22-250 Improved......Old school

[xswanted]

My dad and I were chatting the other day. He’s had more wildcats than he can remember.

He pulled out an old 22-250 Improved case he used to have a rifle for.

The case has basically no taper in it, measures .460 at the shoulder, has a 30 degree shoulder and is based off of standard 22-250 case.

Today, other than a shorter neck this is basically a 22 Creedmoor.

Those of you that have been around the wildcat block once or twice.......any idea which version of the 22-250 Improved this maybe?

He thought it may have been called a Mashburn.

 

[Frankm]

My Ackley is .455 at the shoulder and 40• so not that.

 

[jasophil1]

I had 22/250 ackley loved it going to build another when i get a reamer.

 

[xswanted]

My Ackley is .455 at the shoulder and 40• so not that.

My current and previous ones are both the same as what you mentioned as well.

 

[Edd]

My dad and I were chatting the other day. He’s had more wildcats than he can remember.

He pulled out an old 22-250 Improved case he used to have a rifle for.

The case has basically no taper in it, measures .460 at the shoulder, has a 30 degree shoulder and is based off of standard 22-250 case.

Today, other than a shorter neck this is basically a 22 Creedmoor.

Those of you that have been around the wildcat block once or twice.......any idea which version of the 22-250 Improved this maybe?

He thought it may have been called a Mashburn.

Not all of the AI cartridges had a 40° shoulder. Could your cartridge possibly have a 28° shoulder instead of a 30°?

 

[SBS]

There have been various shoulder angles on "improved" cartridges in the past. Seems a lot of different opinions on what was best. Most "improved" wildcats these days are the Ackley 40 degree.

 

[xswanted]

Not all of the AI cartridges had a 40° shoulder. Could your cartridge possibly have a 28° shoulder instead of a 30°?

Very well could be.

The shoulder measures .460 though so it was very minimal taper. Pic attached

 

[358WCF]

Ackley settled on the 40* shoulder. If it's not 40*, it's not an Ackley. In the 60s RCBS made a series of improved cartridges that were, I believe, 28* shoulder with minimum body taper. There were numerous others of lesser popularity. ICL, Kilbourn, & Durham come to mind. Just like today anybody with an idea can have a reamer made to their spec.

 

[Edd]

Ackley settled on the 40* shoulder. If it's not 40*, it's not an Ackley. In the 60s RCBS made a series of improved cartridges that were, I believe, 28* shoulder with minimum body taper. There were numerous others of lesser popularity. ICL, Kilbourn, & Durham come to mind. Just like today anybody with an idea can have a reamer made to their spec.

This cartridge has a lot of taper removed but no change in shoulder angle. 28° is the shoulder angle of a SAAMI 22-250.

 

[Frankm]

.460 at the shoulder and 30 degree neck is same as 22 Creedmoor. Might be difference in base to shoulder length.

 

[Tommie]

Straight from the source.

 

[xswanted]

View attachment 1225387
Straight from the source.

Thank you. I’m looking more so for specifics on the width of the case just below the shoulder.

I’m pretty sure this is actually a 28* version I’m looking at but the shoulder is .460 versus .454 on my 40* 22-250AI.

My guess is some one had the reamer made or found it and rolled with it. Might not be anything that existed in mass quantities.

We did find it interesting the case is nearly identical to a Creedmoor though. And this was from a gun my dad had 40 years ago.

 

[redrockranger]

Ackley settled on the 40* shoulder. If it's not 40*, it's not an Ackley. In the 60s RCBS made a series of improved cartridges that were, I believe, 28* shoulder with minimum body taper. There were numerous others of lesser popularity. ICL, Kilbourn, & Durham come to mind. Just like today anybody with an idea can have a reamer made to their spec.

P O Ackley did not improve but a few cartridges. Wildcatters started using his 40* shoulder on other cartridges. Does that make it an Ackley ?

 

[284winner]

My dad and I were chatting the other day. He’s had more wildcats than he can remember.

He pulled out an old 22-250 Improved case he used to have a rifle for.

The case has basically no taper in it, measures .460 at the shoulder, has a 30 degree shoulder and is based off of standard 22-250 case.

Today, other than a shorter neck this is basically a 22 Creedmoor.

Those of you that have been around the wildcat block once or twice.......any idea which version of the 22-250 Improved this maybe?

He thought it may have been called a Mashburn.

It's not a true ackley cartridge. You might be correct because I do remember the Mashburn being of that dimension. My 22-250 AI is a 40° shoulder but it also measures .455 at the top of the case under the shoulder. There are alot of ackley variants but true Ackley's have the 40° shoulder. Your father's is an improved case but not an Ackley improved case.

 

[xswanted]

It's not a true ackley cartridge. You might be correct because I do remember the Mashburn being of that dimension. My 22-250 AI is a 40° shoulder but it also measures .455 at the top of the case under the shoulder. There are alot of ackley variants but true Ackley's have the 40° shoulder. Your father's is an improved case but not an Ackley improved case.

Yep I know it’s not an ackley. I don’t believe I’ve referred to it as such.

Mashburn doesn’t seem right to me either but who knows.

Someone mentioned a Durham earlier I believe and he had brought that name up as well. Might have been just a gunsmith that had a reamer too!

 

[358WCF]

P O Ackley did not improve but a few cartridges. Wildcatters started using his 40* shoulder on other cartridges. Does that make it an Ackley ?

What's in a name? In the purist sense it does not. There were no Creedmoors when Ackley was living to be Ackleyized. There were the 6x250, 6mm International, & 6mm Donaldson International. What's old becomes new again. Using the 40* shoulder on newer cases as a nod to old Parker seems to be accepted & acceptable.

Define "but a few". I have no real inclination to go thru his books to count the cartridges he added his improvement to. I would say more than a few, but again that's rather subjective with a few being, to me, more than 2 (a couple) & less than 12 (a dozen). Maybe "a fair number" would be more accurate. 8=D

 

[284winner]

Yep I know it’s not an ackley. I don’t believe I’ve referred to it as such.

Mashburn doesn’t seem right to me either but who knows.

Someone mentioned a Durham earlier I believe and he had brought that name up as well. Might have been just a gunsmith that had a reamer too!

No wasn't implying you are wrong I just seemed to think that Mashburn sounded like it could be that. I'm probably wrong in reality. Either way, that improved case looks good. Looks like the mini version of a 300NM.

 

[std7mag]

My old school is the parent.
250 Savage.

 

[xswanted]

No wasn't implying you are wrong I just seemed to think that Mashburn sounded like it could be that. I'm probably wrong in reality. Either way, that improved case looks good. Looks like the mini version of a 300NM.

Yep understand!

It looks pretty slick while holding it. If there wasn’t 22 Creedmoor brass out there, I’d have to have on of these.

I don’t know if there’s a way to make a reamer from a case but I think it’d be interesting to try it.

 

[Tommie]

Certainly the 40 degree shoulder became synonymous with “Ackley Improved” but P.O. Ackley definitely designed improved cartridges without a 40 degree shoulder. The .219 Zipper Improved is one example.