Very ammo sensitive?

[ronsatspokane]

Just picked up a used Anschutz 34.50 BR and have been testing various ammo brands and types and lots in it. I think I am the third owner of this rifle. I've tried everything from Aguila to Wolf including the obvious choices like Lapua Center X, SK Standard Plus and Rifle Match, Federal Gold Medel and HV Match, Ely Target and Club, RWS R100 (don't have any R50), Wolf Match Target and Match Extra and a number of others that I did not expect much from like CCI SV, Geco Match and Aguila standard. All testing has been done in temps in the mid 30's and almost no wind while shooting off a SEB Mini with a Rodzilla top and using a SEB Bigfoot bag filled with heavy sand. The mini and the bag are my F Class shooting tools and they work well. Of course this is a 22 so not much recoil but what little there is is tracking perfectly. It should be easy to find the right ammo to feed this thing.

Some of the ammo showed promise at 50 yards shooting 5 shots on each bull of a USBR green target. SK SP out shot SK RM and was mostly 1 hole but for a flyer about 1/4 inch out of the group. One lot of Center X was similar. 1 hole but for a flyer about the same distance away. Fiocchi 320 was similar to those two. With the exception of R100, the rest of the ammo I tested was uninspiring. R100 was essentially one hole albeit a bit elongated. I repeated the tests with the top 5 and the results were nearly identical. Only this time R100 was a very clean single hole.

The trouble is that I've only got a half a box of R100 and I'm sure that lot is long gone. So I was testing the Fiocchi 320, Lapua Center X and SK SP at 100 yards. I have inventory of all of those. Next set of tests involved shooting 10 shot groups on each of the 5 targets of a 100 yard BR target (at 100 yards) preceded by 10 sighters. As expected, they all opened up. One of the Fiocchi groups was under 1 MOA with one flyer but none of the others were as promising. Some groups in these tests opened up to 2.5 MOA. When done, the Fiocchi 320 was the only ammo left that showed "some" promise but it was not inspiring.

Well I had about 20 rounds of the R100 left so I decided to give it a try. No cleaning, just load'em and shoot. Shot 5 of them and they fell within 1/2 MOA. Half inch at 100 yards. I didn't shoot anymore.

So it looks like the only ammo this gun really likes is R100. And of course there is none of it available in the US. Same with R50. And who knows if a different lot would work as well. And of course it is the most expensive ammo I tried. Why couldn't it have liked CCI SV...

One of the thoughts as to why R100 works is that it is billed as a cold temp ammo with higher velocity than R50. None of the other ammo tested was touted for cold weather. Another guy at the range was shooting Lapua Biathlon X in his CZ 457 and he said it was rocking it. That is another cold weather ammo. However a guy I was shooting with was shooting Lapua Center X in his Voodoo and was was doing well. He does keep his ammo warm though.

Thoughts?

 

[ronsatspokane]

This is the R100 target at 50 yards.

 

[Emmett Dibble]

All testing has been done in temps in the mid 30

Thoughts?

Far to cold. Sorry. Wait till you get to the mid 50’s at least.

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

Just picked up a used Anschutz 34.50 BR and have been testing various ammo brands and types and lots in it. I think I am the third owner of this rifle. I've tried everything from Aguila to Wolf including the obvious choices like Lapua Center X, SK Standard Plus and Rifle Match, Federal Gold Medel and HV Match, Ely Target and Club, RWS R100 (don't have any R50), Wolf Match Target and Match Extra and a number of others that I did not expect much from like CCI SV, Geco Match and Aguila standard. All testing has been done in temps in the mid 30's and almost no wind while shooting off a SEB Mini with a Rodzilla top and using a SEB Bigfoot bag filled with heavy sand. The mini and the bag are my F Class shooting tools and they work well. Of course this is a 22 so not much recoil but what little there is is tracking perfectly. It should be easy to find the right ammo to feed this thing.

Some of the ammo showed promise at 50 yards shooting 5 shots on each bull of a USBR green target. SK SP out shot SK RM and was mostly 1 hole but for a flyer about 1/4 inch out of the group. One lot of Center X was similar. 1 hole but for a flyer about the same distance away. Fiocchi 320 was similar to those two. With the exception of R100, the rest of the ammo I tested was uninspiring. R100 was essentially one hole albeit a bit elongated. I repeated the tests with the top 5 and the results were nearly identical. Only this time R100 was a very clean single hole.

The trouble is that I've only got a half a box of R100 and I'm sure that lot is long gone. So I was testing the Fiocchi 320, Lapua Center X and SK SP at 100 yards. I have inventory of all of those. Next set of tests involved shooting 10 shot groups on each of the 5 targets of a 100 yard BR target (at 100 yards) preceded by 10 sighters. As expected, they all opened up. One of the Fiocchi groups was under 1 MOA with one flyer but none of the others were as promising. Some groups in these tests opened up to 2.5 MOA. When done, the Fiocchi 320 was the only ammo left that showed "some" promise but it was not inspiring.

Well I had about 20 rounds of the R100 left so I decided to give it a try. No cleaning, just load'em and shoot. Shot 5 of them and they fell within 1/2 MOA. Half inch at 100 yards. I didn't shoot anymore.

So it looks like the only ammo this gun really likes is R100. And of course there is none of it available in the US. Same with R50. And who knows if a different lot would work as well. And of course it is the most expensive ammo I tried. Why couldn't it have liked CCI SV...

One of the thoughts as to why R100 works is that it is billed as a cold temp ammo with higher velocity than R50. None of the other ammo tested was touted for cold weather. Another guy at the range was shooting Lapua Biathlon X in his CZ 457 and he said it was rocking it. That is another cold weather ammo. However a guy I was shooting with was shooting Lapua Center X in his Voodoo and was was doing well. He does keep his ammo warm though.

Thoughts?

Do you know when the firing pin spring was last changed? if not replace it and see what happens. also were most out of the group shots low?
shooting in low temperatures requires very good ignition. as you noticed the RWS 100 is rated for a higher velocity which would make up for a slower burn rate in colder temperatures.
another thing is how has the rifle been cleaned? .

Lee

 

[ronsatspokane]

Do you know when the firing pin spring was last changed? if not replace it and see what happens. also were most out of the group shots low?
shooting in low temperatures requires very good ignition. as you noticed the RWS 100 is rated for a higher velocity which would make up for a slower burn rate in colder temperatures.
another thing is how has the rifle been cleaned? .

Lee

The flyers where high and right, barely high though, mostly right. No cleaning was done in the 50 yard tests. Just going through each ammo shooting 5 shots and moving on to the next. Not the correct method, I get it but this was an acid test. When I moved to 100 the rifle was cleaned with wipe out, eliminator and hopes and I used a bronze brush with hopes at the end followed by patches with hopes then clean patches. I then bore scoped it to make sure it was clean. There are some rough spots in the barrel. Thought about that as a cause but I've looked at a lot of barrels. Some of the ugliest have shot the best. Some of the prettiest have shot the worst. And given that R100 shoots well, I don't think it is a barrel problem.

 

[ronsatspokane]

Far to cold. Sorry. Wait till you get to the mid 50’s at least.

Yeah, but that shuts down shooting around here for too large a portion of the year. Got to find something that shoots in the cold. I know it is possible. If R100 were available everywhere, I'd be set. Just ordered some Lapua Biathlon X. We'll see if that holds any promise. Fricking ripoff on shipping a brick but when ammo becomes available at other places, I'll remember how I was ripped off by this place for a long time.

 

[Ned Ludd]

I found this website on a search for RWS ammunition via ammoseek.com:

RWS For Sale - Best deal on RWS

gunprime.com

I don't personally know anything about them, but a quick search suggests they are legit. Perhaps one of the other types of RWS ammo would also provide acceptable precision. It might at least be worth a phone call.

 

[Hi-NV Shooter]

The flyers where high and right, barely high though, mostly right. No cleaning was done in the 50 yard tests. Just going through each ammo shooting 5 shots and moving on to the next. Not the correct method, I get it but this was an acid test. When I moved to 100 the rifle was cleaned with wipe out, eliminator and hopes and I used a bronze brush with hopes at the end followed by patches with hopes then clean patches. I then bore scoped it to make sure it was clean. There are some rough spots in the barrel. Thought about that as a cause but I've looked at a lot of barrels. Some of the ugliest have shot the best. Some of the prettiest have shot the worst. And given that R100 shoots well, I don't think it is a barrel problem.

Well sounds like you know what to look for. I agree the bore and how it looks does not directly correlate to how it can shoot.
an under the radar ammo is Lapua Pistol King I have gotten really good results with it.

Lee

 

[grauhanen]

I had about 20 rounds of the R100 left so I decided to give it a try. No cleaning, just load'em and shoot. Shot 5 of them and they fell within 1/2 MOA. Half inch at 100 yards. I didn't shoot anymore.

So it looks like the only ammo this gun really likes is R100.

However promising it appears, a single five shot group doesn't prove anything not proof except what happened with those five rounds.

No cleaning was done in the 50 yard tests. Just going through each ammo shooting 5 shots and moving on to the next. Not the correct method, I get it but this was an acid test.

Testing to determine ammo performance in a rifle requires a sample size that can be as statistically reliable as possible.

While the 50 yard target is good, the question is were the others at 50 with that ammo (R100) consistently similar?

 

[dhenry132]

Welcome to the cold

 

[ronsatspokane]

However promising it appears, a single five shot group doesn't prove anything not proof except what happened with those five rounds.



Testing to determine ammo performance in a rifle requires a sample size that can be as statistically reliable as possible.

While the 50 yard target is good, the question is were the others at 50 with that ammo (R100) consistently similar?

All true. I have found over the years of testing ammo in 22's though that a small sample size in a clean or dirty bore is a reasonable leading indicator. I've accumulated a wide variety of ammo brands, types and lots soley for testing and have found that something that shoots terrible, never really gets better regardless of barrel state or sample size. Something that shoots decent however has proven to not be as good as originally indicated in a larger sample size and a clean bore. That was the case with Lapua Center X in this rifle where I shot 60 rounds of each lot at the 100 BR targets (10 per bull). And Center X has been great in other rifles. It also does not mean that another lot of Center X would not be acceptable. I actually tried a third lot. One that my friend was shooting in his Voodoo. That lot may have made the cut though still not up to what the R100 was doing through the three tests I put it through.

 

[ronsatspokane]

Welcome to the cold

It is wonderful isn't it. We had a warm up where it made it up to 40 for a couple of days. The first snow that fell back at the beginning of this was almost melted. Now it's snowing again at my house this morning. Not much mind you and it is 34 so it won't stick but still, enough already.

 

[ronsatspokane]

Do you know when the firing pin spring was last changed? if not replace it and see what happens. also were most out of the group shots low?
shooting in low temperatures requires very good ignition. as you noticed the RWS 100 is rated for a higher velocity which would make up for a slower burn rate in colder temperatures.
another thing is how has the rifle been cleaned? .

Lee

I do not know when or if it was changed. An extra firing pin did come with the gun but the springs did not.

 

[ronsatspokane]

I found this website on a search for RWS ammunition via ammoseek.com:

RWS For Sale - Best deal on RWS

gunprime.com

I don't personally know anything about them, but a quick search suggests they are legit. Perhaps one of the other types of RWS ammo would also provide acceptable precision. It might at least be worth a phone call.

I've already got a cheaper RWS type called RWS Target. I'd rate it as the SK SP of RWS's line. In my experience not quite as good as SK SP but it could just be the lot number I have.

 

[hfinkle]

I've got an Anschutz 54 and it shoots better when it's dirty. It really gets good after 50 rounds.

 

[ATFIV]

Testing in the mid 30’s….
Feed mine Bi Polar below 50

 

[ChadCollins]

Anschutz barrel, or re-barrel? Short barrel? Less than 22 inches? Knowing the twist rate will tell you some as well. Slow twist will shoot better in warmer weather. And may like the round nose better as well. I had a 17.5 twist 2groove that shot lights out in the cold, but would only do it with a round nose bullet. Shot Eley like crap. Looks promising. Tuning yet?
Chad

 

[ronsatspokane]

Testing in the mid 30’s….
Feed mine Bi Polar below 50

Bi Polar.

Got some of the Biathlon X on order.

 

[ronsatspokane]

Anschutz barrel, or re-barrel? Short barrel? Less than 22 inches? Knowing the twist rate will tell you some as well. Slow twist will shoot better in warmer weather. And may like the round nose better as well. I had a 17.5 twist 2groove that shot lights out in the cold, but would only do it with a round nose bullet. Shot Eley like crap. Looks promising. Tuning yet?
Chad

Anschutz as far as I know. It has the Anschutz taper in that the muzzle is thicker than the barrel for about 4 inches. I do not know the twist. I'd assumed it was 16 like most 22 rimfires are. I will validate. Not tuning. Probably won't. The older I get the more I value limited variable sets. A tunner adds a whole other dimension that I'm resisting. That could change.

 

[ronsatspokane]

I've got an Anschutz 54 and it shoots better when it's dirty. It really gets good after 50 rounds.

I am seeing that with this rifle. Not sure yet. The sample set is to small currently.