22-250 Testing.. Help? cleaning?

[Scott7m]

I have recently started shooting my Savage 12bvss, it's topped with burris rings, and a burris 8-32x scope. I've been shooting off of sandbags and playing around with it.

My load is:

winchester brass
36.5gr of 4064
cci 250 magnum primers
50gr. Moly v-max hornady

Gun has approximately 20 shots through it. As far as grouping, it's not really burning it up, yet. Groups are ranging in the 1/2 to 3/4in range at 100 yards. I do not have the best of rests by using sand bags but I can beat those groups with my 17HMR.

I am still fire forming brass, havent went back through and tried fire formed brass yet. I'm going to clean my barrel and was wanting some reccomendations on how to do it properly. Here a lot of mixed reviews on this. Also, is it fair to expect the rifle to shoot 1/4 inch groups at 100 when I get the kinks worked out.

 

[Preacher]

The first thing I would do to help those groups would be to change to a standard primer, those 250 mags are a little finicky in a small case sometimes, not always but often enough.
The plain old 200 CCI is a good bet, and a Federal 210M is a really good bet.... if you can find any these days 'O,
Use a quality bore guide while your cleaning, along with a good grade of solvent, I prefer Butches Bore Shine..
Just try to not have the cleaning rod see-saw back and forth on the crown, this is one place a muzzle break is handy, it keeps the rod centered, and off the crown....
Cases formed in your chamber can be expected to shoot tighter groups than your forming loads will, even at the same powder weight..........

 

[Scott7m]

shot another group today, still havent' cleaned it. just took my time squeezed 3 off, and it's about .600 ..

this is the first load i've worked up, new gun, i know i can get it to shoot better seeing how i'm still forming brass. hopefully i can get it to shoot in the .2's or .3's ..

tomorrow or monday i'm gonna do some cleaning and see how it works.

I also set up some small decorative pumpkins up yesterday evening at 300 yards... they were setting on wood blocks and i was nailing them off of sand bags. they were moslty 3-4 inch pumpkins..

 

[Spotcheck_Billy]

Three shot groups don't count :nono::nono::nono:

 

[Scott7m]

3 shot groups don't count in what??????

work for me... after i get it shooting tighter groups i'll try 5

 

[Spotcheck_Billy]

3 shot groups don't count in what??????

work for me... after i get it shooting tighter groups i'll try 5

Three shot groups are not enough to be very meaningful when measuring your rifles accuracy. Sure, they may help in load development allowing you to cull the obvious loads that are not working in your rifle but otherwise they'll fool you into a false sense of accuracy.

Of course, there are a whole bunch of off the rack rifles that are capable of shooting .2" and .3" internet groups on a regular basis. I hear about them on various websites quite often.

I'm waiting to hear about yours

 

[Scott7m]

Yeahh... we'll see how it goes.. I know your not going to find your most accurate load the first time you try it.. So sometime in the next several months I'll figure out a good load.

 

[jb77]

Scott plus 1 on Preachers advice. Try some H380 when you get the chance. Match type bullets may help tighten your groups but with a factory barrel that isn't always the case. I personally have never witnessed a production gun shoot 2's and 3's. Be very happy that you are getting 1/2 groups from a factory rifle. What trigger do you have on this rifle?

Many shooters, myself included could get more out of their rifles with better rests and bench techniques.

 

[redrock]

Many things can change your groups, #1 shoot over flags, if you don't know what the wind is doing, you don't know where to aim, Try Re15 very accurate also stable powder unlike H380 If all you want is accuracy the the H380 works good since it's a reduced load at 38grs for a 52-53gr bullet but if you need both accuracy and velocity there are better options.

 

[jerrold]

Sounds like you are doing a fair amount of shooting and no cleaning. A good bore guide is a must, also a cleaning cradle is a great asset. One peace cleaning rod with proper size, jags, brushes, and patches are must haves for effective cleaning.
Push a well soaked patch through and let it fall off at the muzzle. It wont be a waist to do this again. No back and fourth here. Now the brush, well soaked with solvent, push it out the muzzle and pull it back about once for each shot since last cleaning adding solvent often. To dry Use clean dry patches, the first couple push them through and let it drop off the rod. Then you can scrub to see what the patch will pick up. If the bore is still dirty do the brush and dry again. If you plan to store the gun for any time push a oiled patch through the bore.
IMHO Shooters Choice is as good as any solvent. 3in 1 oil can't be beat. Sinclair patches, brushes, and jags are the best on the market.

 

[jo191145]

You need more than cleaning. You need to back up and do a thorough break in on that tube.
I've never seen a Savage tube that did not require a break in.
Moly bullets do not help in that regard. You should break it in with naked pills.
I'm quessing you'll need a lot of scrubbing with some pretty strong solvents to remove the moly and copper at this point.

After you do a break in and shoot a couple hundred more naked pills you can switch back to moly if you prefer.

The guys are right. Three shot groups do not count. They can be used for load development but they don't count for much else.

Factory guns will shoot in the 2's and 3's. If anyone does not believe it I invite them to go to 204Ruger.com and look up the results of our first Postal Shoot. Savages finished in the top three spots in factory. .247 agg was the winner.,5 shot groups 3 targets only) 2nd place agged .3 something and I came in third with .374 or something close to that.
I was not very happy with my results.

 

[Scott7m]

Well I cleaned my rifle today for the first time... I looked at everyones opinions on how to clean.. Some I liked, Some I wasn't sure about so I just took some advice from all and cleaned the rifle.

I started out by running patches with Butch's Bore shine on them through the bore, ran 4 or 5 patches through, noticed a slight but very slight amount of copper on the first pass or two. I then took some patches and put some of the jb bore compound through it and worked it through the barrel quite a bit. probably 40 strokes or so.

Taking a step back, I looked down the boor into a light bulb before I cleaned,and it looked dirty, after I ran the bore shine through it looked much better. After I went over it with the compound, WOW... it looked like a mirror inside of it practically, couldn't beleive it was the same barrel.

Hope this works out well for me, supposed to be really windy the next couple days so we'll see how it goes.

Also, while at a local gun dealer today I had my gun there and someone else came in and said he had a savage just like mine, I asked him how his shot and he invited me out to his truck to look at some targets. He had about 10 or 12 targets in the truck, he had several groups in the .2's and only one over a .5 most were .3's. I guess we'll see if I can get mine down to that range..

 

[jo191145]

Scott
A mini mag lite down the muzzle while peering into the muzzle is the easiest way to see the last 1/2" of your bore to check for cleanliness. Without a bore scope that is.
Looking through it into a light bulb is not the way, trust me.

 

[Scott7m]

well i did use a lil mini mag as well... the kind that goes onto a key ring... the last 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch looked perfect.

I also ran some patches through it many times just to see if i could get anything, .. nothing.. not even the slightest residue.

I also got a new cz 550 american today in 30-06. still haven't shot it yet. but did some buffing on the bore with JB, and it to looks like a mirror inside..

I'm sure you guys know of Varmint Al, I take a lot of his advice and it seems to work.

 

[Scott7m]

Did quite a bit of shooting today lining up some rifles for several of the neighbors. Got my first chance to shoot my CZ 30-06, after lining it up I fired a 4 shot group, measured around 3/4 of an inch. Not bad for a hunting rifle.

Then I got my 17HMR Marlin out after a throrough cleaning and shot a 5 shot group that you can cover with an asprin.. I'm going to measure it here in a little bit. See how small it really is.

Wanting to try the 22-250 again but the wind is starting to pick up

 

[Scott7m]

well i measured the group from the 17HMR marlin, it measure 0.283 ... my best 5 shot group ever.

I did get a chance to shoot the 22-250.. and I am as frustrated as ever, first 2 shots into 1 hole, after that it kinda went wild... group was around 1 1/4 inches.... Time to start eliminating problem sources.. had 2 primers that failed to fire.. i'm thinking my primers have drawn moisture, with that case, will even the ones that do fire change the accuracy of the rifle?

 

[Scott7m]

took my gun to a gunsmith to find out what it's problem was, the savage bvss 22-250 that is.. The last time I shot it the groups opened wayyyyyyyy up... around 1 1/4 inches... I knew something was wrong. I took it to the gunsmith and he immediatley diagnosed it had a huge problem with the bedding and it had the action in a pretty bad bind.. the pillar blocks were not even touching, they were a good 1/8 inche to low and so i got it bedded and had a lil work done to it.