Wayne, I don't think it is quite that simple. I did a quick comparison of a .264WM 140 grain at 3000 fps to a 338WM 200 grain at 2900 fps. The 338WM has more energy out to 450 yards, where they are both about equal at 1740 ft-lbs. After that the .264 retains more energy due to the better BC.
264 win mag
- Thread starter Illinois_shooter
- Start date
bozo699
Gold $$ Contributor
Ok 25 years ago I fed my family government beef because I couldn't afford real beef a .22 magnum behind the ear works great is it optimum for a 800 lb animal, NO but it will work. Ron I understand, But I don't care what the books say, take a 300 grain .338 ultra mag or a .338 Lapua mag or a .338-378 weatherby mag and shoot a clean steel plate @ 1000 yards then take a .264 win mag with a 100 grain whatever and see wich one makes a bigger mark on the plate or shoot a rim rock @ that distance and see which one blows more rock off the rim. I can 100% guarantee which one will and it aint the little guy.
This question has been ask time and time again on here and I just don't understand. I shoot a little pip squeak 7mm-08 because I don't like recoil anymore, would I attempt to shoot a elk @ 1000 yds with it? absolutely not!! if I was able to lob one in on it would it kill it.....maybe. Would I shoot one with my .300 ultra mag @ that distance?......probably not as I don't think it is smart hunting but if I choose to would it kill a elk @ that range?......absolutely. If you had a 20' fifth wheel trailer loaded down with green firewood would you use a short box toyota pick up or would you use a one ton Dodge diesel? I am not trying to be belligerent about it I am just pointing out the authors op is a 100 grain bullet suitable,not can it kill but is it suitable? The answer is no IMO when you could just as easy load a 140 grain bullet into it that would be much more suitable and sensible. I killed many elk when I was a young man with a .243 win in a browning lever action as it was the only centerfire rifle I owned @ the time. Did I use 58 grain v-max bullets? no I did not I used the most optimal bullet for the job I could find @ the time, a 100 grain nosler partition, would the 58 grainer have killed one? probably but it wasn't really
SUITABLE now was it? anyway ijmo, thats all.
Wayne.
This question has been ask time and time again on here and I just don't understand. I shoot a little pip squeak 7mm-08 because I don't like recoil anymore, would I attempt to shoot a elk @ 1000 yds with it? absolutely not!! if I was able to lob one in on it would it kill it.....maybe. Would I shoot one with my .300 ultra mag @ that distance?......probably not as I don't think it is smart hunting but if I choose to would it kill a elk @ that range?......absolutely. If you had a 20' fifth wheel trailer loaded down with green firewood would you use a short box toyota pick up or would you use a one ton Dodge diesel? I am not trying to be belligerent about it I am just pointing out the authors op is a 100 grain bullet suitable,not can it kill but is it suitable? The answer is no IMO when you could just as easy load a 140 grain bullet into it that would be much more suitable and sensible. I killed many elk when I was a young man with a .243 win in a browning lever action as it was the only centerfire rifle I owned @ the time. Did I use 58 grain v-max bullets? no I did not I used the most optimal bullet for the job I could find @ the time, a 100 grain nosler partition, would the 58 grainer have killed one? probably but it wasn't really
SUITABLE now was it? anyway ijmo, thats all.
Wayne.
There is a difference between suitable and preferred IMO.
Suitable - capable of getting the job done
Preferred - the BEST choice for getting the job done
Are there bullets or cartridges that I would prefer over a 100 grain 264? Yeah but to say that a 100 grain 264 isn't capable to take elk with a measure of success isn't correct IMO. Again - bullet construction trumps much.
I just showed where a Creedmoor will take elk at a range that's above the average hunter's skill level. The OP did NOT create ANY boundaries on how he/she intends to use it - for all we know it's 250 yards, max.
A 264 win mag shooting 100 grain Partitions (factory from Nosler and the partition is no junk design) is bringing 2031 foot pounds of energy at 250 yards and only 1.52 MOA of drop with 100 yard zero.
Compare that to a 30-06 shooting the Federal Factory 180 grain Nosler Accubond (more than suitable and adequate for elk) - it's showing 2067 ft lbs of energy at 250 and it need 3.14 MOA to get there with a 100 yd zero. Would anyone say that a 30-06 with 180 grain accubonds isn't a 250 yard elk gun? I think not.
I know you mentioned the 338 Ultra, 338 Lapua etc but those are way MORE than what's needed on elk - let's be reasonable. That's why I chose the 30-06 to compare. Similar sized actions, rifle weights and more than likely - recoil. Once you step into the big boomers like you suggested - recoil goes way up, particularly on a rifle you'd want to carry in elk country.
Even if you wanted to step up to the 300WSM in a factor 180 Accubond offering - We're looking at 2500 ft lbs of energy at the same 250 yards. They match energy of the 264 (@250) at about 400 yards. I'd say the 300 with 180's is an elk cartridge at 400 as much as the 264 is at 250.
Again - IMO, YMMV etc.
Suitable - capable of getting the job done
Preferred - the BEST choice for getting the job done
Are there bullets or cartridges that I would prefer over a 100 grain 264? Yeah but to say that a 100 grain 264 isn't capable to take elk with a measure of success isn't correct IMO. Again - bullet construction trumps much.
I just showed where a Creedmoor will take elk at a range that's above the average hunter's skill level. The OP did NOT create ANY boundaries on how he/she intends to use it - for all we know it's 250 yards, max.
A 264 win mag shooting 100 grain Partitions (factory from Nosler and the partition is no junk design) is bringing 2031 foot pounds of energy at 250 yards and only 1.52 MOA of drop with 100 yard zero.
Compare that to a 30-06 shooting the Federal Factory 180 grain Nosler Accubond (more than suitable and adequate for elk) - it's showing 2067 ft lbs of energy at 250 and it need 3.14 MOA to get there with a 100 yd zero. Would anyone say that a 30-06 with 180 grain accubonds isn't a 250 yard elk gun? I think not.
I know you mentioned the 338 Ultra, 338 Lapua etc but those are way MORE than what's needed on elk - let's be reasonable. That's why I chose the 30-06 to compare. Similar sized actions, rifle weights and more than likely - recoil. Once you step into the big boomers like you suggested - recoil goes way up, particularly on a rifle you'd want to carry in elk country.
Even if you wanted to step up to the 300WSM in a factor 180 Accubond offering - We're looking at 2500 ft lbs of energy at the same 250 yards. They match energy of the 264 (@250) at about 400 yards. I'd say the 300 with 180's is an elk cartridge at 400 as much as the 264 is at 250.
Again - IMO, YMMV etc.
Wayne, I know you are a big bore fan for hunting, and have said before you will not be convinced. Just checking to see if you had changed your mind 
. But, just like in long distance target shooting, BC becomes important. I actually think the 7mm may be the overall champ when it comes to useable BC. By useable, I mean it is high (in the .6's), short enough to stabilize, and still light enough to be reasonably shootable.
No question though that at closer more reasonable ranges the big bores are the energy champs.
. But, just like in long distance target shooting, BC becomes important. I actually think the 7mm may be the overall champ when it comes to useable BC. By useable, I mean it is high (in the .6's), short enough to stabilize, and still light enough to be reasonably shootable.No question though that at closer more reasonable ranges the big bores are the energy champs.
bozo699
Gold $$ Contributor
Ron,
There is no doubt the 7s have awesome down range ballistics. And guys I am not trying to be a jerk about the smaller cals and stuff. I am really not a big bore fan anymore (To much recoil) ??? Its just I have killed so many deer and elk in my life it would be criminal to even mention it on a open forum. a .22 rimfire kills just as dead as a .700 nitro,dead is dead right! I have a .264 wm and I love it. You can yell loud enough to kill a deer but a elk especially when spooked can be a very different story.
I just think bigger is better when it comes to elk and moose.Now with that said, if a .243 or a .264 is all you have then its all you have and you have to use it,deer bear elk moose whatever, so lets use the best bullet for the job and a 100 grain bullet, even a barns or partition isn't as suitable, or the best for the job as a 130 or 140 in a .264 for elk thats all I am trying to convey. The op ask if 100 grainers are suitable for elk and my answer is no since there are more suitable bullets out there.
Teal,
I never said the 100 grain bullet wasn't capable of killing elk, just not optimal. I also think your wrong in saying the big .338s are over kill. when shooting from canyon to canyon LR in windy conditions you cant beat the big .338s. I pack a custom .338-378 wby with 2 in the mag and one in the pipe it weighs in @ 13.2 lbs. I hunt in the rugged Blue mts of S.E Washington and northern Idaho when I feel thats to much I will loose some of the overhang above the belt buckle As of lately I have been shooting SR here on my own property and have been using my 7-08 and or my .264wm but when I go big canyon hunting for the big ones I pack the BIG one ;D
Enjoy your hunting my friends with whatever you may have to hunt with
Wayne.
There is no doubt the 7s have awesome down range ballistics. And guys I am not trying to be a jerk about the smaller cals and stuff. I am really not a big bore fan anymore (To much recoil) ??? Its just I have killed so many deer and elk in my life it would be criminal to even mention it on a open forum. a .22 rimfire kills just as dead as a .700 nitro,dead is dead right! I have a .264 wm and I love it. You can yell loud enough to kill a deer but a elk especially when spooked can be a very different story.
I just think bigger is better when it comes to elk and moose.Now with that said, if a .243 or a .264 is all you have then its all you have and you have to use it,deer bear elk moose whatever, so lets use the best bullet for the job and a 100 grain bullet, even a barns or partition isn't as suitable, or the best for the job as a 130 or 140 in a .264 for elk thats all I am trying to convey. The op ask if 100 grainers are suitable for elk and my answer is no since there are more suitable bullets out there.
Teal,
I never said the 100 grain bullet wasn't capable of killing elk, just not optimal. I also think your wrong in saying the big .338s are over kill. when shooting from canyon to canyon LR in windy conditions you cant beat the big .338s. I pack a custom .338-378 wby with 2 in the mag and one in the pipe it weighs in @ 13.2 lbs. I hunt in the rugged Blue mts of S.E Washington and northern Idaho when I feel thats to much I will loose some of the overhang above the belt buckle
As of lately I have been shooting SR here on my own property and have been using my 7-08 and or my .264wm but when I go big canyon hunting for the big ones I pack the BIG one ;DEnjoy your hunting my friends with whatever you may have to hunt with
Wayne.
Upgrades & Donations
This Forum's expenses are primarily paid by member contributions. You can upgrade your Forum membership in seconds. Gold and Silver members get unlimited FREE classifieds for one year. Gold members can upload custom avatars.
Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.
You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.
To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.
Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.
You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.
To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.