Bolt Face

[roband]

Dont know where this actually belongs (forum) so here goes.
My son and i are looking (on line) at a used rifle that appears really clean both wood and metal.It does not appear "to be shot much".I requested additional pics it would appear to be the case.However i asked for a pic of the bolt face and it is etched out in a circle where the case sits flush while in battery.My guard hairs went up immediately.
Question #1 is this etching(it is pronounced) a tell tale of use,or hot loads etc?
Question #2 could it be the bolt face is soft for some reason?
Question#3 can this be repaired? or im i going to have the same issues if it is built back up and turned back down?
My gut tells me to pass, thoughts opinions.
Thanks in advance JPS (in the meanwhile im going to try and get ahold of Tannel and pick his brain)

 

[WSnyder]

Question #1 is this etching(it is pronounced) a tell tale of use,or hot loads etc?
Question #2 could it be the bolt face is soft for some reason?
Question#3 can this be repaired? or im i going to have the same issues if it is built back up and turned back down?

1) Yes, pierced primers.
2) No. See above.
3) Yes, it can be repaired but you can ignore it if you wanted. Most of the time it's purely cosmetic. The only reason in my mind to fix it is if you want to reduce the firing pin diameter, "bushing" the bolt face will do that and repair the eroded face at the same time. It won't happen again if you don't load it hot enough to pierce primers.

 

[Webster]

Dont know where this actually belongs (forum) so here goes.
My son and i are looking (on line) at a used rifle that appears really clean both wood and metal.It does not appear "to be shot much".I requested additional pics it would appear to be the case.However i asked for a pic of the bolt face and it is etched out in a circle where the case sits flush while in battery.My guard hairs went up immediately.
Question #1 is this etching(it is pronounced) a tell tale of use,or hot loads etc?
Question #2 could it be the bolt face is soft for some reason?
Question#3 can this be repaired? or im i going to have the same issues if it is built back up and turned back down?
My gut tells me to pass, thoughts opinions.
Thanks in advance JPS (in the meanwhile im going to try and get ahold of Tannel and pick his brain)

Don't buy it. There are other rifles to buy.

 

[Homerange]

Question #1 is this etching(it is pronounced) a tell tale of use,or hot loads etc?
Question #2 could it be the bolt face is soft for some reason?
Question#3 can this be repaired? or im i going to have the same issues if it is built back up and turned back down?

1. Possibly but years ago WLR primers were infamous for blowing out around the edge and etching bolt faces. 2 shooters I know had this happen to them several times will not buy Winchester primers ever again.
Moderately warm loads they were, carefully developed until something changed in WLR primer production.
2. See above, fire and brimstone erosion will even eat hard materials. Probably ceramics resist it best.
3. Yes. Good long serving smiths have all seen this before.

 

[243winxb]

bolt face

Left- Defective 9 1/2 primers on 243 win, Rem 600.

Right Savage Axis 223 with 2700 rounds fired. Normal wear.

Pock marked bolt faces dont seem to hurt anything?

Even my M16.

 

[Doom]

Dont know where this actually belongs (forum) so here goes.
My son and i are looking (on line) at a used rifle that appears really clean both wood and metal.It does not appear "to be shot much".I requested additional pics it would appear to be the case.However i asked for a pic of the bolt face and it is etched out in a circle where the case sits flush while in battery.My guard hairs went up immediately.
Question #1 is this etching(it is pronounced) a tell tale of use,or hot loads etc?
Question #2 could it be the bolt face is soft for some reason?
Question#3 can this be repaired? or im i going to have the same issues if it is built back up and turned back down?
My gut tells me to pass, thoughts opinions.
Thanks in advance JPS (in the meanwhile im going to try and get ahold of Tannel and pick his brain)

You're asking for an opinion on possible damage to a bolt based on a photograph that you don't bother to share which kinda makes all of the above responses a guess at best. Etching of the bolt face in and of itself is not something that can be a cause for concern as it can happen to anyone that shoots, whether reloads or factory ammunition. The degree to which is might affect the safety of the rifle is going to depend on many factors. What I would look for is whether the damage appears to be due to many leaks or limited to a few. It might also depend on the cartridge as the degree of damage relative to expected barrel life can be a concern.

All said, if the damage seemed excessive to me I would steer away from the rifle. Not specifically because of the physical bolt damage but because it might be an indication of a shooter not paying enough attention to maintenance and care of the rifle.

 

[boltfluter]

I would insist on a pic of the back of the bolt lugs. That will probably tell the real story. If they are galled I would pass on the rifle. Primers leak but galling is usually poor maintenance. Good luck and keep us posted.
Paul

 

[drop_point]

Some of the Winchester primers a few years back would do that to a bolt face really quickly, but also it could be indicative of using worn out brass. As Paul above said, ask for a photo of the bolt lugs. Point out the damage, and show the seller what it will cost to repair that damage and assess the value accordingly.

 

[mdram]

Some of the Winchester primers a few years back would do that to a bolt face really quickly, but also it could be indicative of using worn out brass. As Paul above said, ask for a photo of the bolt lugs. Point out the damage, and show the seller what it will cost to repair that damage and assess the value accordingly.

not just a few years back, win41's are currently having issues

 

[K22]

Here's my take on used rifles assuming you want at least some level of precision to meet your needs.

You have no idea how the rifle was cleaned, the ammunition shot, number of rounds fired, and sequences fired, etc. I would only buy a used rifle if I was prepared to replace the barrel and depending on the stock fit, bed the action.

I base this negativity on the abuse and lack of knowledge I see at the ranges. The one exception would be if you know the owner well enough to trust him to give you a true history of the rifle.

For me, it just isn't worth the aggravation and hassle to save a few bucks on a "bargain" used rifle. Of course, you could always get a "lemon" on a new factory rifle but the chances lower and you are covered by a warranty. In all the years I have in the sport and having owned in excess of 30 factory rifles, I only got one "lemon" and Remington replaced the rifle. Of course, I had to bed rifles with cheap injection molded stocks or replace the stocks entirely, but I knew that going in.

 

[madmixerman]

I had a 30br that had a etched bolt from a bad run of WSR primers. I continued to put over 3000 more rounds through gun with no ill effects.

 

[roband]

Thanks for all the replies.I did not post up pics because the gun is not mine and i dont think i would appreciate someone doing that to me, especially this day and age.
I requested more pics of the bolt and, it to my eyes looks to have a crack running across the bolt face above the firing pin.Ive asked them to exame this closely for me?????
Boltfluter ive requested additional pics, including the lugs.
As mentioned adove Thanks JPS

 

[roband]

Anybody on here care to take a stab,at looking at some pics.(privately)To validate what i think???

 

[snert]

Anybody on here care to take a stab,at looking at some pics.(privately)To validate what i think???

yep

 

[gpoldblue]

Dont know where this actually belongs (forum) so here goes.
My son and i are looking (on line) at a used rifle that appears really clean both wood and metal.It does not appear "to be shot much".I requested additional pics it would appear to be the case.However i asked for a pic of the bolt face and it is etched out in a circle where the case sits flush while in battery.My guard hairs went up immediately.
Question #1 is this etching(it is pronounced) a tell tale of use,or hot loads etc?
Question #2 could it be the bolt face is soft for some reason?
Question#3 can this be repaired? or im i going to have the same issues if it is built back up and turned back down?
My gut tells me to pass, thoughts opinions.
Thanks in advance JPS (in the meanwhile im going to try and get ahold of Tannel and pick his brain)

Refacing the bolt face will change the headspace....how much depends on how much is ground off.

 

[roband]

Snert just you a pm.

 

[WSnyder]

Refacing the bolt face will change the headspace....how much depends on how much is ground off.

You can repair it by inserting a bushing that will not change headspace or at least not enough to measure or matter.

 

[jpjulian]

Left- Defective 9 1/2 primers on 243 win, Rem 600.

Right Savage Axis 223 with 2700 rounds fired. Normal wear.

Pock marked bolt faces dont seem to hurt anything?

Even my M16.

I can relate to that bolt face..... from one of 3 rifles that had Winchester primers pierce in them....

 

[6BRA]

Savage 12. Just bushed, filled and surfaced.

 

[WyleWD]

Savage 12. Just bushed, filled and surfaced.

Who did the work on these?? Thanks in advance.