School me on Warne/Talley/Kimber bases&rings

[PBking51]

I posted this in the optics forum but since I am considering these for a hunting rifle I figure I can get some love here too.

I have felt a little embarrassed to ask this question but I've been holding out on asking for about 5 years and now that I received a bunch of talley/warne/kimber bases and rings I need to figure this out...

Here goes...Can someone please explain the idea of these bases and rings? Pros, cons, philosophy of used? I don't mean the one piece ultra light (Gawd ugly imho) aluminum rings, rather the grooved bases and vertically split rings.

Picture added for clarification

I thought it was a quick detach system but I have rings that look like they are not meant to come off. No levers just a screw. They look like minimum material is used on the bases so I imagine there is some weight savings.

Are these used just for more svelt looks over the Redfield and picatinny styles? Is the idea the same as the rail on a tikka or sako?

I know someone has some pearls of knowledge for me and I welcome all information.

Lastly, are these installed so the stop is towards the rear of the rifle on each base and the ring buts up against the stop? Pics would also be appreciated

 

[std7mag]

If your talking a one piece picitinny(or Weaver) type base with the slots, the piece of the ring that goes into the slot should be pushed forwards, towards the muzzle of the gun.
I have a set of the Warne rings. Good quality, but a PITA to install.
I like the Vortex Viper rings, but i hear they were discontinued.
Looking at a set of EGW Keystone rings. But they look really bulky.

 

[PBking51]

I guess what I am referring to are the non slotted 2 piece bases that have what looks like an 11mm rail

 

[Scott Parten]

If those are talley rings in the picture they look like screw locks and are good rings. I have them on my hunting rifles with two piece bases. Slide them towards the front of the slot and lock them down. You can take them on and off with minimal zero shift.

 

[Adam in WI]

Them gawd ugly lightweight Talley's are about the best mounts you can put on a hunting rifle IMHO.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

None of them. Seekins gets my vote for a two piece ring set

 

[PBking51]

I'm not asking for a what ring does everyone like. I am just confused to what the selling point was and reasons why this style has affection from some hunters

 

[Kracken McGraw]

It’s because Talley sells a top quality proven product for a long time.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

I'm not asking for a what ring does everyone like. I am just confused to what the selling point was and reasons why this style has affection from some hunters

Warne are the worst design and I absolutely hate them. Mounting a scope sideways is the stupidest idea I have ever seen. Any why is the recoil lug separate? That can only cause trouble. Just a horrible design all around.

Talley has been around forever and is good enough for most “Joe-Blows” hunting from blinds and tree stands but not the toughest rings for standing up to heavy abuse by any means .

Didn’t know Kimber made rings. Will have to research them.

I think people like and use those rings because of price point. Or probably never hunted in rough mountain country and never intend to so they don’t need anything tougher. Or maybe just because they don’t know any better.

 

[PBking51]

Warne are the worst design and I absolutely hate them. Mounting a scope sideways is the stupidest idea I have ever seen. Any why is the recoil lug separate? That can only cause trouble. Just a horrible design all around.

Talley has been around forever and is good enough for most “Joe-Blows” but not the toughest rings for standing up to abuse by any means . I never use them either.

Didn’t know Kimber made rings. Will have to research them.

Evidently Jack warne was at the original Kimber (of Oregon) and they contracted with leupold to make these rings based off of a guy named Brownell. At the time kimber had produced small stuff like 22 hornet and 22 lr and on their receivers they had grooves similar to a standard 22 cals dovetail machined in the receiver in addition to offering receivers that were d&tied. Then kimber went bankrupt, warne started warne and somewhere Talley happened and made similar rings. I think the lugs ln the bases are more of a "stop" to aid in taking the scope off and then being able to replace without any major shift in zero. I do like that there are only 2 screws to tighten and it's my understanding once you have the scope in there and on the rail, you tighten the bottom screw first while the top is loose and then instead of 4 or 8 screws to tighten you have 1 per ring which would help scope not to be canted.

At this point I am thinking it's more of a classic appearance for elegant rifles than a major feet of engineering. I do think the effort is novel in the verticle split design.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Evidently Jack warne was at the original Kimber (of Oregon) and they contracted with leupold to make these rings based off of a guy named Brownell. At the time kimber had produced small stuff like 22 hornet and 22 lr and on their receivers they had grooves similar to a standard 22 cals dovetail machined in the receiver in addition to offering receivers that were d&tied. Then kimber went bankrupt, warne started warne and somewhere Talley happened and made similar rings. I think the lugs ln the bases are more of a "stop" to aid in taking the scope off and then being able to replace without any major shift in zero. I do like that there are only 2 screws to tighten and it's my understanding once you have the scope in there and on the rail, you tighten the bottom screw first while the top is loose and then instead of 4 or 8 screws to tighten you have 1 per ring which would help scope not to be canted.

At this point I am thinking it's more of a classic appearance for elegant rifles than a major feet of engineering. I do think the effort is novel in the verticle split design.

Doesn’t matter how you mount warne rings, they are a total pain in the ass. And for those of us that dial turrets for long range shooting, vertical split rings are the very last thing you would ever want

 

[K22]

Talley one piece for hunting - extremely durable - downside - you can't adjust so that the scope turrents are centered when mounted and bore sighted like you can with a Leupold rear adjusting mount. This may be an issue for long range precision shooters - check with them.

But the durability of the Talley Mounts for rough field use out weighs the aforementioned disadvantage for me.

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

Talley lightweights for my hunting rifles. If you choose the base/ring height carefully you can get the scope down low, which makes the rifle quick to point.

These are Talley lightweights with the low (0.400") base/ring on a Kelbly Atlas Tactical, 40mm objective, Krieger #5 contour.

 

[JimT]

Warne are the worst design and I absolutely hate them. Mounting a scope sideways is the stupidest idea I have ever seen. Any why is the recoil lug separate? That can only cause trouble. Just a horrible design all around.

Talley has been around forever and is good enough for most “Joe-Blows” hunting from blinds and tree stands but not the toughest rings for standing up to heavy abuse by any means .

Didn’t know Kimber made rings. Will have to research them.

I think people like and use those rings because of price point. Or probably never hunted in rough mountain country and never intend to so they don’t need anything tougher. Or maybe just because they don’t know any better.

I have relied on advice from knowledgeable professionals like this guy to equip all my rifles with Talley rings. Not sure what you mean by “abuse,” but Talley rings will hold up long after your scope is trashed by “abuse.”

Scopes & Mounts | Jarrett Rifles

Next to your rifle purchase, your most important decision is choosing the correct scope. Our personal experience with scopes, plus extensive field input from our customer base, can help you make the right choice for this critical component of your rifle package. Recommend scopes include Zeiss...

www.jarrettrifles.com

 

[JimT]

I posted this in the optics forum but since I am considering these for a hunting rifle I figure I can get some love here too.

I have felt a little embarrassed to ask this question but I've been holding out on asking for about 5 years and now that I received a bunch of talley/warne/kimber bases and rings I need to figure this out...

Here goes...Can someone please explain the idea of these bases and rings? Pros, cons, philosophy of used? I don't mean the one piece ultra light (Gawd ugly imho) aluminum rings, rather the grooved bases and vertically split rings.

Picture added for clarification

I thought it was a quick detach system but I have rings that look like they are not meant to come off. No levers just a screw. They look like minimum material is used on the bases so I imagine there is some weight savings.

Are these used just for more svelt looks over the Redfield and picatinny styles? Is the idea the same as the rail on a tikka or sako?

I know someone has some pearls of knowledge for me and I welcome all information.

Lastly, are these installed so the stop is towards the rear of the rifle on each base and the ring buts up against the stop? Pics would also be appreciated

This video may answer some of your Talley questions.

 

[PBking51]

I have relied on advice from knowledgeable professionals like this guy to equip all my rifles with Talley rings. Not sure what you mean by “abuse,” but Talley rings will hold up long after your scope is trashed by “abuse.”

Scopes & Mounts | Jarrett Rifles

Next to your rifle purchase, your most important decision is choosing the correct scope. Our personal experience with scopes, plus extensive field input from our customer base, can help you make the right choice for this critical component of your rifle package. Recommend scopes include Zeiss...

www.jarrettrifles.com

So Jarret recommends these type of talley rings for the fact that you should have different scopes set up for long and short range versus using turrets to change elevation. And the way the stops on the bases work makes this feasible to quickly change scopes and eliminate internal error on the scope design?

I believe @Ledd Slinger was referring to the aluminum 1 piece mounts. I tend to agree with him in regards to heavy 300 win mag loads managed to loosen the ring screws for me with the generally accepted 18 ft pounds. What ended up happening was an almost microscopic crack in the aluminum

 

[JimT]

So Jarret recommends these type of talley rings for the fact that you should have different scopes set up for long and short range versus using turrets to change elevation. And the way the stops on the bases work makes this feasible to quickly change scopes and eliminate internal error on the scope design?

I believe @Ledd Slinger was referring to the aluminum 1 piece mounts. I tend to agree with him in regards to heavy 300 win mag loads managed to loosen the ring screws for me with the generally accepted 18 ft pounds. What ended up happening was an almost microscopic crack in the aluminum

I have no idea how you formulated your conclusion in your first paragraph from reading the link I posted.


What did Talley say? Where was the crack?

 

[PBking51]

I thought I clicked on the link and basically read that when you're on a high dollar hunt better to have a quick detach system instead of fiddling with adjustments or as a back up scope? They of course are referring to the original style.

Talley , in regards to the aluminum did replace the whole ring set. The crack occurred in the screw hole and didn't go right through the ring but it created enough gap where basically 1 screw was holding the left side of the rear ring in. I noticed this when my groups had no consistency

 

[Idaho-Lefty]

As a former Gunsmith and having mounted, MANY Scopes on some, Powerful Rifles,... I now use, Burris, STEEL,.. Zee Rings, LAPPED and Loctited on all 5 of, my Hunting Rifles from, .22-250 to .270 WSM !
Steel Rings, can be re-used and remounted,.. repeatedly, if desired !
Aluminum,.. NOT so, much ! Couple of Ounces, more weight,.. NO big, deal !!
Read the last Paragraph of PBking above, that's WHY,.. I DON'T use, Aluminum !!
Just DON'T,.. drop your Rifle !
PROTECT,.. IT !

 

[PBking51]

As a former Gunsmith,. I now use, Burris, STEEL,.. Zee Rings, LAPPED and Loctited on all 5 of, my Hunting Rifles from, .22-250 to .270 WSM ! Steel Rings, can be re-used and remounted,.. repeatedly !
Aluminum,.. NOT so, much ! Couple of Ounces, more weight,.. NO big, deal !!
Read the last Paragraph of PBking above, that's WHY,.. I DON'T use, Aluminum !!
And, just DON'T,.. drop your Rifle !
PROTECT,.. IT !

So the original talleys and actually the kimber rings I have are indeed all steel. Say what you will about a vertical split ring but on a classic wood and blued steel gun they do look great. From a practicality standpoint, after viewing @JimT 's video from talley, I would suffice to say that their argument for this style is both an easy solution to removing a scope during transportation so it doesn't get bumped out of its zero and also another way to skin a cat. Alot like the posi-lock on sako