Short range Br bbl twist questions.

[Mulligan]

So in short range Br. The 6ppc, 6br, 6 bra, 6dasher are the cartridge s most shooters choose.
I know the 30br is the score king but my question only pertains to the 6mm.
It's really a barrel question.
So my question is" If a 6br cartridge is to complete against the 6ppc, should that 6br barrel be a slower twist barrel with a short free bore?"
Reason I ask this is because I see lot's of 6br shoot well and I'm interested in staying shooting 6br case. Iv only shot the fast twist 6br barrels.
If I'm wanting to agg well in short range, mainly 100 yard shoots, should I just get a 13.5, or 14 twist barrel? Shoot 60 to 70g bullets?
Can a fast twist barrel agg against slower twist barrel's assuming they both are loaded optimally?
Or could ask it like this," Can a shooter agg well shooting 100 grain bullets as well as a shooter who is shooting 60 or 70 grain bullets?
I know this is a loaded question but I always appreciate what you guys reply.
Thanks again

Bart's custom bullets

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bartsbullets.weebly.com

Give Bart a call, he will help you out.
CW

 

[alf]

I'm waiting for the guys to chime in that are always flappin' their gums to just get a 7" or 8" twist because they shoot the lightweight bullets just as well as the heavies......

 

[NC/Br Shooter]

I don't see how. The BR case is larger and holds more power. Shooting the same weight bullets the BR will result in less flight time.

This logic has crossed my mind. Could had asked the question the same way.
13.5 twist 6br, with vv133.
What could be different?

 

[SteveOak]

Check out the 6 PPC and 6 BR pages on the main site. The numbers are close, but the PPC delivers best accuracy when pushed at the top of the load window, not necessarily true of the 6 BR IME.

I am not finding any 6BR data with bullets as light as those used in 6PPC.

The heaviest I can find for 6PPC is 70gr @ 3,149 fps and the lightest I can find for 6BR is 80gr (14% + heavier) @ 3,150 fps.

 

[762plinker]

I am not finding any 6BR data with bullets as light as those used in 6PPC.

The heaviest I can find for 6PPC is 70gr @ 3,149 fps and the lightest I can find for 6BR is 80gr (14% + heavier) @ 3,150 fps.

you are not going to find actual number that apply to bench rest and the 6ppc..we do not use books for our data

 

[SteveOak]

Bullet	Powder	Start Load	Start FPS	Max Load	Max FPS	Comments
Zia 58gr FB	AA 2230C	31.0gr	3400	33.1gr	3550	200 fps faster than 66gr
Bart’s 62gr FB	H322	28.0gr	2800	30.1gr	3300	100-yard load
Gentner 65gr BT	H322	26gr	3100	28gr	3300	7.5 ogive for .050″ freebore
Knight 66gr FB	VV N133	26gr	2820	28.3gr	3150	7 & 9 ogive best
Bart’s 68gr Ultra FB	VV N133	28.2gr	3150	29.6gr	3300+	Bart Sauter’s Load
Bruno 68gr ’00’ BT	8208 ‘T’	28gr	3100	29.0gr	3300+	Lester Bruno’s Load
Euber 68gr FB	VV N133	25gr	2752	29.2gr	3200+	Allie Euber Load
SG&Y 68gr FB	IMR 8208 (Thunderbird)	28.8gr	na	29.2gr	3200+	Speedy’s Load
Nosler 70gr BT	Benchmark	28gr	2800	29gr	3149	Hodgdon Data

 

[Bill Norris]

Bullet	Powder	Start Load	Start FPS	Max Load	Max FPS	Comments
Zia 58gr FB	AA 2230C	31.0gr	3400	33.1gr	3550	200 fps faster than 66gr
Bart’s 62gr FB	H322	28.0gr	2800	30.1gr	3300	100-yard load
Gentner 65gr BT	H322	26gr	3100	28gr	3300	7.5 ogive for .050″ freebore
Knight 66gr FB	VV N133	26gr	2820	28.3gr	3150	7 & 9 ogive best
Bart’s 68gr Ultra FB	VV N133	28.2gr	3150	29.6gr	3300+	Bart Sauter’s Load
Bruno 68gr ’00’ BT	8208 ‘T’	28gr	3100	29.0gr	3300+	Lester Bruno’s Load
Euber 68gr FB	VV N133	25gr	2752	29.2gr	3200+	Allie Euber Load
SG&Y 68gr FB	IMR 8208 (Thunderbird)	28.8gr	na	29.2gr	3200+	Speedy’s Load
Nosler 70gr BT	Benchmark	28gr	2800	29gr	3149	Hodgdon Data

Yep, this is the real data for 6PPC.

 

[LHSmith]

Yep, this is the real data for 6PPC.

That main page article is quite dated, several of the contributors are no longer with us. Since then new reamers have been configured to get the maximum case capacity possible giving more velocity.

 

[SteveOak]

That main page article is quite dated, several of the contributors are no longer with us. Since then new reamers have been configured to get the maximum case capacity possible giving more velocity.

If the reamer was reconfigured to increase capacity, it would no longer be a 6 PPC, it would be something else.

Lester Bruno will be quite surprised to find out he is no longer with us, especially since he won the Cactus a few weeks ago.

 

[newbieshooter]

Check out the 6 PPC and 6 BR pages on the main site. The numbers are close, but the PPC delivers best accuracy when pushed at the top of the load window, not necessarily true of the 6 BR IME.

I am not finding any 6BR data with bullets as light as those used in 6PPC.

The heaviest I can find for 6PPC is 70gr @ 3,149 fps and the lightest I can find for 6BR is 80gr (14% + heavier) @ 3,150 fps.

You are being redirected...

scroll down to the Varmint Loads section (near the bottom of the page).

 

[762plinker]

If the reamer was reconfigured to increase capacity, it would no longer be a 6 PPC, it would be something else.

Lester Bruno will be quite surprised to find out he is no longer with us, especially since he won the Cactus a few weeks ago.

and he is not shooting any of those lite loads
ii shoot at 29.9 n133 with a miller 65,
lester is typically way past me as are several others.
yes there are some lite shooters that do well, but most are 19 or more

 

[AlNyhus]

I'm waiting for the guys to chime in that are always flappin' their gums to just get a 7" or 8" twist because they shoot the lightweight bullets just as well as the heavies......

They "...shoot in the .1's all day long".

 

[LHSmith]

If the reamer was reconfigured to increase capacity, it would no longer be a 6 PPC, it would be something else.

Lester Bruno will be quite surprised to find out he is no longer with us, especially since he won the Cactus a few weeks ago.

The PPC has no SAAMI spec.There are hundreds of 6 PPC reamer designs. FWIW in SR BR all that matters is the caliber be recognized and Hunter /Varmint Hunter Class address case volume (at least in IBS). Those noted as contributors that have left us - Mickey Coleman, Allie Euber, and Brady Knight. I made no mention of Lester B.

 

[WyleWD]

So in short range Br. The 6ppc, 6br, 6 bra, 6dasher are the cartridge s most shooters choose.
I know the 30br is the score king but my question only pertains to the 6mm.
It's really a barrel question.
So my question is" If a 6br cartridge is to complete against the 6ppc, should that 6br barrel be a slower twist barrel with a short free bore?"
Reason I ask this is because I see lot's of 6br shoot well and I'm interested in staying shooting 6br case. Iv only shot the fast twist 6br barrels.
If I'm wanting to agg well in short range, mainly 100 yard shoots, should I just get a 13.5, or 14 twist barrel? Shoot 60 to 70g bullets?
Can a fast twist barrel agg against slower twist barrel's assuming they both are loaded optimally?
Or could ask it like this," Can a shooter agg well shooting 100 grain bullets as well as a shooter who is shooting 60 or 70 grain bullets?
I know this is a loaded question but I always appreciate what you guys reply.
Thanks again

Check out post #1778 on this thread below: That target was not a fluke. JME. WD

What did you shoot today?

On the way home from picking up kids from Grandparents and having dinner with in-laws, noticed a trash panda out chillin' in the field. Dropped the kids and the Boss Lady at home and grabbed .17 hmr and low and behold he was still there. Was last sighted in for cci TNT jhp's so that's what I...

forum.accurateshooter.com

 

[SteveOak]

The PPC has no SAAMI spec.

Curious thing that, Forster, RCBS, Lee, Redding, JLC Precision, L.E. Wilson, all sell 6PPC dies. Someone must have an idea about dimensions.

 

[LHSmith]

Most are identified as 6 mm PPC-USA.
From the Speer Manual #14 under 6mm PPC : "Like other wildcat cartridges, no industry pressure standards exist. There are no U.S. dimensional standards for the PPC cartridges. The European standards agency (CIP) lists two versions of the 6mm PPC with slightly different dimensions. One version is that manufactured by Sako.
Most reloading manuals reference Sako brass used for load development.

 

[NC/Br Shooter]

Compelling

 

[TRSR8]

If the reamer was reconfigured to increase capacity, it would no longer be a 6 PPC, it would be something else.

Lester Bruno will be quite surprised to find out he is no longer with us, especially since he won the Cactus a few weeks ago.

The PPC data is very outdated, a ton of guys( with true BR actions/ chambers)
are over 30 gr of 133, many pushing 31 gr. Usually with 65/66 gr bullets.

To the OP, 13 1/2- 14 twist barrel .

 

[dcali]

Curious thing that, Forster, RCBS, Lee, Redding, JLC Precision, L.E. Wilson, all sell 6PPC dies. Someone must have an idea about dimensions.

Strangely, the Europeans seem more on the ball with disticntly American competition cartridges. There are three PPCs in the CIP standards, and none on the SAAMI list. Last I checked, the 6XC was also CIP only, as was the .284 Shehane.

Meanwhile, SAAMI is working on adding weird stuff like the 6.5 Weatherby Rebated Precision Magnum. SAAMI seems more focused on specifying the things that the industry comes up with than with the stuff shooters come up with.

CIP - Homologation

bobp.cip-bobp.org

 

[NC/Br Shooter]

The PPC data is very outdated, a ton of guys( with true BR actions/ chambers)
are over 30 gr of 133, many pushing 31 gr. Usually with 65/66 gr bullets.

To the OP, 13 1/2- 14 twist barrel .

I got that 6bra I found a good load with 32.5 of 133. It's not making my bolt do anything right .
I know it's different than ppc case obviously, but I wouldn't had ever thought it could had taken that much. Shooting a 70g Smk. I shot 32.8 too and still no marks on cases. But group opened up.