308 resizing measurements

[260AckImp]

Hello All

Im gearing up for a 308 FTR build and I have been given some old brass from a fellow shooter to check my FLS die with.
From what ive been told he has a 95 Palma reamer and the fired brass measurements in my picture are from him.

Any suggestions/advice on the below pictures measurements? Enough sizing or not enough? Didnt write neck measurements as its a bushing die with no bushing installed currently.

Im also in the process of ordering a 2013 FTR Team Reamer from Manson.

Cheers

 

[Fire Dog]

Hello All

Im gearing up for a 308 FTR build and I have been given some old brass from a fellow shooter to check my FLS die with.
From what ive been told he has a 95 Palma reamer and the fired brass measurements in my picture are from him.

Any suggestions/advice on the below pictures measurements? Enough sizing or not enough? Didnt write neck measurements as its a bushing die with no bushing installed currently.

Im also in the process of ordering a 2013 FTR Team Reamer from Manson.

Cheers
View attachment 1500822

Check out this link>

Minimum Saami for .308 win

Do anyone have a number of Minimum Saami for .308 win? I'm looking about different in case base diameter of each .308 reamer. Seem like they are little vary on base diamerter .4722 , .4703 , .4700 So, just want to know the minimum saami of them.

forum.accurateshooter.com

 

[memilanuk]

Looks like you've got plenty of sizing going on, both at the base and at the shoulder. I've got one .308 Win die (Redding Type 'S' F/L bushing die, small base) that squeezes the shoulder down to 0.450" or so, and a couple other (Micron, Forster) that size the shoulder to 0.453". Both the Micron and the Redding small base die size the case head to 0.4695 or thereabouts, so you must be using a *really* tight base die or a ring die to get 0.4685". Not a bad thing, necessarily, when 'recycling' brass from one barrel chambered by one gunsmith to another. AFAIK the 2013 US FTR team reamer is basically the same as the '95 Palma but with a longer freebore, so most of the body dimensions should be the same, give or take some tolerances depending on who does the chambering. A little extra squeeze on the base to eliminate clickers in the new barrel isn't terrible, though after the first firing or two probably not necessary - unless you're running some pretty warm loads.

The only thing that looks kind of wonky is the distance to the shoulder datum. Technically it's from the case head to the 0.400" diameter at the midpoint of the shoulder, so it should be more like 1.630" (for a GO gauge). When I measure with a Stoney Point / Hornady COAL comparator, I get something like 1.625 (fired), but there's a bit of a radius on the entry to the hole which causes that. Not sure how you're 0.250" off? As long as it's consistent, I guess it doesn't really matter, but it does seem odd.

 

[260AckImp]

Looks like you've got plenty of sizing going on, both at the base and at the shoulder. I've got one .308 Win die (Redding Type 'S' F/L bushing die, small base) that squeezes the shoulder down to 0.450" or so, and a couple other (Micron, Forster) that size the shoulder to 0.453". Both the Micron and the Redding small base die size the case head to 0.4695 or thereabouts, so you must be using a *really* tight base die or a ring die to get 0.4685". Not a bad thing, necessarily, when 'recycling' brass from one barrel chambered by one gunsmith to another. AFAIK the 2013 US FTR team reamer is basically the same as the '95 Palma but with a longer freebore, so most of the body dimensions should be the same, give or take some tolerances depending on who does the chambering. A little extra squeeze on the base to eliminate clickers in the new barrel isn't terrible, though after the first firing or two probably not necessary - unless you're running some pretty warm loads.

The only thing that looks kind of wonky is the distance to the shoulder datum. Technically it's from the case head to the 0.400" diameter at the midpoint of the shoulder, so it should be more like 1.630" (for a GO gauge). When I measure with a Stoney Point / Hornady COAL comparator, I get something like 1.625 (fired), but there's a bit of a radius on the entry to the hole which causes that. Not sure how you're 0.250" off? As long as it's consistent, I guess it doesn't really matter, but it does seem odd.

Thanks for the information.

I have a Short Action Custom headspace comparator in 308 Win and I just looked up that they dont measure the shoulder at .400 like the datum gauges do. Might find myself a .400 datum insert aswell to compare. Sorry I tried to simulate where the shoulder comparator would sit when measuring. (I shouldn't quit my day job and take up drawing haha)

I should of stated this is a Redding Type S small base FLS die also.

Im happy to hear about sizing at the 200, as you stated that will help with clickers. Just abit concerned with the amount of sizing on the shoulder diameter, im hoping 0.0035" of shoulder squeeze wont affect accuracy or case life.

 

[memilanuk]

Ah. I see they measure off the shoulder angle, rather than a datum line. Interesting. I have a set of similar comparators that Sinclair Int'l used to sell.

 

[JFrank]

I use a Wilson FL bushing die for a 308 W , these size very smoothly and cycle without clickers.

 

[Codyway]

I recently acquired a 2013 ftr reamer print from Manson and noticed a few pretty big differences compared to the pt&g version.
Manson says these differences are due to their reamer being set up for the use of 7mm-08 brass.
I haven't really taken the time to sort it all out yet, but here's the obvious differences

Manson is 0.010 longer at the shoulder/neck junction
Manson allows for a 0.020 longer case neck, and the push all the freebore/throat dimensions forward of that, so the 0.170 fb is actually 0.190

Didn't want to hijack, but there seems to be some variances that you may want to address

 

[260AckImp]

I use a Wilson FL bushing die for a 308 W , these size very smoothly and cycle without clickers.

Thank you for the measurements, how many firings have you had on that brass? Im suprised how much sizing your getting at the 200 compared to the shoulder diameter

 

[260AckImp]

I recently acquired a 2013 ftr reamer print from Manson and noticed a few pretty big differences compared to the pt&g version.
Manson says these differences are due to their reamer being set up for the use of 7mm-08 brass.
I haven't really taken the time to sort it all out yet, but here's the obvious differences

Manson is 0.010 longer at the shoulder/neck junction
Manson allows for a 0.020 longer case neck, and the push all the freebore/throat dimensions forward of that, so the 0.170 fb is actually 0.190

Didn't want to hijack, but there seems to be some variances that you may want to address

Thank you for the heads up, Im aware of the longer case lengths. Im looking to have Manson reduce the freebore on the reamer and then have my smith throat my chamber to what I want.

 

[JFrank]

Thank you for the measurements, how many firings have you had on that brass? Im suprised how much sizing your getting at the 200 compared to the shoulder diameter

It feels normal to me, while the Redding seems aggressive at the CSJ. Brass ? Geez I’d have to check but it’s at least a dozen times.

 

[260AckImp]

It feels normal to me, while the Redding seems aggressive at the CSJ. Brass ? Geez I’d have to check but it’s at least a dozen times.

Yeah thats my main concern now is that its sizing abit much at the CSJ.
I could potentially get the die honed out, I would like something around the 0.453" after sizing.

 

[Dolomite]

Try a Whidden off the shelf die. It should size the CSJ down to roughly .453 and the base down to roughly .469. Very minimal sizing which doesn’t abuse the brass or a custom die will get you roughly .454 at the CSJ and .4685 - .4695 at the base. Avoid the small base die unless it matches your chamber. It over sizes the case almost back to virgin Lapua size which is over working the brass and the OAL grows way too much.

I ran into the issues with clickers and die not matching the chamber in a Bisley match chamber. I tried RCBS, Redding and RCBS small base die but ended up going with a Whidden custom die to match the fired brass which sizes the brass to a very minimum.

If you do get clickers and your die doesn't get the base down you can get a ring die .4675 or .4685 that works as well. Seems like the trend is the SAC or Cortina sizing dies as it sizes more at the base and less at the CSJ.

Do you have the reamer print to post from Manson?

 

[JFrank]

Yeah thats my main concern now is that its sizing abit much at the CSJ.
I could potentially get the die honed out, I would like something around the 0.453" after sizing.

Mines just an off the shelf Wilson, but it matches the chamber pretty well and that’s all I care about.

 

[260AckImp]

Try a whidden off the shelf die. It should size the CSJ down to .453 and the base down to .469. Very minimal sizing which doesn’t abuse the brass or a custom die will get you about .454 at the CSJ and .469 - .4695 at the base. Avoid the small base die unless it matches your chamber. It over sizes the case almost back to virgin lapua size which is over working the brass and the OAL grows way too much.

I ran into the issues with clickers and die not matching the chamber in a Bisley match chamber. I tried RCBS, Redding and RCBS small base die but ended up going with a Whidden custom die to match the fired brass which sizes the brass to a very minimum.

If you do get clickers and your die doesn't get the base down you can get a ring die .4675 or .4685 that works as well. Seems like the trend is the SAC or Cortina sizing dies as it sizes more at the base and less at the CSJ.

Do you have the reamer print to post from Manson?

Thank you for your reply and information. Ill look into the Whiddens, I do have a custom 260AI die from them and its worked great. Does anyone here have any resized measurements from a standard 308 Redding Type S? With Lapua brass preferably

 

[memilanuk]

Does anyone here have any resized measurements from a standard 308 Redding Type S? With Lapua brass preferably

I think I have one floating around here somewhere. I was planning on sizing my test cases with it next go-around, so maybe tomorrow or the day after. Currently working with Alpha OCD SRP brass, but I have a metric butt ton of Lapua around here; pretty sure I can grab one or two and size them and fire them along with.

 

[Codyway]

Try a Whidden off the shelf die. It should size the CSJ down to roughly .453 and the base down to roughly .469. Very minimal sizing which doesn’t abuse the brass or a custom die will get you roughly .454 at the CSJ and .4685 - .4695 at the base. Avoid the small base die unless it matches your chamber. It over sizes the case almost back to virgin Lapua size which is over working the brass and the OAL grows way too much.

I ran into the issues with clickers and die not matching the chamber in a Bisley match chamber. I tried RCBS, Redding and RCBS small base die but ended up going with a Whidden custom die to match the fired brass which sizes the brass to a very minimum.

If you do get clickers and your die doesn't get the base down you can get a ring die .4675 or .4685 that works as well. Seems like the trend is the SAC or Cortina sizing dies as it sizes more at the base and less at the CSJ.

Do you have the reamer print to post from Manson?

 

[memilanuk]

Does anyone here have any resized measurements from a standard 308 Redding Type S? With Lapua brass preferably

So... took me a bit to find my old, original Redding Type 'S' F/L bushing die (non small-base) - the reloading room kind of went off a cliff a few years back, and I'm still reorganizing / finding stuff. Anywho, I took four cases from an old batch of Lapua .308 Win Palma (SRP) brass to the range, fired them along with the Alpha OCD stuff, brought them back, nuked one for AZTEC, and sized the other three.

Shoulder diameter was right at 0.4530-0.04535". Case web diameter @ the 0.200" line was 0.4705-0.4710", which sounds about right - that die produced a lot of ammo that shot a lot of X's and won a lot of matches.

The only times I really had problems was when I tried swapping brass from one barrel to the next. Back then, I was shooting primarily factory (Savage) barrels, and there was a distinct possibility that one chamber might have a fat bottom, and the next a tighter one. Small base dies weren't always enough to get the job done, so I also have a ring die sized to squawk the base down to 0.468".

 

[Dolomite]

The manson reamer base at .4708 seems to be on the smaller end of the spectrum. If it’s possible get a .471 base to avoid clickers. Actually the manson reamer says +.001 on the diameter tolerance so you might be ok but check with Manson before ordering.

 

[WSnyder]

SAAMI 308 @.200 line is .4714, 95 Palma is .470. I like ~.472 for use with a SAAMI die like the Redding S. Anything smaller than SAAMI .4714 seems to eventually produce clickers. I have a 95 Palma but I open up the back end to ~.472 when I finish the chamber.

 

[Codyway]

I was thinking about using the Widden die with the Manson reamer. Should give about 0.0010 sizing top and bottom after firing spring back.
Thoughts?