H4895 and A5477 Reduced Loads Hunting

[USAFRet]

I have some H4895 and A5744 for reduced loads on 270 and 308. Looking for a happy medium for lighter recoil and mid-range deer hunting velocities - 250 yards with at least 1800 fps and 1000 ft lbs of energy. I am trying to do some calculating, but I am sure I am off.

Anyone have any real world data out there with barrel length, bullet type, etc?

I don't have much and would like a starting point vs. wasting powder and components trying to get those results.

So far, 80% of max is looking like a sweet spot.

Any help appreciated.

 

[Bronsin]

https://imrpowder.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/h4895-reduced-rifle-loads.pdf

 

[TC260]

I used to shoot 5744 and 4759 a fair amount, the data I was using from old Speer manuals usually had max muzzle velocities around 2000fps.

 

[Turpentine]

I load 3006 and 270 reduced loads running imr 4895 for the 3006 with 150s and H4895 in 270 with 120s and 130s. With the 3006 I dropped back 5 grains from the starting load in my manual. Starting load was 47 so I started around 42 grains. I ended up using 44 grains as it was extremely accurate and consistent with a 150 sst at about 2650. 22” barrel. Actually one of the more accurate loads I have ever used. It’s a very comfortable load to shoot.
For 270, I ended up around 38 - 40 grains of H4895 with a 120 or 130 grain bullet. If I remember correctly those loads ran 2550-2600 from a 22” barrel and did fine on deer and hogs. Hornady 120 and 130 sst. Those loads were for my son and nephew when they were 7-8 years old. They handled it no problem. The 120 has the cannelure that’s suited to the 6.8 so when i loaded it I did not seat all the way to the cannelure. For 130s I did seat to cannelure.
Another solution for one of my 270s which was a vicious kicker was to drop down to the starting load of Imr 4350 with a 130 nosler ballistic tip. 52 grains was the load and ran right around 2800fps. For some reason with imr 4350, 55 grains and 52 grains or thereabouts always seem to shoot well With 130s. 52 was accurate, comfortable, and I killed deer out to 400 yards with it,
I’m not sure exactly how much reduction you are looking for but with 308 it should be very easy. 41.5 of H or imr 4895 under a 168 grain Amax is pretty much an accuracy load for 308 and runs about 2600fps in my AR10 with 20” barrel and 2750 in my 26” bolt gun. If that load has a bit too much recoil for you just use the h4895 and back down until it is comfortable. 39 grains should put you at 2400 from a 22” barrel. I use the 168 Amax for deer depredation out of an AR 10. It starts out at 2650fps and is tailor made to the lower velocity impact and expansion. From 50 to 500+ yards it just flat out works
If you prefer a 150 just start out at 42 grains of H or IMR 4895 and work down until you find an accurate, comfortable load. 42 grains will put you close to 2600 with the 150s in a 22” barrel. The 150sst is good here but there are certainly a lot of good 150s to choose from. I prefer the Amax, Ballistic Tip, SST, or Gamekings because they will perform well at the lower speeds you will be working with. The 168 Amax is my personal favorite in the 308. Check out Hodgdon and Hornady’s Service rifle data for the 308. There are quite a few loads there that will be very comfortable.
I should mention that with 270 and 30-06 case fill can be a concern with lighter loads. i like to use a Winchester large rifle primer or a magnum rifle primer with those loads. Especially if I am dropping way down the scale just to help make sure I get proper ignition. For really light loads I would recommend something like Trailboss for better case fill.
Standard large rifle primers will work fine for you with the 308.

 

[K22]

I have used the Hodgdon's reduced load data for the 308 Win which consists of 38 grains of H4895, 125 grain Nosler BTs, and Federal 210M primers.

Very accurate, modest recoil even out of my Tikka. Enough energy to take a white tail out to 200 yards at least on paper. However, I never shot a deer with this load but would not hesitate to use it for deer within 200 yards. Did take a coyote with this load and it destroyed the critter.

 

[USAFRet]

Folks, much appreciated. I actually have most of the bullets y'all have mentioned, so this gives me a good starting point. Recoil I am looking for is maybe about the 6.5 Creedmoor level. I am disabled with neck and shoulder issues and my 270s are both fairly light. A Ruger No. 1 Sporter and a Rem 700 Mountain. They kick and kick hard with standard loads, at least for this broken down old man.

I do have a HOWA 1500 I bought that I replaced with a better stock and had a muzzle brake made for it, but it was sent back to the factory. 4" groups at 100 yards was the best I could stretch with Norma and that only happened once. The rest of the time it was about 6" and even worse with other ammo. Even had it bedded and not an improvement at all.

 

[USAFRet]

I load 3006 and 270 reduced loads running imr 4895 for the 3006 with 150s and H4895 in 270 with 120s and 130s. With the 3006 I dropped back 5 grains from the starting load in my manual. Starting load was 47 so I started around 42 grains. I ended up using 44 grains as it was extremely accurate and consistent with a 150 sst at about 2650. 22” barrel. Actually one of the more accurate loads I have ever used. It’s a very comfortable load to shoot.
For 270, I ended up around 38 - 40 grains of H4895 with a 120 or 130 grain bullet. If I remember correctly those loads ran 2550-2600 from a 22” barrel and did fine on deer and hogs. Hornady 120 and 130 sst. Those loads were for my son and nephew when they were 7-8 years old. They handled it no problem. The 120 has the cannelure that’s suited to the 6.8 so when i loaded it I did not seat all the way to the cannelure. For 130s I did seat to cannelure.
Another solution for one of my 270s which was a vicious kicker was to drop down to the starting load of Imr 4350 with a 130 nosler ballistic tip. 52 grains was the load and ran right around 2800fps. For some reason with imr 4350, 55 grains and 52 grains or thereabouts always seem to shoot well With 130s. 52 was accurate, comfortable, and I killed deer out to 400 yards with it,
I’m not sure exactly how much reduction you are looking for but with 308 it should be very easy. 41.5 of H or imr 4895 under a 168 grain Amax is pretty much an accuracy load for 308 and runs about 2600fps in my AR10 with 20” barrel and 2750 in my 26” bolt gun. If that load has a bit too much recoil for you just use the h4895 and back down until it is comfortable. 39 grains should put you at 2400 from a 22” barrel. I use the 168 Amax for deer depredation out of an AR 10. It starts out at 2650fps and is tailor made to the lower velocity impact and expansion. From 50 to 500+ yards it just flat out works
If you prefer a 150 just start out at 42 grains of H or IMR 4895 and work down until you find an accurate, comfortable load. 42 grains will put you close to 2600 with the 150s in a 22” barrel. The 150sst is good here but there are certainly a lot of good 150s to choose from. I prefer the Amax, Ballistic Tip, SST, or Gamekings because they will perform well at the lower speeds you will be working with. The 168 Amax is my personal favorite in the 308. Check out Hodgdon and Hornady’s Service rifle data for the 308. There are quite a few loads there that will be very comfortable.
I should mention that with 270 and 30-06 case fill can be a concern with lighter loads. i like to use a Winchester large rifle primer or a magnum rifle primer with those loads. Especially if I am dropping way down the scale just to help make sure I get proper ignition. For really light loads I would recommend something like Trailboss for better case fill.
Standard large rifle primers will work fine for you with the 308.

What was your COL for the 120 grain SST for 270? I literally cannot find load information for a 120 grain 270 for H4895 or A5744.

 

[Turpentine]

What was your COL for the 120 grain SST for 270? I literally cannot find load information for a 120 grain 270 for H4895 or A5744.

I think I have a few of them left or they may be in my load book. Let me check. I’ll get back to you shortly

 

[Turpentine]

I used hodgdons website to get data for a 130 grain hornady soft point and a120 grain Barnes bullet. Max charge on both was 45 grains multiplied times .6 by Hodgdons rule gave me 27 grains Minimum. I let the particular rifle tell me what it preferred. My Remington model 6 pump liked 38 grains H4895. Hornady 120 SST seated approximately 3.21 OAL once fired Winchester brass
My nephews Savage Axis 270. I shortened the stock to 12 inches, hollowed it out and filled with lead. Then fitted a limbsaver recoil pad to it. He was tiny back then. His load was 36 grains of H 4895 in Hornady Brass, 120SST seated to 3.21 OAL. Both of these loads used WLR primers
Im pretty sure I used 40 grains h4895 for the 130 sstt seated to cannelure. I have some of the 38 grain 120s left so I may be able to run a couple across the chronograph tomorrow and see what kind of speed it was running. These certainly were not powerhouse loads. My son killed a 250 pound sow with the 120s and a 150 pound 6 point with the 130. Nephew killed several deer with both.

 

[USAFRet]

I used hodgdons website to get data for a 130 grain hornady soft point and a120 grain Barnes bullet. Max charge on both was 45 grains multiplied times .6 by Hodgdons rule gave me 27 grains Minimum. I let the particular rifle tell me what it preferred. My Remington model 6 pump liked 38 grains H4895. Hornady 120 SST seated approximately 3.21 OAL once fired Winchester brass
My nephews Savage Axis 270. I shortened the stock to 12 inches, hollowed it out and filled with lead. Then fitted a limbsaver recoil pad to it. He was tiny back then. His load was 36 grains of H 4895 in Hornady Brass, 120SST seated to 3.21 OAL. Both of these loads used WLR primers
Im pretty sure I used 40 grains h4895 for the 130 sstt seated to cannelure. I have some of the 38 grain 120s left so I may be able to run a couple across the chronograph tomorrow and see what kind of speed it was running. These certainly were not powerhouse loads. My son killed a 250 pound sow with the 120s and a 150 pound 6 point with the 130. Nephew killed several deer with both.

I appreciate that very much.

 

[USAFRet]

I think I have a few of them left or they may be in my load book. Let me check. I’ll get back to you shortly

Thank you!

 

[harro]

I run a load of 35gn of H4895 with a Speer 130gn HP out of a 22” barrel .
Does anyone have an idea of how fast they might be moving?
I don’t have a chronograph and I’ve always just guessed somewhere around 2500 fps .

 

[USAFRet]

I run a load of 35gn of H4895 with a Speer 130gn HP out of a 22” barrel .
Does anyone have an idea of how fast they might be moving?
I don’t have a chronograph and I’ve always just guessed somewhere around 2500 fps .

What caliber?

 

[harro]

What caliber?

Sorry , should have clarified that .
308 Win

 

[USAFRet]

Sorry , should have clarified that .
308 Win

I would run that test but don't have a 130 grain 308 bullet in my stock.

 

[harro]

No worries .
It’s a load that I made up for a neighbouring property owners young son who was struggling a bit with “ full noise “ factory loads .
He has now worked his way up to the factory loads , but I had a few rounds loaded and thought I’d try them in my recently acquired 308 .
They are just fun to shoot and consistently print 1 inch groups at 100yrds .
I’ll probably do some more load development and see if I can shrink them a bit for a fun project.
PS - He nailed a number of Pigs with this load and the 130 Varmint HP at the reduced velocity did a very good job .

 

[USAFRet]

No worries .
It’s a load that I made up for a neighbouring property owners young son who was struggling a bit with “ full noise “ factory loads .
He has now worked his way up to the factory loads , but I had a few rounds loaded and thought I’d try them in my recently acquired 308 .
They are just fun to shoot and consistently print 1 inch groups at 100yrds .
I’ll probably do some more load development and see if I can shrink them a bit for a fun project.
PS - He nailed a number of Pigs with this load and the 130 Varmint HP at the reduced velocity did a very good job .

Nice!

 

[MrK.]

When my son was 9 years old I bought him a Stainless Ruger 77 in .308 Winchester. I picked up a beat up stock off of ebay, painted it black and sawed a couple inches off the butt. I purchased some Sierra 125 grain Pro hunters and loaded up some very mild loads for him to practice. The load was 38 grains of H4895 for about 2400 fps out of his 18in barrel. We would shoot and shoot that load from the bench and all possible hunting scenarios. Standing, sitting, prone etc. When it came time to hunt I swapped his light loads out for full power loads and he was none the wiser. In hind sight that was unnecessary as I had no problem killing a small buck with that load from about 150yds on a spur of the moment deer hunt one evening. Not too long ago I was digging around in my stash and came across a half box of those reduced loads with a loading date of April 2000 and it brought back a flood of memories. He would have been 10 at that time. I took that half box to the range with me the next session and sent a few down range with my old Model 88. Good times.

 

[USAFRet]

When my son was 9 years old I bought him a Stainless Ruger 77 in .308 Winchester. I picked up a beat up stock off of ebay, painted it black and sawed a couple inches off the butt. I purchased some Sierra 125 grain Pro hunters and loaded up some very mild loads for him to practice. The load was 38 grains of H4895 for about 2400 fps out of his 18in barrel. We would shoot and shoot that load from the bench and all possible hunting scenarios. Standing, sitting, prone etc. When it came time to hunt I swapped his light loads out for full power loads and he was none the wiser. In hind sight that was unnecessary as I had no problem killing a small buck with that load from about 150yds on a spur of the moment deer hunt one evening. Not too long ago I was digging around in my stash and came across a half box of those reduced loads with a loading date of April 2000 and it brought back a flood of memories. He would have been 10 at that time. I took that half box to the range with me the next session and sent a few down range with my old Model 88. Good times.

That's a great story. Thanks for sharing.

 

[harro]

I was loading up some .223 load development rounds today with H4895 and remembered about this thread .
So when I had finished the .223 , I grabbed some 308 brass and put together some rounds as a load development to see if I can improve on the previous load of 35gn .
When I originally made this load up for a neighbour I just loaded 35gn ( 130gn Speer HP ) and it shot OK so didn't pursue it any further .
Todays loads start at 33gn and go up in 1gn increments to 37gn .
It will be interesting to see how much difference there is with 1gn increases .