Help me choose a elk rifle!

[std7mag]

Yup, it's after the camera gets put away that the real work starts!
I'm checking on states that will allow 3 of us to hunt muleys as well as elk.
Bulls are always nice, but lets face it, it all looks the same in freezer wrap.
And hopefully it's easier to find someplace to get mule deer tags and cow elk tags together.

 

[INTJ]

The sample of shooters you're writing about a 1 1/100th of 1% of the hunters. You missed a point or two in your field instructions. Range all the time. Be able to do all the above in 10 seconds or under.

I will say this the shooters you write about are 99.9% of the shooters who won't take a bad shot. That's a good thing.

I said nothing about being only at the range, and my description of a snap shot is the quickest way to shoot. Those of us who learned to hunt Blacktail bucks in semi-open timber learned how to shoot quickly because those deer don't often stand around like your typical Whitetail. What I posted works. I know this from many years of not just my own personal experience, but the experience of a lot others as well.

I learned a long time ago that there are MANY methods to finding success in most any endeavor. The common denominator is the approach. As an adult, I have flown jets, raced cars, played lead trumpet, shot competitively, hunted, flyfished, etc. I have achieved success when I was disciplined, deliberate, thoughtful, and consistent in how I approached those activities. I see that same approach in nearly everyone who finds success, even though their specific methods vary.

So whether someone likes to hunt with a recurve bow, traditional black powder firearms, handguns, lever actions, or the most up to date equipment with a big magnum at long range is irrelevant. What is important is how they approach what they do. That is why I do not condemn those who choose to do things differently that I.

 

[C.E.Smith043]

Nosler Partitions. I would use the 30-06

^^^^ This all the way

 

[AckleymanII]

I killed almost a dozen with a 7x57 in a Savage 110, 140g Sierra flat base, was dumb in my youth. Then went to the 7 Mag with the new 140g ballistic tips, they flopped hard and fast on broad side shots.

Then went to a 243 Win with 100g Partitions on cows.

We shot a lot all year long, jack rabbits, coyotes, doves galore in season. I picked my shots.

If I were determined to be able to take quartering shots, 7 Mag, 7 STW, 28 nosler with 175g Sierra or Partition, 300's with 180-200g partitions. I had a back up, Weatherby Mark 5 in 300 Weatherby that was very accurate with 180g Factory ammo at 3300, that I only shot coyotes with.

We used a product called Forget The Wind, and nothing from Coyotes to long nose does ever smelled us.

 

[Liven The Dream]

Jack O , had it right years ago .270 Winchester.
Very versatile 130 gr. Deer etc . 150 Elk .
I hunted a fare amount out West . Nothing was lost to my .270

 

[ebb]

Take the RUM, even if it has to go on a diet.

 

[JimT]

I killed almost a dozen with a 7x57 in a Savage 110, 140g Sierra flat base, was dumb in my youth. Then went to the 7 Mag with the new 140g ballistic tips, they flopped hard and fast on broad side shots.

Then went to a 243 Win with 100g Partitions on cows.

We shot a lot all year long, jack rabbits, coyotes, doves galore in season. I picked my shots.

If I were determined to be able to take quartering shots, 7 Mag, 7 STW, 28 nosler with 175g Sierra or Partition, 300's with 180-200g partitions. I had a back up, Weatherby Mark 5 in 300 Weatherby that was very accurate with 180g Factory ammo at 3300, that I only shot coyotes with.

We used a product called Forget The Wind, and nothing from Coyotes to long nose does ever smelled us.

Not Alexander Graham:

Bell recorded all of his kills and shots fired. It was a business to him, not pleasure, and he needed to record expenditures.

He shot exactly 1,011 elephants; about 800 of them were shot with Rigby-made 7x57mm (.275 Rigby) rifles and round nose 173 grain military ammo.

 

[David Milisock]

Not Alexander Graham:

Bell recorded all of his kills and shots fired. It was a business to him, not pleasure, and he needed to record expenditures.

He shot exactly 1,011 elephants; about 800 of them were shot with Rigby-made 7x57mm (.275 Rigby) rifles and round nose 173 grain military ammo.

I've experimented with lots of calibers and I'll give credit to the development of many great cartridges available today to bench rest shooters.

With that said as my experiance increased I found an affection for the great designs of the past. The 30-06 is great as are most cartridges designed from that parent, especially the 35 Whelen, 25-06, 270 and 280 Remington to mention a few. The 280 is one of the best 7MM cartridges vailable and the 25-06 is in a class of its own.

The 57MM length cartridges are superior to many, the 8MM, 7MM, 6MM Remington to mention a few. The 7X57 is one of the very best 7MM cartridges available and the 6MM Remington is in a class by itself.

In my opinion there cannot be enough good said about the 6.5X55.

The 308 and the cartridges made from that parent are very good for shorter barreld field rifles. The 243, 7MM 08 and the 260 Remington are great examples.

Today in my opinion we see the best designed cartridges as having less case capacity. The 6.5 Grendel while in my opinion not the best choice for in close rapid fire it is in the hands of a trained rifleman a viable hunting cartridge. The newer 6MM ARC while superior to the 5.56 NATO in close and out far is another viable one rifle solution for hunting and defense in the hands of those trained.

Not that I don't see magnums as having a place they do but in my opinion a far lesser place than in the public perception. I built a 450 because at one time my friends son licensed me to provide support for his guide business when he needed a rifleman and hitting hard in close was the requirement.

I find the experience in the field relaxing, I don't find it satisfying to take game at extended ranges and Bells historic writings prove you don't need magnums to take big game nor an animal the weight of your wife.

 

[tovaert]

My dad used a model 70 extreme weather stainless in 270 WSM. I had a muzzle brake installed to reduce the recoil (it's a very light rifle), Keystone one-piece scope mount, and Nikon FFP scope. The local guys he hunts with in ID and WY like the 270 and 270 WSM.

 

[280AIDave]

Trade the 270 for a 280 AI! The 270 like a 243 will work but most guides and outfitters will tell you two holes to bleed from are best and a good many will tell you 30 cal minimums is what they like. The 150 mono metals in 7mm have been getting good reviews and the time tested 160 Partition from a 280 AI at 3,000fps is a thing of wonder that generally creates two holes.
The velocity of an '06 with 180's has always caused me concern, however when you look at trajectories its not a big difference from a 300 mag. If you have a '06 you probably have what you need.

 

[David Milisock]

Trade the 270 for a 280 AI! The 270 like a 243 will work but most guides and outfitters will tell you two holes to bleed from are best and a good many will tell you 30 cal minimums is what they like. The 150 mono metals in 7mm have been getting good reviews and the time tested 160 Partition from a 280 AI at 3,000fps is a thing of wonder that generally creates two holes.
The velocity of an '06 with 180's has always caused me concern, however when you look at trajectories its not a big difference from a 300 mag. If you have a '06 you probably have what you need.

I believe Hornady makes a super performance 180 grain in 06. I've found with a 26" barrel and max loads (60,000 +) PSI that the 180 and 200 grain out of the old girl works real well.

I understand why SAAMI keeps the 06 loaded low but if you've got a modern rifle loading stiff makes sense. I have custom rifles built on 03 actions that are 64,000 PSI cartridges.

 

[mateofeo85]

I’ve taken two New Mexico elk over the past two years with a Bergara B-14 Hunter in 30-06. 2019 elk taken at 395 yards with Federal 180gr Power Shok; 2020 elk takt about 95 yards, same bullet.

That said; I am NOT happy with the accuracy I’ve seen with that bullet. As such, I’ve started load development using Barnes 165gr TTSX over H4350. I previously tried Hornady’s 180gr GMX and was not impressed with the accuracy. Currently preparing OCW tests for the Barnes 165, in the 2,880-2,950 fps range. Went to a lighter mono bullet to maximize velocity and weight retention.

That said, I think you’ll do just fine with 30-06 if that’s what you choose.

 

[David Milisock]

I’ve taken two New Mexico elk over the past two years with a Bergara B-14 Hunter in 30-06. 2019 elk taken at 395 yards with Federal 180gr Power Shok; 2020 elk takt about 95 yards, same bullet.

That said; I am NOT happy with the accuracy I’ve seen with that bullet. As such, I’ve started load development using Barnes 165gr TTSX over H4350. I previously tried Hornady’s 180gr GMX and was not impressed with the accuracy. Currently preparing OCW tests for the Barnes 165, in the 2,880-2,950 fps range. Went to a lighter mono bullet to maximize velocity and weight retention.

That said, I think you’ll do just fine with 30-06 if that’s what you choose.

What kind of accuracy were you getting that was unsatisfactory?

 

[mateofeo85]

What kind of accuracy were you getting that was unsatisfactory?

I couldn’t even shoot 2 moa to save my life. Bergara’s are supposed to be 1moa barrels. Rounds all over the place. I shot groups in 40-60 degree weather, then again in 80-100 degree weather. Nothing gave.

I moved on to the Hornady GMX and saw minimal improvement. Played with bullet jump and a range of charges to no avail. Then I shot some factory 150gr Federal Fusion, just to try a lighter bullet. It improved to about 1.5 moa. At that point, I decided to try a lighter bullet than the 180 GMX, thus landing on the 165 TTSX. Right off the bat I’m back to a 1moa range and moving to OCW tests next time I’m out.

I’d be terribly disappointed to find out they don’t shoot. I know it’s not a bench gun where I can otherwise regularly achieve 1/2-3/4 moa, but I’m chasing that 1moa or better at this point just to match the manufacturers advertised accuracy. I’m not going to jump the gun onto Bergara and say it’s a junk barrel quite yet, but if I can’t get these TTSX to shoot, I may return scratching my head where to go next haha

 

[Bc'z]

I couldn’t even shoot 2 moa to save my life. Bergara’s are supposed to be 1moa barrels. Rounds all over the place. I shot groups in 40-60 degree weather, then again in 80-100 degree weather. Nothing gave.

I moved on to the Hornady GMX and saw minimal improvement. Played with bullet jump and a range of charges to no avail. Then I shot some factory 150gr Federal Fusion, just to try a lighter bullet. It improved to about 1.5 moa. At that point, I decided to try a lighter bullet than the 180 GMX, thus landing on the 165 TTSX. Right off the bat I’m back to a 1moa range and moving to OCW tests next time I’m out.

I’d be terribly disappointed to find out they don’t shoot. I know it’s not a bench gun where I can otherwise regularly achieve 1/2-3/4 moa, but I’m chasing that 1moa or better at this point just to match the manufacturers advertised accuracy. I’m not going to jump the gun onto Bergara and say it’s a junk barrel quite yet, but if I can’t get these TTSX to shoot, I may return scratching my head where to go next haha

What's your barrel length?
My buddies Tika 06' with a 20" barrel likes H414 165gr partition
My Remington 06' likes H4350 180gr partition 24" barrel.
His is sub .5 moa, mine is under .3, for 3 shots @ 100.

 

[mateofeo85]

What's your barrel length?
My buddies Tika 06' with a 20" barrel likes H414 165gr partition
My Remington 06' likes H4350 180gr partition 24" barrel.
His is sub .5 moa, mine is under .3, for 3 shots @ 100.

24” OEM barrel; 1:10 twist. Not quite sure exactly what Bergara calls the profile; somewhere between a featherweight sported and a varmint profile; call it a “light varmint profile”.
I’m half tempted to call them up and see if they’ll take it in for inspection.

 

[Bc'z]

24” OEM barrel; 1:10 twist. Not quite sure exactly what Bergara calls the profile; somewhere between a featherweight sported and a varmint profile; call it a “light varmint profile”.
I’m half tempted to call them up and see if they’ll take it in for inspection.

Have you double checked tourqe on fasteners including scope?

 

[std7mag]

I can't remember where i read it, but if your having issues with mono's, try a crimp.
I've mentioned it to several others & they have found it really helped.

Theory is since the mono's need a running start to help imprint the rifling on them, the crimp helps keep them seated for that fraction of a second to allow pressure to build.

Worth a try.

 

[David Milisock]

I couldn’t even shoot 2 moa to save my life. Bergara’s are supposed to be 1moa barrels. Rounds all over the place. I shot groups in 40-60 degree weather, then again in 80-100 degree weather. Nothing gave.

I moved on to the Hornady GMX and saw minimal improvement. Played with bullet jump and a range of charges to no avail. Then I shot some factory 150gr Federal Fusion, just to try a lighter bullet. It improved to about 1.5 moa. At that point, I decided to try a lighter bullet than the 180 GMX, thus landing on the 165 TTSX. Right off the bat I’m back to a 1moa range and moving to OCW tests next time I’m out.

I’d be terribly disappointed to find out they don’t shoot. I know it’s not a bench gun where I can otherwise regularly achieve 1/2-3/4 moa, but I’m chasing that 1moa or better at this point just to match the manufacturers advertised accuracy. I’m not going to jump the gun onto Bergara and say it’s a junk barrel quite yet, but if I can’t get these TTSX to shoot, I may return scratching my head where to go next haha

Wow, disappointing. Asking the obvious, the bedding is ok, the throat is cut properly? It does seem that you're working that angle.

What powders have, you tried?

 

[mateofeo85]

Have you double checked tourqe on fasteners including scope?

Yessir. Re-mounted base and rings, and torqued to spec using Wheeler torque driver. Tried two different scopes; Vortex Viper PST 4-16x50 and Leupold Mark 4 LR/T 3.5-10x40. That's where I ruled out optic-related issues.