Factory Rifle / Factory Ammo Project

[harro]

G'day from Australia
I thought I'd start a thread about a small budget factory rifle/factory ammo project I've started .
From the beginning I decided that I wanted to try getting a Budget .223 rifle shooting sub 25mm @ 100m ( here in OZ we use the metric system of measurement ) consistently with Factory ammo .
I gave myself a Budget which I will explain as time goes on .
This will be an honest account of my journey and the actual money spent in Australian dollars ( Not what we all tell our wives

)
Here in Australia we don't have as much access to products and what we do have costs a lot more than what you guys pay .

So here goes .
I purchased a Howa Compact Tactical
Fluted Barrel .223 rifle $694.00 delivered .

I chose this model for a couple of reasons - HACT Trigger , Fluted Barrel ( I know all the reasons why Fluted is just a waste of time but Holy S#*t I like the look of it )

Threaded barrel ( important for reasons that will be explained ) , Heavy barrel but only 20 inches long not the 24 inches of the Varmint model , Short , Stiff and manageable from a vehicle ( this will be used as a Dingo rifle , similar to your coyotes but we shoot at night with lights from a vehicle to cover the big distances involved )

A Bloke I know locally is a Professional Kangaroo Shooter and has for years used Howa .223 rifles but the first thing he did was ditch the Hogue pillar bedded stock for another Hogue but a fully alloy bedded one .
After doing heaps of research it was clear thar this was the best budget way to go .
Is it the best option ?
No , but it costs $345.00 delivered and sorts out the flexible forend and bedding in one move .
Here is a pic of the original pillar Stock , see how the barrel channel gap isn't even , and just breathing on it makes it flex .

Report to moderator

101.167.14.158
" Fall in love with the numbers , not the idea "

 

[harro]

So diverting off the Stock for a minute , I wanted to improve the Bolt knob .
All of my other bolt rifles now have larger round Bolt knobs , they just are nicer to use and improve function in my opinion .
The Howa's bolt knob/handle is on the smaller side so a Tourbon rubber knob was ordered off EBay $14.85 delivered .

The installed knob wasn't that good a fit due I think to the shape of the Howa's knob .
It moved around a little which is not the best , so I had to use some contact glue which sorted out the problem .
This alteration to the Factory rifle like all the changes that I do is easily reversible , I will be doing zero gunsmithing / permant removal
of anything and the rifle will be able to be returned to Factory at any point if I want to .

Now the Stock , it is a Hogue full alloy bedded in Tan colour $345.00 delivered .

So much for this being a " Budget " gun because there is still lots to do

 

[harro]

I really deliberated as to using 2 piece bases or a single rail , because its a top loading rifle I was nervous that a rail would make it harder to load rounds into the mag .
In the end I went with a rail because I believe they eliminate any misalignment problems .
I found a Leupold rail online for $89.95 delivered . I found cheaper rails but Leupold is a recognised brand and it's foolish to scrimp and save to much on mounts and rings ( I've been bitten in the past )

I made sure that the screw holes were cleaned out with acetone to remove grease and oil before loctiting them to the reccommended torque settings .
I've found out the hard way in the past of the loctite not working because of dirty threads and the mounts coming loose .
This is the grime from one hole .

After I was happy with everything I mounted the rail

 

[harro]

Gave the Bore a good cleanout of the grease / oil that new rifles come with .

Then mounted a Vortex 4-16 FFP scope .
This isn't going to be the final Scope for this rifle , but it would do for initial testing .
It sits in some Burris Z rings , the ones with the inserts .
The Vortex and rings came off my Tikka T1x rimfire which I haven't used for a while .

Next I added a Comb Cheek riser that I've owned for a while ( purchased off EBay )

 

[harro]

I'm having problems posting these pics , that's why I've made numerous posts .
If there's interest then let me know and I'll keep trying .

Ken

 

[Gary in MD]

Cool little project. What twist is the barrel and what bullets are you planning on shooting?
Let’s see some targets Mate!
Gary

 

[vonb]

Barrel looks to be 1-8 twist as said on the barrel.

 

[Bill K]

Looks like you are getting what you want and it does, in fact, look good. We love pictures and now we will look forward to the groups you shoot and show us.
Nice project and nice work, on your part. Again Thank you for sharing.

 

[K22]

Nice project. The Howa action have an excellent reputation.

I have a Weatherby Vanguard in 223 Rem with a 9" twist. The action is a Howa action. I like the three-position safety, the positive extraction system, and the metal magazine. The trigger is adequate for hunting, even precision varmint hunting. The factory stock was ok, but not great for precision shooting. Still the rifle shot 1 moa as advertised however with tailored reloads. Couldn't get it to shoot much better than this.

I had bought this rifle at a bargain price to rebuilt it with an aftermarket premium barrel and to restock it. My gunsmith recommended the Howa action as a good base for a rebuild precision varmint hunting rifle. However, with the component shortages in the US and seeing no relief in the near future, I've placed the project on hold. I'll probably sell the rifle since the near future is all I have at 75 so I can afford to wait out the supply chain correction or consume my limited reloading inventory on a "project". I have to save the inventory for varmint hunting and some limited practical range practice.

 

[harro]

I shot the rifle in that configuration with very poor results - 100mm - 125mm groups @ 100m with 4 different factory ammo loads.
I gave up quickly because something was very wrong

Heres the " Best "group I got.

I went home and started from scratch .
Took the scope off and checked all the screws on the base and rings .
Cleaned the barrel , no signs of major fowling , in fact it it cleaned up very quickly .
Checked the muzzle crown for damage - nothing obvious .
I rechecked the torque on the stocks action bolts .

So the next session was a bit of a nervous time .
First three shots went into about 125mm " F#*k "
I'd brought the original stock with me , so swapped stocks .
Next 3 shots about 90mm , so better but thats not good .

Tried another 3 different factory loads , still shooting like s#*t .
My thoughts went to " Well I've got one of those Dud rifles you here about "
I couldn't be bothered wasting more ammo .
The only thing I could try next was a different scope , but I didn't have one with me .
I wound the dials left and right and up and down , put three rounds in the mag and was about to shoot when I thought about the magnification ring .
I had been shooting on 16 power so turned it down to 4 power .
The next 3 rounds did this 24mm group .

The scope was bad

 

[harro]

More components started to arrive

Australian made Barrel Tuner

A barrel Tuner has been the main objective of this project from day one .
I wanted to see what is possible with factory ammo and a Tuner is the only way to tune the rifle/ammo combo .
A lot of the reason I purchased this particular Howa was because it came factory threaded and I couldn't find anything else threaded for that price with a good accuracy reviews and a lot of after market accessories .
The Tuner seems to be very well made , lets see if it works as good as it looks

It will be used as a Vehicle Rifle .
I hesitate to use the word Hunting because in reality it is Pest / Predator control .
It won't see a day of its life at a Gun Club .
The Scope problems I had earlier were sorted with a new Scope .
I chose it for it's simplicity / power range and more than anything Low Light performance .
Meopta 50mm scopes are about the best low light glass for the money scopes you can buy in my opinion
We never shoot more than 250m at night so adjustable turrets / Parralax etc just aren't needed and are actually a hinderance , under lights I have found 10 power about as high as I want to go because anything higher starts to become dim .

 

[harro]

Did some very basic testing/shooting

To start with all I was interested in knowing was did a change of Scope fix the accurracy problems I had before .
I bore sighted the rifle at 25m and sent a round down range .
It hit paper so I was off to a good start

Adjusted the scope to be closer to point of aim and moved back to 82m (about 90yrds ) , I know that sounds like a funny distance but I wanted to be in the shade , it's hot here

and real testing will be done later at a proper 100m .
For now it was just a matter of " Is this rifle a lemon or was it the scope " .
Now I have mounted a Barrel Tuner on the rifle and set it to zero on the dial for the first shots .
All of my measurements are center to center with a tape measure so please forgive me if its not to the nearest 0.1mm
First three round group using Winchester 55gn .

To say I was happy is an understatement , after the 3-4 inch groups I was getting before I thanked Jesus and anyone else who might of been listening ..
Now a 26mm group at 90yrds isn't amazing but at least it is something to work with .

I didn't have much time so this session I just used the Winchester ammo and I didn't try any other loads .
Buttt..... the Barrel Tuner was calling me , so I quickly shot some more 3 shot groups changing the settings 1 increment at a time . This was very unscientific testing and shouldn't be taken as " Real Results "

The changes I made to the tuner did change the group size and surprisingly or maybe disturbingly the " Point of Impact " a lot .

As you can see as the number on the dial went up the group size went down .
I'm not sure if that can all be attributed to the Tuner because I was feeling a lot more comfortable and less anxious and also getting used to the trigger .
On the topic of the Trigger - The factory Trigger was probably the heaviest I have encountered .
My Tikka's must have spoilt me but , it was bad .
I had a replacement spring coming in the post, but it hadn't arrived yet so after some YouTube searching I did the old cut one and a bit coils off the factory spring .
The result was a trigger that is probably a fraction light for my tastes but 300% better than it was before .

 

[NZ_Fclass]

It's a good project. Good choice of scope too.
Factory ammo. We all know it's failings, but I think you need to look at it a bit more objectively. Measure the chamber. Measure the ammo ( base to ogive) and determine which brand/bullet shoots within parameters. It is likely that your barrel is 1/8 twist, and likely to have a longer throat than older 223s, so while overall length is restricted by the magazine, bullet selection will play a major part in accuracy. I would start with the ADI loaded ammo ("Outback"?) which I believe shoots quite well for the Aussie Reviews guy on You Tube. You rifle should be happy with 77g bullets and some 55g will be jumping a long way - which you will only find by measurement. My experience with factory Howa's has been good - my Grendel shoots well, after I made the same trigger mod and changed the awful stock for an MDT.

 

[harro]

The 1.5 lb spring set arrived , so that was installed ( I'm actually getting really fast at pulling the tigger apart and putting it back together )
After doing some dry firing and checking that all is good and "SAFE" it seems OK but maybe not as crisp as I like , time will tell and it is a million times better than factory .

A muzzle brake arrived at the same time from the same seller on eBay , I got this for another rifle but thought I'd mount it up on the Howa for now .
I did this for two reasons , my research suggests that the added weight on the muzzle will help the Tuner and also even though the .223 doesn't have much recoil any reduction is welcome to ring out the best and most accurate results from ammo testing .
If it really makes a difference then it will stay .
I know the criticism of Brakes and the noise problem but honestly it doesn't worry me because I always wear ear protection when I'm shooting ( my hearing is already damaged and I need to protect what I have left ) I never shoot without it , even subsonic .22 rimfire . Also I almost always shoot alone so bystanders aren't a concern .
I purchased the cheapest brake available and it doesn't direct the gases backwards just straight out the sides which doesn't make it as efficient ( the .223 won't need much efficiency anyway ) but should reduce the noise back to the shooter a fraction compared to the brake on my 6.5 for example which is directional .

I had another rifle component coming that isn't necessary , but you only live once and this little experiment has really grabbed my interest so I want to give it the best chance possible to succeed .

 

[harro]

The final piece has arrived.

Bell and Carlson stock .

Early on I famously said in a post that even if the alloy bedding block Houge stock wasn't the best it would do , well ........... it doesn't cut the mustard I'm afraid .
It still flexes ( its much stiffer than the standard pillar bedded Houge that the rifle came with ) but not as good as I want .
So I'll admit that I wasted $345.00 and should have just spent more in the first place

I'll probably sell both the Houge's and try and recoup what I can
Anyway I have now bolted on everything that I can possibly think of

and its time to actually put this thing through it's paces .
Starting this weekend test will begin in a organised and systematic manner .
I'll probably test one ammo brand at a time and try to find the best Tuner setting and record it for future reference .
All along I wanted to experiment with the heavier projectiles so I'll start there I think .
All tests will be starting with a clean bore but 3 fouler shots before actual recording , all tests will be at 100m - 109.36 yards and the goal from the beginning was a true consistent below 25mm rifle/ factory ammo combo ( that is below MOA which has always been a standard ) , not just the best groups , but every group under 25mm .
That in my experience is a lot harder to achieve than most will admit , and although I'm sure there are factory rifles/ammo and shooters out there achieving that , it is rare because often a bad group is quietly/quickly ignored of hidden .I'll try to shoot in the early morning when it's calm to give each ammo the best chance .


Total $3378.70. Australian Dollars

If I sell the Houges then that will be deducted , but to be honest I've spent way more than my original budget ( this project has sort of run away ) and it's been an eye opener to be confronted with the reality of what my hobby costs .
I shudder to think and I won't be doing a talley up of my more expensive rifles .

 

[harro]

Cool little project. What twist is the barrel and what bullets are you planning on shooting?
Let’s see some targets Mate!
Gary

We don't have all the options here locally and shipping ammo from a big supplier isn't possible here so what you see in the local gunshop is what you get .
Here is a selection of what I have at the moment to start with .

 

[harro]

Barrel looks to be 1-8 twist as said on the barrel.

Correct 1-8 twist

 

[harro]

Looks like you are getting what you want and it does, in fact, look good. We love pictures and now we will look forward to the groups you shoot and show us.
Nice project and nice work, on your part. Again Thank you for sharing.

I'll post up results when I have tried a decent amount of ammo types .
I only shoot a box at a time early on a Sunday morning when it's calm , I have an area on the Property that is sheltered and I can get out to 200m there .

 

[harro]

Nice project. The Howa action have an excellent reputation.

I have a Weatherby Vanguard in 223 Rem with a 9" twist. The action is a Howa action. I like the three-position safety, the positive extraction system, and the metal magazine. The trigger is adequate for hunting, even precision varmint hunting. The factory stock was ok, but not great for precision shooting. Still the rifle shot 1 moa as advertised however with tailored reloads. Couldn't get it to shoot much better than this.

I had bought this rifle at a bargain price to rebuilt it with an aftermarket premium barrel and to restock it. My gunsmith recommended the Howa action as a good base for a rebuild precision varmint hunting rifle. However, with the component shortages in the US and seeing no relief in the near future, I've placed the project on hold. I'll probably sell the rifle since the near future is all I have at 75 so I can afford to wait out the supply chain correction or consume my limited reloading inventory on a "project". I have to save the inventory for varmint hunting and some limited practical range practice.

I must admit the Scope problem took a bit of the shine off my purchase and inserted some doubt into my brain .
The Vortex is the second one which I have had problems with now and I won't be buying another .
I'm sure the higher models are good but in the Diamond grade and below your taking your chances .
I'll send it back under warranty , but if its replaced or fixed it will be getting sold .

 

[Ned Ludd]

You're getting there! Looking forward to more updates as you test the final(?) setup.

I can understand the disappointment regarding the Hogue alloy replacement stock. I'm sure the scope issues were even more disconcerting. Nonetheless, those issues are behind you, so don't let them cast a negative light on the rifle setup in its current state; it may surprise you.

Obviously when using factory ammo, you have to find by testing at least one type/brand it likes, rather adjusting the loaded rounds to fit the rifle itself. That might be more difficult and expensive in the current times, but keep going, you'll find something it likes. I've even seen a dramatic difference in precision in the same rifle with commercial ammunition from two different manufacturers that used the exact same bullet with approximately the same muzzle velocity. Presumably it may have been a difference in seating depth, but at the time I was just happy I had found one that worked, so I didn't check too closely into the rounds from the brand that shot poorly. Stay the course and I'm sure you'll find suitable ammo for it. Thanks for sharing the story!