Long Range Hunting

[K22]

There's an informative article in the October 2024 American Hunter magazine written by a respected hunter, Bryce M. Towsley. While the article does not contain any new revelations for old hunting sages, it might be worthwhile for new hunters caught up in the mystic of "long range" hunter because they can hit a gong at 600 yards.

Basically, besides having the skills to place a shot in the vitals at the distance you intend to shoot at an animal, Bryce makes two key point: terminal energy and bullet penetration. In the former, he cites the old rule of thumb of 1,000 ft. lbs. on impact for deer size game and 1,500 for elk size game. In the latter point, he discusses the need for the bullet to penetrate through the vitals creating the largest possible wound channel.

Bottom line is that he brings to the forefront the difference between target shooting and hunting where the former only requires hitting the target in the desire area whereas the latter adds the additional need for terminal performance.

 

[Konocti's Wigwam]

There's an informative article in the October 2024 American Hunter magazine written by a respected hunter, Bryce M. Towsley. While the article does not contain any new revelations for old hunting sages, it might be worthwhile for new hunters caught up in the mystic of "long range" hunter because they can hit a gong at 600 yards.

Basically, besides having the skills to place a shot in the vitals at the distance you intend to shoot at an animal, Bryce makes two key point: terminal energy and bullet penetration. In the former, he cites the old rule of thumb of 1,000 ft. lbs. on impact for deer size game and 1,500 for elk size game. In the latter point, he discusses the need for the bullet to penetrate through the vitals creating the largest possible wound channel.

Bottom line is that he brings to the forefront the difference between target shooting and hunting where the former only requires hitting the target in the desire area whereas the latter adds the additional need for terminal performance.

I respect his thoughts, but here's the thing. A 308 Win will be at 1500 at somewhere around 300 yards.

This chart shows about 250 yards with a 150 grain bullet. Probably could get a bit more distance with a 168 grain bullet. The 6.5 Grendel is not too much different, and I've seen some charts that show the 6.5 Grendel still about 1300 ft.lbs. of energy at 250 yards. Of course, shot placement is everything.

308 Ballistics Charts For Major Ammo Manufacturers

Find 308 ballistics charts that include velocity, energy, and bullet drop for major ammo manufactures like Federal, Winchester, and Remington.

ammo.com

Many people these days are taking game at 500+ yards, and why we see these 500 yard challenges with a cold bore shot. Some hit it, many don't. I have long said that I support anyone deciding to take any shot at any distance, but just be prepared to track that animal down if you hit it but don't kill it, otherwise it's unethical hunting, IMO.

 

[1lessdog]

I'm amazed at the amount of people that shoot out to 1000 yds and never miss. I have had countless shooters tell me I shot my deer at 700 yds 1 shot and down it goes. No one ever misses, I just think there full of B.S.

I shoot a lot and have been working up a load for a 6.5 x 284 with Berger 156 gr Elite hunters. Maybe it's just me. I never reach out past 400 for Deer or bigger animals.

 

[K22]

I respect his thoughts, but here's the thing. A 308 Win will be at 1500 at somewhere around 300 yards.

This chart shows about 250 yards with a 150 grain bullet. Probably could get a bit more distance with a 168 grain bullet. The 6.5 Grendel is not too much different, and I've seen some charts that show the 6.5 Grendel still about 1300 ft.lbs. of energy at 250 yards. Of course, shot placement is everything.

308 Ballistics Charts For Major Ammo Manufacturers

Find 308 ballistics charts that include velocity, energy, and bullet drop for major ammo manufactures like Federal, Winchester, and Remington.

ammo.com

Many people these days are taking game at 500+ yards, and why we see these 500 yard challenges with a cold bore shot. Some hit it, many don't. I have long said that I support anyone deciding to take any shot at any distance, but just be prepared to track that animal down if you hit it but don't kill it, otherwise it's unethical hunting, IMO.

I have no personal experience taking big game at long distances. I've hunted deer and bear (PA Black) for 50+ years and the furthest I've taken a deer is 185 yards. Most were well under that. Also, I've taken a lot of them with the 243 Win.

I probably didn't do his article justice since there was a lot more in there. I suspect what precipitated the article was his frustration with a hunting partner that had wounded a South Texas Nilgai with a 308 at "long range" and Bryce spent hours tracking the animal while the shooter slept in the truck. When Bryce returned unable to find the wounded animal, the shooter replied glibly, "It's ok, my goal was to hit one at long range and I did that, so I am happy."

If I was Bryce, I might have punched the guy in the nose. Well, probably not, at my advanced age one needs to know his limitations. Instead, Bryce went off on what he calls "keyboard" shooters, i.e., paper ballistics versus real world field experience.

 

[Konocti's Wigwam]

I have no personal experience taking big game at long distances. I've hunted deer and bear (PA Black) for 50+ years and the furthest I've taken a deer is 185 yards. Most were well under that. Also, I've taken a lot of them with the 243 Win.

I probably didn't do his article justice since there was a lot more in there. I suspect what precipitated the article was his frustration with a hunting partner that had wounded a South Texas Nilgai with a 308 at "long range" and Bryce spent hours tracking the animal while the shooter slept in the truck. When Bryce returned unable to find the wounded animal, the shooter replied glibly, "It's ok, my goal was to hit one at long range and I did that, so I am happy."

If I was Bryce, I might have punched the guy in the nose. Well, probably not, at my advanced age one needs to know his limitations. Instead, Bryce went off on what he calls "keyboard" shooters, i.e., paper ballistics versus real world field experience.

I agree, the guy deserved a punch in the nose if that was the case. When your hunting partner goes out tracking a wounded animal for several house while the dufus who wounded it is sleeping, yeah, he deserves a punch in the nose without being woken up.

I don't know how the guy could be happy with those ethics? But we are all different, and I don't know the situation, word of mouth tells me he deserved a punch in the nose.

On a side note, Bryce would be a good guy to go hunting with!

 

[ohlongarmisle]

I'm amazed at the amount of people that shoot out to 1000 yds and never miss. I have had countless shooters tell me I shot my deer at 700 yds 1 shot and down it goes. No one ever misses, I just think there full of B.S.

I shoot a lot and have been working up a load for a 6.5 x 284 with Berger 156 gr Elite hunters. Maybe it's just me. I never reach out past 400 for Deer or bigger animals.

They are for the most part,forums while they can be informative draws bs'ers like flies to a dead rat.i['ve shot deer,bear,black and brown,elk,pronghorn coyotes groundhogs etc,and anything over and up to 400 yards is a poke and those shots take exceptional marksmanship to accomplish. And, I'm swat trained,and on the deer culling citywide program where only the top get the position. So I know and can smell bs when I see it i'm with you shots over 400 are tough and should be avoided unless you're an absolute pro.

 

[L.Sherm]

These threads just turn into dumpster fires.

 

[Adam in WI]

I agree, the guy deserved a punch in the nose if that was the case.

Loctite an empty case into his rifle...

 

[Bill K]

It is the type of people, like mentioned, as a hunter ?? in #4 post, that give ethical hunters a bad name.
They should not be out hunting with a attitude like he has, in not attempting to locate a wounded animal and to sit back and sleep while someone else tries, is assinine on his part.
I also believe a lot of these new long range shooters should not be shooting over 400 yrds and some of them not over 300. I would almost bet that 90 % that claim kills, not just hits, over 400 and out to 1200 yrds are full of it.

 

[Wolfdog91]

Like how when I go to the long range hunting forums alot of these point people constantly bring up like it's some big revelation those guys are just like
" well.... Duh"

But then again actual long range hunters and people just flinging bullets at game at distance are two completely different things.

 

[Wolfdog91]

These threads just turn into dumpster fires.

Yeeeep .....

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

I have a cow/calf elk lic this fall. I worked up a load with a 165 gr Barnes bullet out of my 30tc. Energy/velocity wise 500 yard max, I already put a 400 yard max on my shot because I haven't used the bullet on game. Targets(4.5 inch diameter) at 300 yards have easy first shot hits, dialing for wind and drop. Since my longest elk has been 187 yards, I should be fine.

 

[Ranger188]

I had a guy last year at the range with a new to him, 28 Nosler, never shot it before. (1st problem)
And he was leaving soon.
He was shooting it in a lead sled, cause he heard the recoil was bad. (2nd problem)
He said the shots, he was told could be out to 400 yds. (3rd problem)
This guy didn't know drop or knew much about a ballistic calculator. (4th problem)
Thought he could just hold a little above it for longer shots. (do you see a pattern)
Scary.

 

[Kracken McGraw]

I had a guy last year at the range with a new to him, 28 Nosler, never shot it before. (1st problem)
And he was leaving soon.
He was shooting it in a lead sled, cause he heard the recoil was bad. (2nd problem)
He said the shots, he was told could be out to 400 yds. (3rd problem)
This guy didn't know drop or knew much about a ballistic calculator. (4th problem)
Thought he could just hold a little above it for longer shots. (do you see a pattern)
Scary.

In reality that may be 75% of them out there on opening day.

 

[Jr solocam]

What I think is funny is that people shooting steel off of a bench rest in nice weather equate that to long range hunting. Try it when you are gassed walking hills all day, 20 mph winds, and freezing cold. Can some people do it? Yes. Most cannot.

You never hear about the gut or leg shots. Always DRT. My personal best is 605 yards. That's far enough for me in the field....and only if conditions allow for it.

 

[L.Sherm]

You never hear about the gut or leg shots.

Whats even funnier is ive seen and heard of this happening at 100 yards, alot of people think it only happens at LR.

 

[Wolfdog91]

What I think is funny is that people shooting steel off of a bench rest in nice weather equate that to long range hunting. Try it when you are gassed walking hills all day, 20 mph winds, and freezing cold. Can some people do it? Yes. Most cannot.

You never hear about the gut or leg shots. Always DRT. My personal best is 605 yards. That's far enough for me in the field....and only if conditions allow for it.

I mean in all fairness have you seen what happens when you post mistakes online or just in general? Honestly it's a damned if you do damned if you don't situation imo.

 

[Jr solocam]

Yes it can get pretty brutal. Of course from people who never had made a mistake......

 

[ohlongarmisle]

What I think is funny is that people shooting steel off of a bench rest in nice weather equate that to long range hunting. Try it when you are gassed walking hills all day, 20 mph winds, and freezing cold. Can some people do it? Yes. Most cannot.

You never hear about the gut or leg shots. Always DRT. My personal best is 605 yards. That's far enough for me in the field....and only if conditions allow for it.

I wholeheartedly agree with you,but don't disagree on the forum Long Range Hunting, you'll catch a ban, the site is amateur hour for the most part. 605 yards is a great shot most couldn't do it,that distance is a poke doesn't matter what caliber is used.I caught my ban and wear it as a badge of honor, it tells me what I already knew ,I caught some at their BS, and they just couldn't handle it.I dared to disagree when they posted about a kid who shot a pronghorn at 1507 yards with a 6.5 cm,ain't happening ,I took 2 prongs in 4 years and my furthest was north of 400 yards a long shot.Good shooting at 605 no need to prove anything more.

 

[Idaho-Lefty]

@ olongarmisle,..
The Ethic's and Morals for, "Shooting at, stuff" at, L Range Hunting, are getting,.. "Out of, Control"
Shooting at, a LIVE Animal at,. 1507 Yards, IS, Crazy and STUPID !
Yeah, You CAN'T,.. "Rock the Boat" there, OR they'll Throw Your aszz,.. OUT !
It's, a Mean crowd, sometimes ! ( Gotta take them with, a Grain of, Salt And,.. keep,. QUIET ).
Or they, will make you,.. LEAVE