Rifle with excess headspace

[old codger]

I received a Type 38 Arisaka (6.5x50SR) carbine rifle which was brought back from Burma by my uncle in WWII. I was able to find a few cases and bullets and made up a minimum load and strapped the gun to an old tire and remotely pulled the trigger. The chamber and bore are both very rough. The fired case had the primer backed out about 0.008 inch. Apparently the firing pin drove the case forward and the the rough chamber held the case and did not let the case stretch back to the face of the bolt so the primer backed out.
A long time ago I worked with a rifle that had excessive head space and was able to load a bullet long enough that the bullet would encounter the rifling and make the case be held firm against the bolt face. When fired the case would fire form to the chamber. Excess headspace accounted for.
This rifle has a very long throat and I do not think I am going to be able to do the same thing. Even with the bullet just barely started in the case I can chamber the round easily. The bullet never contacts the rifling. (Very little rifling left by the way.)
Anybody have a nifty way to let me make sure the case is tight against the bolt face when chambered?

 

[Krogen]

One way is to expand the neck so it won’t fit. A 7mm expander mandrel would probably do it,. Then gradually size down the neck with your sizing die until the case just chambers. You’re creating a false shoulder to hold the case head against the bolt.

 

[old codger]

Thanks, I will try that. I did some looking and this gun has a mismatched bolt. I understand that the arsenal would set the headspace and then mark the bolt with the serial number of the rifle. Somebody switched bolts on this rifle. No big deal to my uncle who just wanted a take home souvenir.

 

[TGP]

One way is to expand the neck so it won’t fit. A 7mm expander mandrel would probably do it,. Then gradually size down the neck with your sizing die until the case just chambers. You’re creating a false shoulder to hold the case head against the bolt.

This is correct. Most people that have reloaded for Contenders will tell you the same about having to set head space

 

[243winxb]

A minimum load may allow the primers to back out the .008"

Pressure is even lower when throat/ leade is burnt out.
Increase the powder charge and/or go to a faster burn rate powder.

 

[snowsnake]

This is correct. Most people that have reloaded for Contenders will tell you the same about having to set head space

Correct, this is how I fireform cases for the 6.5 JDJ in my Contender. Run the brass over a 6.8 SPC/ 270 expander then size back down till action closes with a slight bit of resistance.

 

[SKWERLZ]

Create a false shoulder, very effective.

 

[4xforfun]

One way is to expand the neck so it won’t fit. A 7mm expander mandrel would probably do it,. Then gradually size down the neck with your sizing die until the case just chambers. You’re creating a false shoulder to hold the case head against the bolt.

THIS^^^^ I call it "Dasherizing" brass.

 

[Hipshoot]

A minimum load may allow the primers to back out the .008"

Pressure is even lower when throat/ leade is burnt out.
Increase the powder charge and/or go to a faster burn rate powder.

Plus 1

 

[old codger]

Ok, expanded a few cases to 7mm and resized only enough to be chambered. Loaded the cases with 140 gr bullets and they fired without a hitch. But the barrel is in such bad shape it will not keep shots on a 24" dia. target at 50 yards. Visually viewing from the muzzle the barrel seems to have rifling, but using a borescope you see nothing but a badly rusted bore. I believe if you could remove the rust the bore would be badly oversize with severe pitting. Kind of a shame because the rifle is in good shape externally.
Well, it was fun but I don't think I will put any more time and money in the rifle. It will be a wall hanger.

 

[243winxb]

I would try this bullet from midwayusa. Long bearing surface may help?

 

[old codger]

Yes, I just ordered that bullet. Will give it a try. Right now I have the bore filled with Kroil and will be letting it soak for a couple of days. Will run a brush through it and see if the soaking does any good.
Anybody recommend a solution or method for removing the rust?

 

[DShortt]

Yes, I just ordered that bullet. Will give it a try. Right now I have the bore filled with Kroil and will be letting it soak for a couple of days. Will run a brush through it and see if the soaking does any good.
Anybody recommend a solution or method for removing the rust?

Ordinarily I avoid it like the plague.

But. This barrel ain't much to begin with based on your description.

CLR and a soak will remove the rust in one treatment.

Don't get it on the bluing. It WILL damage bluing.

 

[243winxb]

Wet bore with Hoppe's No. 9 Gun Bore Cleaner, every morning, brush a little, let soak.

About 3 or 4 days.

The last things it needs is harsh chemicals and more wear from over brushing.

 

[DShortt]

Wet bore with Hoppe's No. 9 Gun Bore Cleaner, every morning, brush a little, let soak.

About 3 or 4 days.

The last things it needs is harsh chemicals and more wear from over brushing.

You could take a couple of new bronze bore brushes, a cordless drill and an old cleaning rod to something like the OP described and it ain't gonna hurt it.

It's already 'burnt toast'.

Just scraping off the char. That's all that's left now.

Edit to add - I have done that just to see what would happen on 'tomato stake' barrels. It's not nearly as bad as you'd think. Bronze brush.

Would I do that on a good shooting barrel?

NO!

Would I try that with a stainless steel brush?

NO!

Maybe some day when I'm bored and someone gives me a stainless steel brush I'll try it. But not before then.

 

[AlNyhus]

You can submerge the barrelled action in Evaporust and let it do it's magic. It will remove any bluing still on there because bluing is a form of rust. But you'll be able to see what the barrel looks like under the rust.

Home Depot, Harbor Freight and others carry Evaporust. Biodegradeable and actually works.

 

[DShortt]

You can submerge the barrelled action in Evaporust and let it do it's magic. It will remove any bluing still on there because bluing is a form of rust. But you'll be able to see what the barrel looks like under the rust.

Home Depot, Harbor Freight and others carry Evaporust. Biodegradeable and actually works.

Yep. That's another option.

 

[D Coots]

Does the rifle look like this?

 

[DShortt]

Does the rifle look like this?

View attachment 1745040View attachment 1745041View attachment 1745043

Doesn't much matter what the exterior looks like.

Poke a bore scope in the barrel. That's what matters.

Check it for Cosmoline first. One never knows.

 

[tmwinds]

000 steel wool wrapped around a bronze brush and soak the brush and wool in Kroils. Use an old cleaning rod and a drill and have at it, back and forth. Can’t make it any worse. Same on the chamber and throat.