 61.1 gr water and .280AI = 64.6 gr water.

This is straight from the Hodgdon manual: .280 Rem: 175gr Soft Point : 51.0gr of H4831; .284 Win: 175gr Soft Point: 57.0gr H4831 and the .280A.I.: 175gr Soft Point: 55.5gr of H4831... If you look at other similar burn rate powders, you will see the same or about the same charge weight difference.. Hodgdon does theirs by pressure, not "accuracy load" or anything like that.

 

[ShootDots]

I'm curious as to the case capacity of the .284 Shehane, I have one and have not purchased brass or loaded a round for it yet.

I read on here and elsewhere that it (the Shehane) is right at 3.3grs more capacity.

 

[kev77]

I think all 3 are very good 284,280,280AI!!! I personally shoot 280AI now as my go to Fclass gun

Just remember "Its not the arrow, It's the indain" ;D


I dont think out of these 3 rounds any one is better than the other for accuracy

 

[Steve Blair]

I'm curious as to the case capacity of the .284 Shehane, I have one and have not purchased brass or loaded a round for it yet.

[br]
Mine measure 68.2. That may vary slightly with different chambers.

 

[rjgonzo]

You guys are very knowledgeable and put on a good discussion on loads.

However, I.M.O. I think your missing one of the main reasons for 284 based cartridges being so popular. Don't you think the short action is being a more rigid platform than the long action enhances accuracy? Not to mention weight advantage and the quick short cycle of the bolt.

Am I being too basic?

 

[Nvreloader]

Per QL, which gives the following FULL H2o values:

Standard 284= 66.0grs
Standard 280= 67.9grs
Improved 280= 74.0grs

QL dose not have the Shehane case listed.

Tia,
Don

 

[ShootDots]

You guys are very knowledgeable and put on a good discussion on loads.

However, I.M.O. I think your missing one of the main reasons for 284 based cartridges being so popular. Don't you think the short action is being a more rigid platform than the long action enhances accuracy? Not to mention weight advantage and the quick short cycle of the bolt.

Am I being too basic?

In one regard you are absolutely correct. IF the OP is using a short action with a LONG throat and NOT worried about a magazine well, then you are correct. On the other hand, if he is considering a .280 or .280A.I., there is an extremely good chance he has a long (30-06) length action he is planning on using. If that be the case, then there goes any rigidity argument. If he has something like a B.A.T. "M" action, rigidity is one of it's strong points as an action. So it largely depends on what action he is going to be using. BUT remember a short action and a .284 using a magazine well, limits it's case capacity greatly, IF you plan on using the magazine..

 

[Dgd6mm]

Thanks for the Shehane capacity.

Don Dunlap

 

[rjgonzo]

You guys are very knowledgeable and put on a good discussion on loads.

However, I.M.O think you are missing one of the main reasons for 284 based cartridges being so popular. Don't you think the short action is being a more rigid platform than the long action enhances accuracy? Not to mention weight advantage and the quick short cycle of the bolt.

Am I being too basic?

In one regard you are absolutely correct. IF the OP is using a short action with a LONG throat and NOT worried about a magazine well, then you are correct. On the other hand, if he is considering a .280 or .280A.I., there is an extremely good chance he has a long (30-06) length action he is planning on using. If that be the case, then there goes any rigidity argument. If he has something like a B.A.T. "M" action, rigidity is one of it's strong points as an action. So it largely depends on what action he is going to be using. BUT remember a short action and a .284 using a magazine well, limits it's case capacity greatly, IF you plan on using the magazine..

I believe his question was "why is 284 chosen over the straight 280?" . I agree that there are some extremely rigid long actions. It is true that even with the Wyatt magazine, in a short action repeater the 284 will lose some potency due to the shorter overall cartridge. I still believe that the advantages of the short action is one of the main reasons for the wide spread preference.