22-250 question

[aslap]

First time post here, I think.

I have a 22-250 that was built 50 years ago on a Vz-24 rifle my Dad brought back from WW2. I had it made with a sporter barrel and shot it a lot mainly with hot loads at targets and varmints. I put it away many years ago and sort of forgot about it.

7 years ago I pulled it out of the closet to shoot it. I found out why I had put it away. The barrel was shot out with firecracking and worn out throat and just general not so good looking. I had it rebarrelled by ER Shaw (I live right near them) and started shooting it. The results were not very good either with factory ammo or my handloads which were mainly 55 gr Amax and Varget. I would up putting 120 rounds through the new barrel and put it away again.

I had the urge to shoot it again and started by making up a dummy round (two of them, actually) to get the ogive to land distance. Both of my dummies came back at 2.088” using a 55 gr, FMJ bullet that I have a bunch of. OAL to the bullet tip is 2.415”.

I also have a handful of Hornady Superformance ammo that I was going to shoot to get some kind of benchmark on performance. Measuring the Hornady ogive dimension gave me 1.933”. So that would put the Hornady ammo 0.155” off the lands. OAL to the bullet tip on these is 2.338”

This sounds to me like way too much distance. I’ve always been aware that the jump distance can be a big deal in accuracy and this jump seems almost Olympian in comparison to what I see being used as jump distances for any round.

Any thoughts on this? I went through my notes from 7 years ago and it looks like I was seating my reloads at 0.01” off the lands and getting OK results but I never did really work through a complete load development process. The Varget is long gone (and I can’t find it anywhere) and I have some H380; CCI LR 200 primers; the 55 gr FMJ bullets; and a fair amount of Hornady brass to work with.

Any thoughts on the jump distance for the Hornady ammo would be appreciated.

Tony

 

[ballisticxlr]

So far in my graphs from accumulated data: Little bullets with lead cores like varmint bullets seem to like touching to .040 and the smaller they are the less they like to jump. Medium bullets like big game pills with lead cores up to .338" seem to like modest jumps in the .040-.080 range. Big bullets with lead cores like .510" 750gr seem to want insane jumps of .300" or more. I don't have enough data on monometal bullets to draw a useful trend line and your mileage may vary. If you can get a .040" jump, that seems like a decent place to start.

 

[redrockranger]

Perhaps it's time for a new barrel. The 22-250 is a barrel burner. 22 BR Norma / Lapua would be a fine alternative.


UP

 

[aslap]

Ballistic - so you would agree that the 0.155" jump I'm seeing is not going to be a good thing, right? I could not even shoot the Hornady ammo I have and just start reloading. My bullets do have lead cores.

Red - this is a new barrel. Only 137 rounds down it so far. My old sporter barrel was, indeed, kicked in the behind pretty hard. I really didn't know what I was doing when I was shooting it. I'd shoot like crazy and the barrel would sizzle spit. Not real smart, I know.

Thanks for the advice!

Tony

 

[DGP4]

I don't know the twist on your barrel but you may want to try different bullet profiles. I always try to scrounge a few different bullets with a new barrel to test. A friend just got a new 22-250 and I gave him several bullets in the 40-53 grain range to test. Some bullets like a big jump while others don't.

 

[pwdrbrn]

could be the fmj bullets just aren't up to the task of decent accuracy. maybe try quality varmint style projectiles? just a thought, Tom.

 

[aslap]

Pedro- the question is concerning the huge 0.155” jump I measure with the Hornady ammo. I’m just trying to figure out if that big of a jump is a problem. I’ve never tried these FMJ bullets before. My work 7 years ago was with VMax and AMax bullets.

DG- 1:12 twist.

All good advice but what do you think about the huge jump if I shoot the Hornady ammo? I guess I can just shoot it and see what happens but I’m wondering if the chamber was cut too deep.

Tont

 

[DGP4]

I'd shoot some of the Hornady ammo to see if it works. In any event you'll need the brass for reloading anyway. The 50 gr. Hornady A-Max bullets have been shooting well in my .223 with a 1:12 twist and I gave my friend some A-Max 40 grainers to begin his quest with the 22-250

 

[457ciSBC]

In one of two 22-250’s; I burned out one gun in less than 900 rounds, courtesy of excessive load development, Varget,N550 and the joy of seeing very high numbers on a chronograph.The burned out 1-14 twist Rem VS, the only decently stable heavier bullet that I could shoot was the 57 grain Calhoun. Looking at my data book for the 57gr/N550 load, I see a group size variance of as much as .710 over range of .080 in seating depth. The closer toward what used to be lands, the better the groups. However, I found adequate accuracy with a molycoated 52 gr Berger which was seated with an enormous amount of jump.

You are at the mercy your gun and your mileage may vary, shoot the factory ammo and see what happens…..let the gun tell you.

 

[ballisticxlr]

Yeah, I'd predict terrible grouping from it with that long of a leap.

 

[snert]

Find some Sierra or Speer semi-spitzers...or spitzer bullets at 55 grains. seat them way out. See what happens with H380 between 36-37 grains.

 

[aslap]

I’ll shoot the Hornady and report back. My guess would be poor groups but we’ll see.

427 - great minds think alike. I wanted as far over 4000 FPS as I could go! Even with a 14 twist, I saw a couple of light bullets go poof in mid flight. My little sporter contour barrel was really abused.

snert - I was going to start with the 36 grain load and go to 38 with the 380. The starting seating plan was to do 0.01” off the lands to start and go from there.

Great advice! Thank you all!

Tony

 

[justinp61]

Have you pulled one of the bullets from the Superformance ammo to actually use it to check the distance to the lands? If not the distance may be different.

I've been working on a load for my new 22-250 build off and on this summer. The rifle is a LH Savage mdl 11 action with a Shilen SS Select match with a 12 twist. It's about 9 1/2 pounds with scope. I already have a Savage mdl 12 that weighs 11 1/2 pounds. The new rifle will be a carry around coyote/groundhog gun.

The model 12 likes Sierra 55gr Gamekings (1365) and I have plenty so that's what I'm using in the new rifle. What I've found is that the new rifle likes them either .025" off the lands or .090"ish off. With the bullet at .025" of the lands there is only .110" bearing surface of the bullet in the case and I'm worried about the bullet dislodging or moving in the case. I still have a little testing to do but if it shoots like it at .085-.095" off as did in preliminary testing that's where I'll load it.

 

[Doug Beach]

There’s no direct relationship between long jumps, and poor accuracy. Service rifle shooters tend to have long free bores to shoot 80+ grain bullets, but shoot mag length ammo at short range. Some of those jumps are looonnnggg. Accuracy remains very high.

 

[biggun2869]

I'm not a fan of H-380 but the velocities that snert gives out are right (H-380 might work for you, it just didn't for me, I am personally a IMR 4064 fan). In my opinion you should give the rifle a chance before making a change. You might find a super sweet spot that really works

 

[biggun2869]

Agree w/Doug but it is up to the rifle to tell you what it likes.

 

[aslap]

Ok. I have the Evel Knievel Snake River canyon jumping Hornady rounds and 15 reloads. All the reloads are 0.020” off the lands except for one that I seated deeper at 0.040” off. All with H380. 5 at 36 grains; 5 at 37 grains; and 5 at 38 grains. Probably get out on Tuesday try them out.

Tony

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

I have had several 22-250's really like 55 gr BT, 2.375 coal with Varget. Can substitute 50 gr max seated to the same ogive length and use H4895.

 

[aslap]

It’s difficult to find any reloading components here in Western PA. I found a place about 30 miles away that had stuff but not like it was a few years back. I wanted to get some Varget or 4895 but neither were available. My understanding is that a lot of powder comes out of Australia and they are even worse than things here in terms of the flu restrictions.

Tony

 

[jepp2]

I had it rebarrelled by ER Shaw

What freebore and twist did you have them go with? Without knowing more, my guess is they went with a fast twist for a 22-250 since the heavy bullets are all the rage now, and a lot of freebore to suit them.

FMJ bullet that I have a bunch of

I've never gotten consistent accuracy from using FMJ bullets in any of my rifle. And the Hornady 55 gr spitzer bullets are nearly as bad. Try some bullets known for excellent accuracy before you declare the barrel can't shoot.