Your Thoughts 22 Valkyrie vs 6.5 Grendel

[Mark M.]

If there's any real life experience out there with either one of these, what are the advantages or disadvantages, is one better than the other? What are your thoughts? Thanks.

 

[Sniper338]

I have a grendel, no valk yet.. To me, they dont compare because ones a 6.5cal, the other a 22 cal. with heavier bullets the valk will have more range. Im 560+- abouve sea level, my grendels good to about 850 yards, then it gets squirrly. The valk with heavy bullets should get to 1000 easier. imo.

I dont think one is better than the other as Ill end up with both.

The Valk isnt really on the market yet as far as I know.. Most everyone will be full of talk and opinions on the valk because no one has one yet... keep that in mind.

 

[Larryh128]

The big difference that I can see is whether the valk "sticks" won't be known for a few years. The Grendel is here to stay with a good selection of bullets available. If the Valk flops like the 22 Nosler , brass will be gone. No one is going to support a flop. My opinion only, if I want to shoot an eighty grain bullet, the hole in the barrel will be bigger. I see the hype about shooting 1000 yards but seriously doubt you will see any at a 1000 yard competition.

 

[searcher]

Since you posted this in the Varmint & Hunting section, I'd strongly choose the Valkyrie over the Grendel if for no other reasons, reduced recoil to witness impacts, greatly reduced brass cost, availability of "relatively cheap" factory ammo and still being, like the Grendel, a simple barrel/magazine swap if discontinued ammo/brass, change of heart in the caliber, etc. It also has a nice flat trajectory within normal hunting distances. That is all if one is hunting varmints and predators. If I were hunting pigs and/or larger, I'd gravitate to the Grendel.

 

[johnfred1965]

IMHO I find the comparison of the .224 caliber to the .264 caliber pointless. Neck that Grendel down to .224 and see what happens, or neck the valkyrie up. The cases themselves have similar capacities. Otherwise it is apples to oranges. As was mentioned above, the grendel is good for deer and hogs, anything smaller, the 223 rem already covers as far as I can shoot accurately.

 

[searcher]

The Grendel A/R's can lay them in there.

[/IMG]

 

[rebel]

Someone oughta look at what Mr. Coffey is doing with a 22 Grendel at Hawks Ridge. Pretty damn impressive.

 

[Lone Hunter]

The Grendel A/R's can lay them in there.

[/IMG]

Can't see your picture but I agree totally with you. I have a .264LBC / Grendel in a BHW Barrel 20" AR. This thing absolutely amazes me. From 85 gr to 123 gr. this thing is an absolute hammer and a tack driver. I have a Howa Mini Action that shoots pretty good also but I think the AR shoots better. I sure would like to have a 22 Grendel also. Bet that will turn a coyote inside out too. The Grendel with a 123 gr ELD M was used to shoot a bobcat this year. Did a great job. Hope to stretch it out as soon as the groundhogs little ones come out.

 

[FatBoy]

I'm on the fence. I advised a friend against a Valkyrie for the time being. Too many issues with initial Federal factory loads and it looks like JP rifles isn't happy with the chamber/accuracy just yet. I haven't seen anyone post up groups at full speed that are that impressive, and the groups that are decent at at 223 velocity.

I won't neck cases down, as I don't neck turn, but a necked up Valkyrie to 6mm, with a 95gr could be a nice option down the road.

 

[boltfluter]

Just keep in mind that a 95 Sierra will be worthless on small varmints up to and including coyotes. Will just pencil through. So, they drop down to a 60 Vmax. Which isn't really bad. It just brings nothing new to the table. Just food for thought.

Paul

 

[Laurie]

I'm on the fence. I advised a friend against a Valkyrie for the time being. Too many issues with initial Federal factory loads and it looks like JP rifles isn't happy with the chamber/accuracy just yet. I haven't seen anyone post up groups at full speed that are that impressive, and the groups that are decent at at 223 velocity.

I won't neck cases down, as I don't neck turn, but a necked up Valkyrie to 6mm, with a 95gr could be a nice option down the road.

Yes, it's very early days. Many a promising design never takes off for all sorts of reasons. I'm watching it with interest as a maybe future alternative to 223 Rem in longer throat form for 90gn VLDs / the 95gn SMK, but won't even consider making a move until it's a proven performer, bugs sorted, users satisfied with brass strength, quality, availability, etc.

The 6mm Valkyrie would pretty well be the same thing as Robert Whitley's 6mm AR / AR Turbo (necked-down Grendel) I'd imagine, a proven good performer. Again though, we're back to brass strength and quality. Lapua put a lot of effort into making the base 6.5mm Grendel case very strong, and we've yet to see how good a job Federal makes of the .224 and whether any other company picks up on it too.

As we can't have gas-operated ARs and suchlike in the UK, the Grendel has mainly been a bolt-gun number here until now with the accompanying limitations particularly in availability of off the shelf factory offerings. With the Mini-Howa and now the new Cz527 Varmint MTR (Accurate Shooter Bulletin 31st March) available in the Grendel I'm starting to be tempted especially by the CZ.

 

[FatBoy]

No doubt the federal brass will shoots, but will also be very soft. I agree, this is a remixed 6mm AR, but necking up a half a caliber and not needing to turn is more appealing to me, as is having a little extra lug space around the bolt face, though I have never read that being an issue. Of course, if brass lasts 2 firing, then it's not worth the effort.

For now, I am sticking with 77SMKs over a stout load of Varget or RL15 in a LC or Win case... Amazingly enough, the 55gr Midsouth FBHPs shoot very, very well out to 200-250y with Winchester ball powder as well, but you won't be skinning that dog...

 

[Laurie]

Of course, if brass lasts 2 firing, then it's not worth the effort.

Absolutely! It's years since I last used Federal brass in anything and that was mostly 308 Win where factory loads left the primer pockets on the edge of being over-expanded and therefore useless in a single firing. I'd hope that today's cases are harder / stronger, but once bitten etc ........

One other issue here is if I've got it right, the Valkyrie has a large primer case-head as per the Remington 6.8 SPC version (but not Hornady). If so, and unless somebody produces a good SR variant, that'll also tend to make case-head strength / the primer pocket a limiting factor on pressures, even if everything else is optimal. (IIRC, Remington had to rapidly download its 6.8 factory ammo after launching it due to over-pressure problems in this area. I know there were other factors muddying the waters too such as the wrongly specified throat angle increasing pressures, but you've got to wonder ...... )

 

[AndyA]

Factory Valkyrie brass is small primer.

 

[Laurie]

Factory Valkyrie brass is small primer.

Good - that's what I'd assumed / hoped, but was told it was large. (it's surprisingly difficult to tell which is in use looking at the photographs on Accurate Shooter and elsewhere!)

We have one Valkyrie user that I know of in the UK, but he has reformed SPC brass to get shooting as the genuine stuff is unobtainable here as yet. (He is using a straight-pull AR. The 224 Valkyrie is a potentially good choice for that number as we know the parent SPC case extracts sweetly in manual operation whilst the high pressure Grendel was found to give hard extraction unless downloaded so severely that it gave no real benefit over 223s shooting 77s. As these ARs are used in 'Civilian Service Rifle' and similar competitions involving rapid fire, magazine changes, weak shoulder operation and 3-position shooting, hard extraction is toxic as struggling to yank the operating handle back causes so much disruption to shooter position and rifle hold / aim.)