Shoulders Problem

[dellet]

The question keeps coming up about why a fired case ejects fine, but won’t feed. This is using @slydo own words answering questions. Maybe it’s terminology that is in the way, maybe experience, but it took a few times asking to get clear answers on other questions.

It’s absolutely possible for fired cases to eject easily, and then not “feed”. Think of the words used vs what should have been used.

It doesn’t matter how easily the fired round round ejects, that’s the bolt moving backwards. What matters is how hard the bolt lifts or rotates. That’s the sign of over pressure, if the case is hard to extract, eject after rotating the bolt, that’s a much higher pressure problem.

So the real question for Slydo would be to clarify if the bolt was hard to lift. Maybe help him out with terminology at the same time.

Same with feeding, instead of chambering. We know it won’t likely feed without a bullet in the neck, and we assume it’s just terms again. But….

Good to know at least one problem was identified and it seems to have multiple solutions.

 

[TTE]

It's touching the shell holder + 1/4 turn
Told you first ... Read, view, and try everything ... I'm not a machinist but a damn good mechanic
Just don't understand WHY shoulders are so forward 0.010" after shooting

Check to make sure you are using the correct insert in your compatitor .... not "this is the one I always use ....... check it with Hornady's chart

 

[slydo]

The question keeps coming up about why a fired case ejects fine, but won’t feed. This is using @slydo own words answering questions. Maybe it’s terminology that is in the way, maybe experience, but it took a few times asking to get clear answers on other questions.

It’s absolutely possible for fired cases to eject easily, and then not “feed”. Think of the words used vs what should have been used.

It doesn’t matter how easily the fired round round ejects, that’s the bolt moving backwards. What matters is how hard the bolt lifts or rotates. That’s the sign of over pressure, if the case is hard to extract, eject after rotating the bolt, that’s a much higher pressure problem.

So the real question for Slydo would be to clarify if the bolt was hard to lift. Maybe help him out with terminology at the same time.

Same with feeding, instead of chambering. We know it won’t likely feed without a bullet in the neck, and we assume it’s just terms again. But….

Good to know at least one problem was identified and it seems to have multiple solutions.

Hi Dellet... Thanks for your input... First it a BLR lever action... So it's quite noticeable if it's to hard to cycle in or out... Found my problem... Shell holder too thin... Had 2 others #5 for my 7mm Mag and the one if my friend 270 WSM... .112" (one I was using) .117" and .132" So I used the thick one and it went well... Back off my die until I got a firm contact then screwed it back in to have a .002" free play... All the shell gets nicely formed ... Will post something else... Your input will be really appreciated
Thanks a lot man
From Québec with love

 

[slydo]

^^^^^^^ That is one of your problems. Having brass that ejects but won't rechamber, I have yet to understand. If they were fired in another gun and won't rechamber in yours I could get. Could your next door neighbor sneak into the house and use your reloading gear while you are at work? I hope you learn the problem and let us know the answer.

Same rifle that fired the shell... After checking 50 fired shells only 8 was going back in the chamber

 

[Sniperhandle]

Because the fired brass won't go back in the chamber, It's possible the chamber is off center or out of round, Try chambering the brass, Turning it an 1/8 of a turn at a time until it chambers.

My guess is, That is your problem. An out of round chamber will cause this problem, And when the brass comes out, It is also slightly out of round enough to not chamber.

 

[slydo]

Finding a random piece of fired brass on the ground that goes in your chamber OK does not mean your problem is the nickle plated cases. It simply means it was fired in a rifle with a smaller chamber than your gun. I commented on your pic of the case in the die about the gap that existed between the shellholder top and the bottom of the die. THAT is your problem. Have you done any thing about that?

Frank

Yep... I fix it with a thicker shell holder

 

[slydo]

^^^^^^^ That is one of your problems. Having brass that ejects but won't rechamber, I have yet to understand. If they were fired in another gun and won't rechamber in yours I could get. Could your next door neighbor sneak into the house and use your reloading gear while you are at work? I hope you learn the problem and let us know the answer.

Thin shell holder... Was using 0.112" from my lee kit... Checked the one from my friend 270 wsm 0.122" and the one from my 7 mag 0.132" works perfectly... All #5 shell holder

 

[fkimble@charter.net]

Where these shellholders all the same brand? Different brands use different numbers for the same caliber.

Frank

 

[Marklincoln]

I did insert filler gauge up too 0.015" between the shell holder and the cartridge to mimic grinding off the die ... Only the mouth gets smaller

 

[fkimble@charter.net]

Yep... I fix it with a thicker shell holder

Thicker shellholder would make problem worst not better.

Frank

 

[Heavy Metal 1]

When you were measuring your fired cases before sizing them, did you have the fired primer removed? The fired primer left in place will alter the measurements and not give you a true length measurement of your piece of fired brass.
That alone isn't your issue, but could be a partial factor in analysis of the problem you have been facing.

 

[L.Sherm]

Yep... I fix it with a thicker shell holder

Thicker shellholder would make problem worst not better.

Frank

My guess is the O.P is talking the part the case sits on which would push the case up higher into the die not the top of the shellholder the die contacts.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

For lever and semi-auto reloading I use a cartridge checker. Safest, most convenient way to check brass sizing and cartridge final fitment. Shoulders often need slightly more clearance in these type firearms, especially in COLD temps. You don't want to stick a case trying to chamber in either firearm, the actions aren't as robust as most bolt guns.

 

[slydo]

Yep... I fix it with a thicker shell holder

Thicker shellholder would make problem worst not better.

Frank

Thickness between the ram and where the shell sit Not the overall thickness

 

[slydo]

My guess is the O.P is talking the part the case sits on which would push the case up higher into the die not the top of the shellholder the die contacts.

Exactly

 

[slydo]

When you were measuring your fired cases before sizing them, did you have the fired primer removed? The fired primer left in place will alter the measurements and not give you a true length measurement of your piece of fired brass.
That alone isn't your issue, but could be a partial factor in analysis of the problem you have been facing.

Yes I did ... primer was removed

 

[slydo]

Where these shellholders all the same brand? Different brands use different numbers for the same caliber.

Frank

All from LEE kit

 

[358WCF]

Correlation is not necessarily causation, but... Why is it people having chambering/headspace problems are so often using LEE products?

Flame suit on.

 

[jwv2001]

I've read and re-read all of these posts and I don't understand the problem. In my opinion, all that really matters is shots on target. If the fired brass chambers in your rifle, size it to accept a bullet, put a primer in, fill it with powder, and shoot it. Throw away all of your measuring stuff concentrate on being a better shot, not on measuring case shoulders. Don't get distracted by the minutia.

The brass isn't holding you back.

 

[L.Sherm]

Yep just fill the case with powder dont bother with a measuring device.
Just seat a bullet to were ever no need for measuring devices, great advice, wow!!