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FTR Starting point questions

This right here is great advice. I try to tell all shooters that they should shoot the 155.5's to start in order to learn the wind. The 155.5's are a great forgiving bullet that are really easy to tune, and you can see the POI changes in subtle changes of wind to help you understand what the wind does at different velocities and angles.

The heavier bullets are really picky on position and gun handling. Trying to shoot them, learn the wind, and learn gun handling for FTR at the same time will cause a lot of unneeded frustrations.

I've said it before, I'll say again: a drunken monkey could fall off a stump and hit a decent 155 load on the way down.

Conversely, going from 155s to 185s or 200s is a rude introduction to the finer points of gun handling and precision reloading. 155s will forgive a multitude of sins; the others not so much.
 
I have used both .223 Rem and .308 Win rifles in F-TR for well over a decade. They both have their place in the sport, and I would generally advocate that deciding between the two is up to the individual, and should be strongly influenced by the user's relative amount of participation in mid-range versus long-range F-Class matches. I personally would never advise someone to use a .308 Win with 155s in F-TR matches. That's a good recipe for learning how to lose against shooter using more realistic bullet choices, and it's simply not going to prepare someone for the gun handling skills they will eventually need with heavier bullets and stouter loads. Nor will the wind-reading hold-offs they start commiting to memory be correct. So going that route will eventually mean re-learning quite a bit. If you're going to use a .308, my advice would be to use it exactly the way you plan to use it in matches, meaning the exact same loads with which you plan to compete. Anything else is a waste, IMO. FWIW - if you're not going to start out or practice with the same load you ultimately intend to use in matches, what's the point? Over the long haul, that approach may seem to be a good idea, but in reality it can be a huge cost in both money and time. In that event, a .223 Rem with 90 VLDs will not just outperform 155s by a little bit, the difference in windage would be substantial, on the order of ~0.2 MOA at 600 yd and ~0.5 MOA at 1000 yd.
 
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What ever route you go with everyone replied here are top shooters and lots of experience.
I took a Remington 700 put a HV Bartlein 1:7 on it , HS Precision stock, Jewell trigger , Nightforce Comp, Dublin Bi pod , ran 90’s.
Made HM in Mid Range. I learned a lot first 2-3 years. Traveling and meeting other shooters in TR. I now have both 308 and 223. I still prefer 223 at Mid Range. Put together a rifle go shoot and have fun. If you get hooked upgrades and changes will follow. Best luck and maybe see ya at a match in MO someday
 
This right here is great advice. I try to tell all shooters that they should shoot the 155.5's to start in order to learn the wind. The 155.5's are a great forgiving bullet that are really easy to tune, and you can see the POI changes in subtle changes of wind to help you understand what the wind does at different velocities and angles.

The heavier bullets are really picky on position and gun handling. Trying to shoot them, learn the wind, and learn gun handling for FTR at the same time will cause a lot of unneeded frustrations.

yes and when you hold the rifle don’t hold it tooooo tight to the shoulder

anytime you hold a rifle for FTR you MUST hold it the same each time

Sooooo if it 22 ounces of PULL INTO THE SHOULDER IT HAS TOOOOOOOO BE 22 OUNCES EACH AND EVERY TIME

OTHERWISE. U can get 2 or 3 distinct groups at 800 and beyound
 
I will tell you that the 223 with 90's has the advantage over a 308 and 155 gr bullets. And that is all the way to 1K.

If the majority of your matches are at MR, then the 223 is going to be to your advantage. That 90 gr bullet will still perform well at 1K. It is basically shoulder to shoulder with a 185 out of a 308 and it will beat you up a whole lot less.

Add to that, 1/2 the powder costs of a 308 to boot.

Well, you pays your money and makes your choice.
 
I have used both .223 Rem and .308 Win rifles in F-TR for well over a decade. They both have their place in the sport, and I would generally advocate that deciding between the two is up to the individual, and should be strongly influenced by the user's relative amount of participation in mid-range versus long-range F-Class matches. I personally would never advise someone to use a .308 Win with 155s in F-TR matches. That's a good recipe for learning how to lose against shooter using more realistic bullet choices, and it's simply not going to prepare someone for the gun handling skills they will eventually need with heavier bullets and stouter loads. Nor will the wind-reading hold-offs they start commiting to memory be correct. So going that route will eventually mean re-learning quite a bit. If you're going to use a .308, my advice would be to use it exactly the way you plan to use it in matches, meaning the exact same loads with which you plan to compete. Anything else is a waste, IMO. FWIW - if you're not going to start out or practice with the same load you ultimately intend to use in matches, what's the point? Over the long haul, that approach may seem to be a good idea, but in reality it can be a huge cost in both money and time. In that event, a .223 Rem with 90 VLDs will not just outperform 155s by a little bit, the difference in windage would be substantial, on the order of ~0.2 MOA at 600 yd and ~0.5 MOA at 1000 yd.
What bullet were you shooting when you qualified Long Range High Master?
 
I have both 223 & 308. Learned on the 223 at 600. Shooting 80gr Bergers, I made HM. But on a windy day, even at 600, the 308 guys would beat me.
I got a Savage FTR in 308. After replacing the stupid 1/12 twist barrel with a 1/10, replacing the stock with a McMillan, I have a winning rifle in 308.
Haven't gone to 1000 yet, but I know I can. I use 185gr Lapua Scenar.
For all the $$$ I have in it, I should have just bought an action and built from there.
 
I have both 223 & 308. Learned on the 223 at 600. Shooting 80gr Bergers, I made HM. But on a windy day, even at 600, the 308 guys would beat me.
I got a Savage FTR in 308. After replacing the stupid 1/12 twist barrel with a 1/10, replacing the stock with a McMillan, I have a winning rifle in 308.
Haven't gone to 1000 yet, but I know I can. I use 185gr Lapua Scenar.
For all the $$$ I have in it, I should have just bought an action and built from there.
interested in load data for the 185 lapua scenar
 
You’re stepping on the gas pedal with the 200 20x
Go fast or go home!........:p:D

There was a time that was my motto, now not so much. Find a speed that's competitive that doesn't kill your brass (and shoulder) with good/great accuracy and go have fun. As for the .223 vs .308 they both have their place as many have said in this thread. If you are mainly sticking to midrange shooting the .223 is perfectly fine and a lot of fun. If you think long range is the ultimate goal/plan the .308 is the cats meow. Its extremely hard to be competitive with .223 at long range in today's FTR game.
 
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