17 hmr- will it outshoot 22lr at 50m?

[marchx]

I am considering jumping into rimfire shooting. Ballistically 17 hmr has significant advantage over 22.lr beyond 100m. Would it hold its own at 50m? I have only access to Hornady V-MAx 17gr in place where I live.

 

[lb-ft]

I think you’ll fun that at close and intermediate ranges, a top tier 22 will outshoot a top tier 17h with great regularity.

Now, I don’t know if that’s due to match ammo availability (22 wins here) or proliferation of match grade rifles (22 wins again) or something inherent in the cartridge design.

 

[NZ_Fclass]

"outshoot"? targets? varmints?
The 17 is a good calbre for pest control - rabbits at 50yds more than a 22LR, but I don't see it as a target rifle, notwithstanding match rules.

 

[jpx2rk]

Depends on the purpose you intend to use the 17hmr.

 

[EOD Rob]

I have several of both. First, you will have to expand on what the term outshoot means to you. Is it power, performance, or accuracy or all three. Power and performance would have to go to the HMR, but accuracy would go to the rifle and ammo used. A Savage in most likely not going to outshoot an Anschutz. Not downing Savage, I own (4) MKII/93s in 22lr, 22Mag, 17Mach II and 17HMR and all are very accurate with the right ammo. However, I dont think I would pick one to shoot 22lr benchrest. Well, maybe for $h1ts and kicks, but likely not.
Anyway, I do feel (when talking about rimfires for sure) you get what you pay for. Just have to ask yourself what it is your looking for.

 

[CharlieNC]

Rifles and ammo are definitely superior for the 22. To me the 17 is much easier to shoot consistently as it is not nearly as sensitive to follow through, recoil control, etc. Nothing has been any more frustrating than a 22! But it is a great trainer. On the other hand shooting steel at 500yd with my 17 is just pure fun.

 

[Bill K]

the 17HMR is a fine shooting caliber. Works great on critters better, in my opinion of small varmints, than the 22lr. But for target shooting and grouping, I think the 22LR will do much better, due to the more abundant target ammo that is there for that use.
Just look at the major target shoots and what is always the top caliber for such.

 

[marchx]

Thank you guys. I meant target shooting. I am looking at cz mtr. I think it's a good price/value ratio.

 

[HillbillyLongRifle]

Ive been to 100 yard Rimfire matches where people put money on the 17 hmrs to win for group. 22 LR off sandbags won every time.

 

[HillbillyLongRifle]

50 yards a 17 HMR will never see the precision of a 22LR!

 

[th82457]

My experience is a bit different than most responders. I agree that a good .22 with match ammo that the rifle likes will be the most consistent & accurate at 50 yards. With that said, when the distance stretches to 100 yards it gets more interesting. I shoot in a 100 yard varmint league each year. No wind flags allowed & no one piece rests allowed. in the past 8 years a .17 HMR has won this league 7 times - including this year. It usually requires not only an accurate .17 HMR rifle, but also carefully sorted .17 HMR ammo. The gent who has won this league the past two years has won with a 917VS Marlin. In 2020 & 2021 he beat out many very accurate .22's including Anschutz, Bergara & a Vudoo that is owned by one of the best shooters in our league. By lack of wind flags & the very small targets we shoot at 100 yards - I think a good HMR with sorted ammo has an advantage any time the wind picks up due to the supersonic round velocity. I will concede that the .17 HMR ammo is the limiting factor versus the .22 lr.

 

[marchx]

In 17hmr I have no access to any other ammo than 17gr v-max. In 22lr I have constant access to lapua.

 

[garandman]

Not sure where it is in development, but.... I'd give the 17 HMR that Vudoo hinted at a real hard look....

 

[B23]

The Vudoo and RimX 17HMR and 17WSM builds certainly won't hurt but there is just no overcoming the mediocre at best 17HMR and 17WSM ammo.

Now, if they ever were to make some match quality ammo like they do the 22LR it would be game over for the 22LR's but since that will likely never happen the 17HMR and 17WSM will never see their full potential and will only ever be great little "hunting" level rimfire cartridges.

 

[th82457]

I agree that the .17's are definitely limited by the ammo quality. Some very capable rifles available in .17 calibers, but unless Eley, Lapua or one of the other european ammo manufacturers start producing quality .17 ammo it will not change. I do not expect either CCI/Hornady or Winchester to improve their quality control anytime soon. They can sell everything they currently produce at inflated pricing - so no incentive for them.

 

[skeeljc]

Thank you guys. I meant target shooting. I am looking at cz mtr. I think it's a good price/value ratio.

The CZ457 MTR is a great rifle. It is probably pot luck as to how well the OEM MTR barrel performs but you can always get an aftermarket barrel. Lilja makes a good one. There are several aftermarket triggers available for it.

 

[searcher]

There are lots of quality .22 rimfire rifles which will shoot 3/4" groups at 50 yards with hollow point hunting ammo, like CCI and others. If you were honestly doing almost all of your shooting at the 50-yard level- I'd get a .22. The ammo is half the price of .17 HMR and not quite as loud. BUT the HMR will extend the effective, accurate range by twice the distance and more. I have shot many, many ground squirrels at 300 with my HMR - but that is a tall order for the .22. The good news is that the Savage inexpensive line of HMR's will often shoot VERY well, indeed. If one has to look to "match" ammo to hit varmints with their chosen hunting rifle - they are using the wrong rifle or caliber in my opinion.

 

[dgeesaman]

I am considering jumping into rimfire shooting. Ballistically 17 hmr has significant advantage over 22.lr beyond 100m. Would it hold its own at 50m? I have only access to Hornady V-MAx 17gr in place where I live.

With the right ammo and barrel, yes it can. But it’s far easier to get a 22LR shooting this well than a 17hmr. Mostly because there is no ammo testing available for 17 and the ammo is generally lower quality. The lots of truly competitive 17hmr are few and far between.

David

 

[rimfireninja]

late to this party, but not the least surprised that so many are married for life to two-two, or that the big money players with decades of heavily vested financial interest in two-two are so obsessed with locking out the hummer.. the 22LR cartridge is the least inherently accurate metallic cartridge still being manufactured, and for all of the hype about SD/ES consistency, the one most consistent thing about two-two ammo is it's inconsistency, and that applies to even the champagne match grade flavors .. unless you pay Eley or Lapua to test your individual rifle and cherry pick ammo one box at a time, not one lot# at a time ... most of the players who have invested thousands of dollars in elite class heavy bench two-two rimfire bench setups are simply afraid that they wll be made to look not all that elite, hence hummer verboten in competition .. I personally own 20 rimfire rifles, 17 of them scoped ... (32X 36X 40X 45X .. Sightron, Athlon, Mueller, etc) .. I have shot many hummers and have NEVER seen one yet that will not throw 3/8" 5-shot groups at 50 yards and sub-moa at 100 yards .. I own CZ, Anshutz, Tikka, Steyer-Zephyr, and Savage hummers .. I own CZ, Anshutz, Tikka, Steyer-Zephyr (wmr), Savage, Browning and Marlin 22s .. I own two each Annies in both two-two and hummer .. 1416AV 22LR and 1517AV hmr .. 1710 22LR and 1761 hmr .. I shoot twice a week at local range, CCI std velocity or v-max for casual practice and Lapua Center-X or A17 poly-V tip when it matters .. in every case of two-two vs hmr with casual day sloppy shooter me on the trigger, hummer shoots tighter than two two, at both 50 yards and 100 yards .. I don't do heavy bench guns .. retired guy, advantage me, I shoot only what I like, when I like .. all mine are sporter/factory class guns , most under 8.5 #, some under 7.5#, none over 10.5# .. if I was passionate about Unlimited class heavy bench/chassis guns, I would just spend $17,000 on a Blieker/March/SEB and call it a day, but it's just not my game .. my "best" two two rimfires are the two Annies (though I do favor the 1710), with CZ 457MTR close behind .. my "best" five hummers are the two Annies, one each Zephyr, Tikka and CZ (all five too close to call) ... for myself, I judge my expectations and results by not less than 10-shot groups but consider realities defined by not less than 30 consecutive shots ... in elite class two two its all about ammo ammo ammo .. with hummers it is not nearly so much ... as for ammo consistency, that is mostly about chrony data, but far too many fail to realize that rimfire chrony SD/ES data should be looked at as a percentage of median muzzle velocity ... 17 hmr ammo is not all it could or should be, but speed is king, less time in transit to target, same inertia, less bullet drop and less wind drift, neither of which have anything at all to do with bullet weight .. the A17 stuff is better than most, and it does not cost quite as much as Tenex/Lapua/RWS champagne, not even in the shameless price gouging era .. so ... make mine a hummer ... YMMV

 

[Brsam]

late to this party, but not the least surprised that so many are married for life to two-two, or that the big money players with decades of heavily vested financial interest in two-two are so obsessed with locking out the hummer.. the 22LR cartridge is the least inherently accurate metallic cartridge still being manufactured, and for all of the hype about SD/ES consistency, the one most consistent thing about two-two ammo is it's inconsistency, and that applies to even the champagne match grade flavors .. unless you pay Eley or Lapua to test your individual rifle and cherry pick ammo one box at a time, not one lot# at a time ... most of the players who have invested thousands of dollars in elite class heavy bench two-two rimfire bench setups are simply afraid that they wll be made to look not all that elite, hence hummer verboten in competition .. I personally own 20 rimfire rifles, 17 of them scoped ... (32X 36X 40X 45X .. Sightron, Athlon, Mueller, etc) .. I have shot many hummers and have NEVER seen one yet that will not throw 3/8" 5-shot groups at 50 yards and sub-moa at 100 yards .. I own CZ, Anshutz, Tikka, Steyer-Zephyr, and Savage hummers .. I own CZ, Anshutz, Tikka, Steyer-Zephyr (wmr), Savage, Browning and Marlin 22s .. I own two each Annies in both two-two and hummer .. 1416AV 22LR and 1517AV hmr .. 1710 22LR and 1761 hmr .. I shoot twice a week at local range, CCI std velocity or v-max for casual practice and Lapua Center-X or A17 poly-V tip when it matters .. in every case of two-two vs hmr with casual day sloppy shooter me on the trigger, hummer shoots tighter than two two, at both 50 yards and 100 yards .. I don't do heavy bench guns .. retired guy, advantage me, I shoot only what I like, when I like .. all mine are sporter/factory class guns , most under 8.5 #, some under 7.5#, none over 10.5# .. if I was passionate about Unlimited class heavy bench/chassis guns, I would just spend $17,000 on a Blieker/March/SEB and call it a day, but it's just not my game .. my "best" two two rimfires are the two Annies (though I do favor the 1710), with CZ 457MTR close behind .. my "best" five hummers are the two Annies, one each Zephyr, Tikka and CZ (all five too close to call) ... for myself, I judge my expectations and results by not less than 10-shot groups but consider realities defined by not less than 30 consecutive shots ... in elite class two two its all about ammo ammo ammo .. with hummers it is not nearly so much ... as for ammo consistency, that is mostly about chrony data, but far too many fail to realize that rimfire chrony SD/ES data should be looked at as a percentage of median muzzle velocity ... 17 hmr ammo is not all it could or should be, but speed is king, less time in transit to target, same inertia, less bullet drop and less wind drift, neither of which have anything at all to do with bullet weight .. the A17 stuff is better than most, and it does not cost quite as much as Tenex/Lapua/RWS champagne, not even in the shameless price gouging era .. so ... make mine a

late to this party, but not the least surprised that so many are married for life to two-two, or that the big money players with decades of heavily vested financial interest in two-two are so obsessed with locking out the hummer.. the 22LR cartridge is the least inherently accurate metallic cartridge still being manufactured, and for all of the hype about SD/ES consistency, the one most consistent thing about two-two ammo is it's inconsistency, and that applies to even the champagne match grade flavors .. unless you pay Eley or Lapua to test your individual rifle and cherry pick ammo one box at a time, not one lot# at a time ... most of the players who have invested thousands of dollars in elite class heavy bench two-two rimfire bench setups are simply afraid that they wll be made to look not all that elite, hence hummer verboten in competition .. I personally own 20 rimfire rifles, 17 of them scoped ... (32X 36X 40X 45X .. Sightron, Athlon, Mueller, etc) .. I have shot many hummers and have NEVER seen one yet that will not throw 3/8" 5-shot groups at 50 yards and sub-moa at 100 yards .. I own CZ, Anshutz, Tikka, Steyer-Zephyr, and Savage hummers .. I own CZ, Anshutz, Tikka, Steyer-Zephyr (wmr), Savage, Browning and Marlin 22s .. I own two each Annies in both two-two and hummer .. 1416AV 22LR and 1517AV hmr .. 1710 22LR and 1761 hmr .. I shoot twice a week at local range, CCI std velocity or v-max for casual practice and Lapua Center-X or A17 poly-V tip when it matters .. in every case of two-two vs hmr with casual day sloppy shooter me on the trigger, hummer shoots tighter than two two, at both 50 yards and 100 yards .. I don't do heavy bench guns .. retired guy, advantage me, I shoot only what I like, when I like .. all mine are sporter/factory class guns , most under 8.5 #, some under 7.5#, none over 10.5# .. if I was passionate about Unlimited class heavy bench/chassis guns, I would just spend $17,000 on a Blieker/March/SEB and call it a day, but it's just not my game .. my "best" two two rimfires are the two Annies (though I do favor the 1710), with CZ 457MTR close behind .. my "best" five hummers are the two Annies, one each Zephyr, Tikka and CZ (all five too close to call) ... for myself, I judge my expectations and results by not less than 10-shot groups but consider realities defined by not less than 30 consecutive shots ... in elite class two two its all about ammo ammo ammo .. with hummers it is not nearly so much ... as for ammo consistency, that is mostly about chrony data, but far too many fail to realize that rimfire chrony SD/ES data should be looked at as a percentage of median muzzle velocity ... 17 hmr ammo is not all it could or should be, but speed is king, less time in transit to target, same inertia, less bullet drop and less wind drift, neither of which have anything at all to do with bullet weight .. the A17 stuff is better than most, and it does not cost quite as much as Tenex/Lapua/RWS champagne, not even in the shameless price gouging era .. so ... make mine a hummer ... YMMV

What is hummer?