Outta Varget Blues

[Meyersmp]

Current FTR champion used N150 with 200.20x. I know runner up used N140, but not sure what bullet. I've had good luck with N140 in mid range with Berger 155 hybrids. I'm almost out of varget and will be changing to N140 with 185 juggernauts for long range soon. Keith Glasscock has YouTube video about using N140 with Juggernauts to win an F open match.

 

[Lance21]

I've never used any VV powders. I have a 22 bra that I'm gonna try 85.5s in, my son runs a 6 bra/107 smk. Which VV powder would likely work for both cartridges? Which is most temp stable? Absolute top speed not a necessity.

 

[newbieshooter]

available this morning - but not sure who's going to order just one pound....

Hodgdon Varget Smokeless Gun Powder 1 lb

Hodgdon Powder offers the largest selection of quality smokeless propellants for any reloading application. The first of Hodgdon's revolutionary Extreme...

www.midwayusa.com

 

[Laurie]

Now that's what I'm talking about. There are alternatives.

I'm currently doing range tests on H4895/VarGet alternatives, neither of which can be imported into Europe any more. Using a 223 custom F-Class rifle and 77gn SMKs, I've identified 27 possible alternatives to this pair. Four are Europe-only powders leaving 23 re this topic. There are eight US available ball-types and 15 US available extruded / tubular grades. However, you have powders that we don't from IMR (other than the Endurons), older Hodgdon and Winchester ball grades, and Western/Accurate powders.

Not only are there alternatives, but there are LOTS of them. The issue seems rather to be which of them are in stock!

Of those we have, my favoured replacements for VarGet are:

Viht N140, 540, N150 (but not in 223 with bullets lighter than 90gn), N550.
Lovex S-062 (Shooters World 'Precision'). A bit slower burning than VarGet.
Alliant Re15 / Norma 203-B (same thing). Temperature affected though in North American environments.

I won't get around to the ball types for some months, but Ramshot TAC is widely used here as a VarGet replacement.

Re TS 15.5 is (literally) coming to us, but has yet to reach our outlets.

IMR-4166 Enduron is a viable H4895 replacement and gives excellent performance in terms of ES/SD and groups, but IME pressures out at lower MVs than either H4895 or VarGet. I've seen a few similar comments on this forum. Hodgdon aside, I've yet to find a single pressure-tested data source for this powder in 223, although manuals have plenty for it in larger case cartridges such as 308 Win and 30-06.

 

[Laurie]

I'm almost out of varget and will be changing to N140 with 185 juggernauts for long range soon.

Although N140 is perfectly viable in 308 with 185s, >90% of 308 F/TR shooters here (UK) will use N150 with this bullet weight in Lapua 'Palma' SP 308 brass. We have a lot of experience with this pair going back over 20+ years. IME, N150 is superior to N140 in SP cases with this bullet, but the latter may give better performance in standard LP versions.

 

[CChastain]

I use Palma brass and 8 lbs of N150 so I will probably give that a try . Thanks again for the replies .
Chris

 

[whatsupdoc]

What no musicians here??

Thread title should be a song.

"Momma just got some shoes but I got the outa varget blues"

 

[TheOtherZilla]

If you were closer I have 3-4 bottles here I never use.. But Georgia is a looong way from here.

 

[Pawnee Bill]

There's always IMR 3031 for the 308.

 

[CChastain]

No longer singing the blues ! LGS had 8lb jugs of Varget today at a reasonable 350 . Been shooting N150 for a few weeks with decent results but Varget is better in this rifle .

 

[HardwoodPro]

4064 is great with bullets up to 185gr! It is my go to powder for 178amax, 175smk and 185 Berger’s

N140 and rl15 are also top notch in a .308 from my exp

 

[Dave M.]

Almost out of Varget and a new to me FTR rifle on the way . What's another good powder for 185 Juggs in a 308 ?

I’d look at RL-15,RL-16, and N140

 

[Old Navy]

No longer singing the blues ! LGS had 8lb jugs of Varget today at a reasonable 350 . Been shooting N150 for a few weeks with decent results but Varget is better in this rifle .

That is a good sign.

 

[Lone Hunter]

I use H4895 with Berger 185 Juggs and 175 SMK in my FTR rifle. Has a Broughton 11.25 twist and is very accurate. Glad you found the Varget. H4895 did better in my rifle than Varget. I quit shooting Varget because of it being so hard to find for my other rifles.

 

[jelenko]

reasonable 350

How times have changed!

 

[Ray123]

I have about 11 pounds of Varget, but it's not my go to powder anymore, and hasn't been for some time....it seems dated, old hat.
Other powders give higher velocities and as good or better accuracy. So I use it as a comparison load, if something works as well or better accuracy and much better velocities...why use Varget? H4350 is in the same boat. So I have a lifetime supply of Varget and H4350, I turned them down when they were cheap..walk right by if I see them on the shelf..."We got Varget in, we got Varget in,"... no thanks! I quit buying it and H4350 at $26 for a 1 pound jug locally. Used to buy it for $112 for 8 lbs and fired 17,000 rds of 308 match loads, all Lapua bullets, Lapua brass, Fed 210 M primers. Been there 20 plus years ago, and don't miss Varget, but it would be nice to have all powders available for those who want to use them. Large variety, low prices, shelves full, so many choices,...that's the American Way!

 

[miningshawn]

No one else has said it, so I will.

CFE223
This powder is easy to find. I have had great success with it, and I haven't had any problems yet. It has the right burn rate, it meters like water, and I haven't seen any huge temperature sensitivity like other ball powders.
It also helps that you can fit it in the case. I like Rl15 and Varget, but it almost always is a compressed load. CFE223 fits in the case with room to spare.
I have a barrel or two that loved to mine copper. This powder certainly took care of that.
Did I mention it's a lot easier to find? It meters so well that all of the grain counting of H4895, RL15, and Varget goes away. No more overthrows! It's worth a try.
Also great for heavy 223 loads.

 

[SFGUY]

In addition to Varget, Berger lists H4895, IMR-4064, AA-2460, Ramshot TAC, IMR-4895, Norma 203B, RL-15, RL-17, H414, N550, and Win 760.

Shooters World "Precision" is close enough to Varget I use the same load. It chronographs within 20 fps ( lower) on my Shotmarker.

 

[FNSafari]

Varget is always my go too for .223.

Midway had it in stock yesterday morning. I didn't order any because I have plenty, but my shooting buddy did right after I let him know.

Wow, Midway $40 more on most 8 pounders than PV.