Improvements for 2019 Fclass Nationals

[cognac jack]

Hello Everyone, I am not a very eloquent writer so forgive me if I misspell or misuse a word. Saying that, I want to thank the Bald Eagle club for putting on the match and doing a ---very good job---. I think this thread is more about the ---- NRA's help or LACK OF----. I personally feel the NRA doesn't do much for our sport except take our money. We had the nationals at the Whittington Center, ( controlled by them). Did they supply any supplies, spotters, targets, pasters,and at least bottled water? I am assuming they charged to use the range? This is a national event supposedly the top shoot in our country, an event to crown the best shooters in the nation. How do you run out of the size spotters that are needed for that certain yardage, and limit the number of target faces used. I feel a new target face should be used for each shooter, what if he breaks a record and he is the second shooter on that face. Should the NRA be helping in all of these things? I know they cannot literally help but they can help financially. What are they actually doing to help our sport. Again I say this was the ---NATIONALS--- the most prestigious F-Class event in the country. I would think the medals would be the most honored medal to win, and they (NRA) would want them to look like the greatest medal made. Did the NRA supply the medals or tell the hosting club where to get them, and which ones to get, again I say what are they doing for us? Some people think the Southwest Nationals is the most prestigious event in the country but should it be and should the NRA want it to be, it is only a regional event, the Southwest region but it attracts more shooters in a very short time than any other event. In my opinion the ---NATIONALS--- should be the premier shoot in the nation and every part of it should be the best no matter where it is held. Sorry for my long windedness.

 

[Cochran]

So here is what I’ve gathered from everyone. Since the NRA will not step in to run/organize the nationals, it’s up to us. We are going to be able to get out of this match what we put in it. What Matt, Michelle and the rest of the crew at Phoenix are doing is clearly working.

I may be WAY out in left field here but here’s an idea...

What would it take to form a Nationals committee, a group that can essentially help organize the match. The host club obviously would organize the dates, times and facilities. But this group could serve as a liaison between the host club and the shooters/sponsors. Setting standards on what is expected at a national championship. Everything from supplies needed, to doorprizes, to trophies/awards.

I know this sounds like a lot but it is up to us to make this match live up to what it can be. Like others have said above, it’s up to us. I have zero experience running the logistics but I’ve gone out and hustled plenty of good door prizes for various matches in the past so I’d be happy to help that way.

Is this concept something that is even feasible?

We have this already. It’s called the high power committee and it has an f-class representative. The problem is nobody knows who’s on this secret committe that supposedly represents our interest.
Does anyone know who’s on the committee or who the current f-class rep is ?

 

[JeffT]

We have this already. It’s called the high power committee and it has an f-class representative. The problem is nobody knows who’s on this secret committe that supposedly represents our interest.

They are too busy making sure the Rutland Cup match is not classified as a world championship

 

[gilmillan1]

Put money on the prizes. I agree with cody. 50 bucks for a national championship. Come on guys!!! Raise the entries if you have to but dont insult the national champion by giving him 50 bucks.

 

[Cochran]

They are too busy making sure the Rutland Cup match is not classified as a world championship

That falls on ICFRA. I know who the icfra reps are. I’ve spoken briefly with the f-class committee chairman. Waiting on the US f-class Icfra rep to return my email.

 

[Matthew Schwartzkopf]

So here is what I’ve gathered from everyone. Since the NRA will not step in to run/organize the nationals, it’s up to us. We are going to be able to get out of this match what we put in it. What Matt, Michelle and the rest of the crew at Phoenix are doing is clearly working.

I may be WAY out in left field here but here’s an idea...

What would it take to form a Nationals committee, a group that can essentially help organize the match. The host club obviously would organize the dates, times and facilities. But this group could serve as a liaison between the host club and the shooters/sponsors. Setting standards on what is expected at a national championship. Everything from supplies needed, to doorprizes, to trophies/awards.

I know this sounds like a lot but it is up to us to make this match live up to what it can be. Like others have said above, it’s up to us. I have zero experience running the logistics but I’ve gone out and hustled plenty of good door prizes for various matches in the past so I’d be happy to help that way.

Is this concept something that is even feasible?

You know people can hire a newly formed company owned by Michelle and I called Southwest Shooting Solutions. It is a consulting service that works with ranges and clubs providing assistance in Shooting Range Operations, Development and Design as well as match/competitive shoot logistics and operations.

 

[ScottyB]

You know people can hire a newly formed company owned by Michelle and I called Southwest Shooting Solutions. It is a consulting service that works with ranges and clubs providing assistance in Shooting Range Operations, Development and Design as well as match/competitive shoot logistics and operations.

Are you hiring?

 

[memilanuk]

Does anyone know who’s on the committee or who the current f-class rep is ?

I believe Anette Wachter and Ray Gross are on it. If I had to guess, I'd say Ray is probably the F-class guy.

And yes, the complete lack of access to the people actually on the HP committee (unless you happen to know someone) irritates me greatly. As does the lack of any public notification of whats on the agenda for their meetings until *after* it's been decided, the lack of any kind of minutes, annotated change history for the rule books, etc.

 

[JeffT]

I believe Anette Wachter and Ray Gross are on it. If I had to guess, I'd say Ray is probably the F-class guy.

And yes, the complete lack of access to the people actually on the HP committee (unless you happen to know someone) irritates me greatly. As does the lack of any public notification of whats on the agenda for their meetings until *after* it's been decided, the lack of any kind of minutes, annotated change history for the rule books, etc.

Now tha

I believe Anette Wachter and Ray Gross are on it. If I had to guess, I'd say Ray is probably the F-class guy.

And yes, the complete lack of access to the people actually on the HP committee (unless you happen to know someone) irritates me greatly. As does the lack of any public notification of whats on the agenda for their meetings until *after* it's been decided, the lack of any kind of minutes, annotated change history for the rule books, etc.

I would love to comment on this..... but it would only lead to no good

 

[RDA72927]

You know people can hire a newly formed company owned by Michelle and I called Southwest Shooting Solutions. It is a consulting service that works with ranges and clubs providing assistance in Shooting Range Operations, Development and Design as well as match/competitive shoot logistics and operations.

Sound great! Wait, unless your still going to use PractiScore. Then, unsure of that plan...

 

[skibar_tx]

This whole thread needs to be deleted.

 

[Cody Richardson]

This whole thread needs to be deleted.

We’re the fun in that skip! Lol

 

[Cody Richardson]

Now before this does get out of control, What as shooters can we do to continue the nationals for years to come. We all can agree the NRA is not going to help so it’s up to us!

 

[skibar_tx]

Now before this does get out of control, What as shooters can we do to continue the nationals for years to come. We all can agree the NRA is not going to help so it’s up to us!

We have volunteers from the hosts clubs that put the national matches on. They run it like all the other matches they run at those clubs. That is why each and every one of the national championships is a little different. There are only a few venues that can put on a match of this size, or even want to put on a match of this size. The only NRA participation, other than the 6 medals presented to the top three in each class, is having an NRA referee. I am sure he is paid by the club to be there. So, just the fact that the match comes off as well as it does is due to the basic match running skills of the individual club hosting the match.

I know there are things that we, as individuals, would like to see done differently. But having a thread promoting a better match is kind of demeaning to a bunch of folks who volunteered their time and efforts to host and run this match. Hell, this is nothing more than a pissing contest, don't make it sound bigger than it really is.

The folks running the match, from the pit bosses to the stats crew always do their best to be fair to all involved. I think they did a great job, and I am looking forward to next year.

 

[Cody Richardson]

We have volunteers from the hosts clubs that put the national matches on. They run it like all the other matches they run at those clubs. That is why each and every one of the national championships is a little different. There are only a few venues that can put on a match of this size, or even want to put on a match of this size. The only NRA participation, other than the 6 medals presented to the top three in each class, is having an NRA referee. I am sure he is paid by the club to be there. So, just the fact that the match comes off as well as it does is due to the basic match running skills of the individual club hosting the match.

I know there are things that we, as individuals, would like to see done differently. But having a thread promoting a better match is kind of demeaning to a bunch of folks who volunteered their time and efforts to host and run this match. Hell, this is nothing more than a pissing contest, don't make it sound bigger than it really is.

The folks running the match, from the pit bosses to the stats crew always do their best to be fair to all involved. I think they did a great job, and I am looking forward to next year.

I didn’t start this thread to bash the bald eagles crew or any of the voulenteers. I don’t think ANY of our gripes are with the way the match was ran or the staff/voulenteers.
I will say I wasn’t happy with the cancelation of the last matches on the first day but besides that the match was run flawlessly. I would have liked a practice day but it was easier in Lodi due to E-Targets. Pit changes were fast and efficient, pit crew was great. Only complaint with the pits is the sparseness of repair centers. On the line the RO’s were great. Having access to vendors behind the line was a nice change of pace and the food was phenomenal(especially the brisket). Yes, there are things that each of us liked and disliked about thing but our biggest thing is looking for setting a standard for certain aspects of nationals(awards, payouts, prizes). Since the NRA will not set these standards, I think the collective group should establish these standards. You said that each club puts its in twist on the nationals, and in my opinion, it shouldn’t be that way. Regionals and state matches are one thing but it should not be Lodi’s Nationals or Raton’s Nationals, it should be the Nationals.

Again this thread was not meant to bash the host club or voulenteers but to improve this match for the future years.

 

[skibar_tx]

I didn’t start this thread to bash the bald eagles crew or any of the voulenteers. I don’t think ANY of our gripes are with the way the match was ran or the staff/voulenteers.
I will say I wasn’t happy with the cancelation of the last matches on the first day but besides that the match was run flawlessly. I would have liked a practice day but it was easier in Lodi due to E-Targets. Pit changes were fast and efficient, pit crew was great. Only complaint with the pits is the sparseness of repair centers. On the line the RO’s were great. Having access to vendors behind the line was a nice change of pace and the food was phenomenal(especially the brisket). Yes, there are things that each of us liked and disliked about thing but our biggest thing is looking for setting a standard for certain aspects of nationals(awards, payouts, prizes). Since the NRA will not set these standards, I think the collective group should establish these standards. You said that each club puts its in twist on the nationals, and in my opinion, it shouldn’t be that way. Regionals and state matches are one thing but it should not be Lodi’s Nationals or Raton’s Nationals, it should be the Nationals.

Again this thread was not meant to bash the host club or voulenteers but to improve this match for the future years.

So, I take it that next year you will be a volunteer, not a shooter. Good for you. You can make a difference.

 

[Cody Richardson]

So, I take it that next year you will be a volunteer, not a shooter. Good for you. You can make a difference.

None of my points were with the voulenteers or the match crew. I just proposed establishing standards... and yes, I voulenteered at the top of this page to help with door prizes if Steve, I believe was his name, will let me.

 

[skibar_tx]

None of my points were with the voulenteers or the match crew. I just proposed establishing standards... and yes, I voulenteered at the top of this page to help with door prizes if Steve, I believe was his name, will let me.

That is nice. I, like you, would have preferred to keep shooting on the first day of the long range. But I do understand that our targets were getting soggy and warped and that the club did not have the manpower or the target boards to reboard them all that night if it continued to rain. I am pretty sure that if we had a "standard" that the clubs hosting would expect to be able to protect their assets from inclement weather.

These standards you mention, just what would you like standardized? Course of fire? Already standardized. What else? Rules? Already standardized? Just what do you want standardized? Prizes? Really?

 

[Steve 451]

As someone who has put in to host a National event and helped in running the event, yes its a lot of work. Even for a group of people its a lot of work. I start on the prize table 6 months before the match, and Im not the only one doing it. It really is a lot more work than it appears and takes a lot of time/money out of those guy's lives that are helping. That said, you have to expect that when you decide to hold an event like that and you also have the responsibility to do a good job. Theres nothing exclusive about holding a match like this, anyone can step up and start helping. Even something as simple as asking the match director if you can help the prize table by making phone calls for him. One of the things that makes for a strong club is strong people that dont wait to be asked for help. This is not meant as a defense for the guys who ran this match, I was not there, but another way to help it in 2019. It sounds like they could have used a few more guys helping out?

amen

 

[Dos XX]

These standards you mention, just what would you like standardized? Course of fire? Already standardized. What else? Rules? Already standardized? Just what do you want standardized? Prizes? Really?

Pleasure. Standardized pleasure, please.