Chrono data during ladder test

[DLT]

I’m going to try and run a ladder test at 400 with a 223 maybe run it twice loading up 2 of each charge and shooting at 2 different targets, shooting the first ladder at one target and the second at another target. I have a nice flat 400 yard range that’s usually little to no wind. Question is can I run the test without my magneto speed hanging off my barrel ? Yes I know I can but I have got into trouble before shooting ladders at 100 yards and looking for flat spots in velocity with it attached only to have terrible groups when it’s taken off. If I run my test at 400 and have a nice little cluster/node but no chrono data to read it’s not a pointless test is it ? I can always test for the speed later correct

 

[Bc'z]

Correct.
I don't run my magneto speed until after I've shot all my tests and have nailed down the load, then I'll load and shoot some over the chronograph for a report to make my drop chart.

 

[Bill Norris]

Correct.
I don't run my magneto speed until after I've shot all my tests and have nailed down the load, then I'll load and shoot some over the chronograph for a report to make my drop chart.

I too wait until I have my load work completed before breaking out the chrono. I don't get wrapped around the axle with chrono #s E S & S D @ 100 yds. Reason being I've seen very low numbers with open groups and the reverse as well. If I saw a great group with high numbers I would still believe the target as Erik says.

 

[seymour fish]

I’m going to try and run a ladder test at 400 with a 223 maybe run it twice loading up 2 of each charge and shooting at 2 different targets, shooting the first ladder at one target and the second at another target. I have a nice flat 400 yard range that’s usually little to no wind. Question is can I run the test without my magneto speed hanging off my barrel ? Yes I know I can but I have got into trouble before shooting ladders at 100 yards and looking for flat spots in velocity with it attached only to have terrible groups when it’s taken off. If I run my test at 400 and have a nice little cluster/node but no chrono data to read it’s not a pointless test is it ? I can always test for the speed later correct

No

 

[762plinker]

a target with no velocity is close to useless...there is a reson why real chronographs do not hang on bbl. borrow a labradar. when done plot the results on two charts. vel vs powder load...look for flats in the charts..maybe nodes

 

[Bill Norris]

My way of working up a load works fine for me. I'll keep doing it til it don't. I probably shoot as many 1/4 inch groups or less than some.

 

[dthomas]

I also do the same as BCZ and Bill Norris stated. If you want to use a chronograph during load development get one that doesn't attach to the barrel.

 

[Clancy]

I don’t know many people, including myself, that have a LabRadar and enjoy it. They’re extremely hard to satisfy.

I leave my V3 at home until the work is done then check my velocity.

 

[Eagle Six]

You can rig your magneto speed so it doesn't hang off the barrel. With that said I work up loads, then do the chrono work as I am fine tuning, as Bill and Bc'z and others.

 

[3Ackleys]

I do all my load dev. at 600 or farther. I pick the load that shoots the best not the one with the magical chrono #'s

 

[spudgun]

Doing a crono and ladder test at the same time is a waste of crono time, in my opinion.

When doing a ladder test with different powder charges your barrel will tell you what it likes. When you find the node of the barrel, then you can measure the FPS for your reference data.

What I do when I have a new barrel, is my ladder testing find the nodes the barrel likes and then measure the FPS. If you do enough loads you should find 2 groups that are the best ones. I will then measure the FPS at those 2 loads and select the slower one depending on my bullet size and weight you want to shoot. My 6 Creedmoor I try to find a load that works under 3,000 FPS. I select a slower speed to be able to get more rounds down the barrel before I shoot the barrel out. Usually about 1,000-1,300 rounds and my barrels will be shot out and either I have them set back and re-chambers or get a new one.

i am on my 2nd, 6 creed barrel now and I had the fist one re-chambered and ready to use when the time comes.

Just my $.02 worth...
Good luck.

 

[6Creed73]

I do ladder testing for powder and seating depth without the chrono. I will analyze the groups and usually take the top 3 and then will do 10-20 shot strings through the chrono to get my velocity and spreads. If my best groups gives me the worst spreads, experience tells me that round won't translate well at long range. Then it's back to tweaking until I'm satisfied with both the groups and chrono numbers.

I tell people all the time that load development is a lot of work and expensive, but necessary.

 

[big5ifty]

My method is to first load up two rounds each of a range of powder charges, with no particular attention to seating depth , just so I can chrony the rounds lowest charge first and see where my max charge is. Once this is done, you don't need the chrony anymore.

From there, I have had good results with the OCW method to identify the best charge under the max limit determined from step one.

Finally, seating depth changes to try shrink group size.

 

[jepp2]

Maybe a different opinion. When I am shooting a ladder, I normally am also checking where I am relative to max loads. I record velocity on every round I fire. No downside, can be very helpful.

I've got a LabRadar now (finally after holding out for a long time). But before I got it, I shot everything across my Shooting Chrony. And I am still in the camp of "haven't shot it yet". Finally I grew tired of dragging the connection cable across snow drifts, so I got a Competition Electronics ProChrono DLX. Just to have the BT to make things easier. Can be had today for only $150. And while I don't normally use it, it rides in the car for when I am shooting 20 cal and below or above 4,000 fps.

I used QL for many years, and more recently converted to GRT. I find inputting the velocity very helpful in calculating nodes. GRT takes your velocity and adjusts the powder burn rate and provides you the loading for the node you select. So to try and shoot ladders and not have velocity data seems like you are seriously limiting yourself.

So I have great value for velocity numbers. And with the cost of components today, I just can't see a good reason why everyone can't have velocity on what they shoot. There still are shoot through chronos being made and used my a diminishing number of folks.

 

[Eagle Six]

Now I find out all the hits/misses I made before chronographs were readily available are useless!!! Darn, and I thought some of them were pretty good. That's what i get for growing up in the dark ages!

 

[762plinker]

Doing a crono and ladder test at the same time is a waste of crono time, in my opinion.

When doing a ladder test with different powder charges your barrel will tell you what it likes. When you find the node of the barrel, then you can measure the FPS for your reference data.

What I do when I have a new barrel, is my ladder testing find the nodes the barrel likes and then measure the FPS. If you do enough loads you should find 2 groups that are the best ones. I will then measure the FPS at those 2 loads and select the slower one depending on my bullet size and weight you want to shoot. My 6 Creedmoor I try to find a load that works under 3,000 FPS. I select a slower speed to be able to get more rounds down the barrel before I shoot the barrel out. Usually about 1,000-1,300 rounds and my barrels will be shot out and either I have them set back and re-chambers or get a new one.

i am on my 2nd, 6 creed barrel now and I had the fist one re-chambered and ready to use when the time comes.

Just my $.02 worth...
Good luck.

if one shoots a simple 10 to 20 shot SINGLE LOAD PER SHOT ladder.. a real ladder, and plots each impact on a target at the bench, then plots the shot per load graph...you have two tools to HELP find nodes sweet spots what ever. bottom line two sets of data from a single shooting string. i have only been doing this for 40 plus years. you are entitled to waste your time any way you want.

 

[DLT]

if one shoots a simple 10 to 20 shot SINGLE LOAD PER SHOT ladder.. a real ladder, and plots each impact on a target at the bench, then plots the shot per load graph...you have two tools to HELP find nodes sweet spots what ever. bottom line two sets of data from a single shooting string. i have only been doing this for 40 plus years. you are entitled to waste your time any way you want.

I just hope the combo I decide to load it climbs up the paper and makes it pretty obvious and does not go all over the paper like a shotgun blast that will be my luck

 

[dcali]

The best way to do a ladder is to measure the velocity and vertical impact point of each shot. Putting a magneto speed on the barrel will cause problems, though. So the second best is to note the charge weight instead of the velocity.

You are not looking for velocity flat spots. The do not exist. What you are looking for is vertical impact flat spots. Once you know the velocity at which you get a vertical flat spot, you can then figure out what charge weight you need to hit that velocity.

 

[762plinker]

The best way to do a ladder is to measure the velocity and vertical impact point of each shot. Putting a magneto speed on the barrel will cause problems, though. So the second best is to note the charge weight instead of the velocity.

You are not looking for velocity flat spots. The do not exist. What you are looking for is vertical impact flat spots. Once you know the velocity at which you get a vertical flat spot, you can then figure out what charge weight you need to hit that velocity.

just not true..it does happen

 

[JFrank]

if one shoots a simple 10 to 20 shot SINGLE LOAD PER SHOT ladder.. a real ladder, and plots each impact on a target at the bench, then plots the shot per load graph...you have two tools to HELP find nodes sweet spots what ever. bottom line two sets of data from a single shooting string. i have only been doing this for 40 plus years. you are entitled to waste your time any way you want.

That makes you an old Fart. (Smiles )